The ULTIMATE Constellation thread

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Oh man, I love this thread so much. Currently trying to find a pie pan Connie in 18k rose for my Mom's birthday. This thread is infinitely invaluable. This certainly is helpful weeding out all the frankenwatches on C24 and eBay. Thanks Vanilla!

You are setting yourself a rather difficult task - rose gold Connies aren't common, no matter which reference, to find a decent one (of any reference) with a good pie-pan dial will be a labour of love.
I hope your mother's birthday is about 5 years away.....

If you like this Constellation thread and haven't found these ones yet - enjoy

https://omegaforums.net/threads/vintage-constellations-show-and-tell.19186/
https://omegaforums.net/threads/show-me-your-167-005-or-168-005-connie.124329/
 
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Hah, you're not kidding, and be ready to open the wallet up. Thanks for those links, I havent stumbled across those yet. I'm not too picky on the specific reference. And actually a little to a lot of patina is preferred over a pristine dial as long as its original. I am currently eye balling this 14381 on c24: https://www.chrono24.com/omega/omega-constellation-ref143812-rose-gold--id30433892.htm Any thoughts?

I think it best to open a new thread for any watches you are looking at as @PlainVanilla 's thread is meant to be a list of Constellations.
However, on this particular watch there are a number of comments:
The case is very well polished
The dial is heavily patinated and very unusual for a 14381.
Shark's tooth indices are uncommon in a 1438, as are 'full-text' dials
plus the mixed Ms - seen on rail track 14381s but I don't think I've ever seen this text on a pie pan dial 14381.
Interesting they don't show the medallion.

The rose gold 18k buckle is a significant bonus but I think it is a later addition

Asking $4,119 - even though it is rose gold, I think this is probably a $2,500 watch
 
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Hello, this is very nice thread, thanks for putting the effort and time on it
Just wondering where would the 368.4152 would fall in the list ? Mine is a French one as the days are in French and also stamped with om Swiss made om an integrated brazalete
Cheers
 
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Hello, this is very nice thread, thanks for putting the effort and time on it
Just wondering where would the 368.4152 would fall in the list ? Mine is a French one as the days are in French and also stamped with om Swiss made om an integrated brazalete
Cheers

Are you sure that is a Constellation reference?
 
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Are you sure that is a Constellation reference?
Hi, not a 100% could be a lemon sold to my grandfather in 1974, here is all I have. Dad pass it on to me couple of months ago
 
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Hi, not a 100% could be a lemon sold to my grandfather in 1974, here is all I have. Dad pass it on to me couple of months ago


Doesn’t look like a lemon to me.
It’s just possible the reference has been incorrectly written down.

These pieces of info might be of interest to -especially the last excerpt discussing integrated bracelets.
Whilst they are an acquired taste these watches have a very special place in horological history. ( to answer your question about where your watch fits in)

 
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Thanks again !
yeah don’t want to sound arrogant, apologies if I did.
don’t know much about it besides the story dad told me when my grand father acquired few watches in mid 70s …. after doing mr google search it wasn’t adding up, that and the need for service brought me to the OF which is proven to be a wealth of knowledge
This information is very much appreciated

Doesn’t look like a lemon to me.
It’s just possible the reference has been incorrectly written down.

These pieces of info might be of interest to -especially the last excerpt discussing integrated bracelets.
Whilst they are an acquired taste these watches have a very special place in horological history. ( to answer your question about where your watch fits in)

 
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I noticed that the bracelet on this watch has different links than the ones in the advertisement and the Omega reference book.

It is possible that that gold bracelet as made under license in either France or Italy for Omega. There should be separate hallmarks on the bracelet for gold content.

This would create a separate reference number for local purposes that would generally not be documented by Omega in Bienne.

You should have the bracelet tested for gold content when you get the watch serviced if you have concerns.
gatorcpa
 
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I noticed that the bracelet on this watch has different links than the ones in the advertisement and the Omega reference book.

It is possible that that gold bracelet as made under license in either France or Italy for Omega. There should be separate hallmarks on the bracelet for gold content.

This would create a separate reference number for local purposes that would generally not be documented by Omega in Bienne.

You should have the bracelet tested for gold content when you get the watch serviced if you have concerns.
gatorcpa


Great eye.
 
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Want to thanks everyone whom supported with different inputs and also a bit of an update for the record keeping you do.
Talked to a few people locally, one was a neighbour whom has a ladies omega (unsure details) and another was a Speedmaster owner…. They both pointed me to the local watchmaker in town…. So decided to give him a visit to have a word, the guy wasn’t like the ones in YouTube videos when it comes to handling with white globes but he was confident and happy to see an vintage movement, seemed confident and hence decided to leave my watch with him for a service.
Here is a picture of the case back and movement
Have a great day
 
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The case and movement are exactly what I expected to see. Omega, 18K gold and correct case reference numbers. The question is whether there are any gold hallmarks on the bracelet.
gatorcpa
 
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Hi @PlainVanilla great thread! I put together Desmond's table and with the crystals and crowns for movement 352 to 565 referenced on the scans on this thread https://omegaforums.net/threads/crown-glass-gasket-list.81619/ and posted it on my forum introduction thread, I hope it can be of use to you:
I do believe there are some typos in the scans and I think the most questionable one is 168.0010/168.010/168.004. 2930 is also in need of verification as on the scans where it should be is labeled 2030, possible typo as well?

By the looks of it majority of Early Constellations used 42019 crown, the Dog leg lugs used 42004, ref.14747, 18747 and 14777 used 42009 and ref. 2737 uses 42018 but that could also be a typo?

What I am trying to figure out for the sake of completeness is ref. 2648 crown, judging from this video
and referencing this post: https://omegaforums.net/threads/vintage-crown-stem-case-tube-size-list.123385/#post-1658884 since the crown is skinny it could be either 32005 or 42004?

does any one have pictures of the other crowns? : 42050, 42055, 43041 and 43048
 
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Not sure whether we should revise the list to indicate that the 1952 2652 was also a first generation Globemaster? It’s essentially a Constellation reference 2652 without the Constellation text on the dial. Here’s mine in gold cap with a two tone crosshair honeycomb dial.
 
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Hi @PlainVanilla great thread! I put together Desmond's table and with the crystals and crowns for movement 352 to 565 referenced on the scans on this thread https://omegaforums.net/threads/crown-glass-gasket-list.81619/ and posted it on my forum introduction thread, I hope it can be of use to you:
I do believe there are some typos in the scans and I think the most questionable one is 168.0010/168.010/168.004. 2930 is also in need of verification as on the scans where it should be is labeled 2030, possible typo as well?

By the looks of it majority of Early Constellations used 42019 crown, the Dog leg lugs used 42004, ref.14747, 18747 and 14777 used 42009 and ref. 2737 uses 42018 but that could also be a typo?

What I am trying to figure out for the sake of completeness is ref. 2648 crown, judging from this video
and referencing this post: https://omegaforums.net/threads/vintage-crown-stem-case-tube-size-list.123385/#post-1658884 since the crown is skinny it could be either 32005 or 42004?

does any one have pictures of the other crowns? : 42050, 42055, 43041 and 43048


Hello @Custodian914

A valiant effort.

I think you have to be clear about what you are listing regarding crowns.
Are you listing original crowns or currently available replacement crowns?

I have only checked a couple of constellations:
14393/14381/14382
14900/14902/168.005/167.005
168.004/168.010

For these you are listing the 'incorrect' (in terms of originality) replacement crowns which are a different style to the original crowns.

If you haven't seen it, you might find Desmond's essay on crowns useful
http://omega-constellation-collectors.blogspot.com/2009/01/omega-constellation-crowning-glories.html

Image from Cousins - replacement crowns- 'incorrect' (in terms of originality)
dogleg

168.010

168.004


14381 etc
 
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Hello @Custodian914

A valiant effort.

I think you have to be clear about what you are listing regarding crowns.
Are you listing original crowns or currently available replacement crowns?

I have only checked a couple of constellations:
14393/14381/14382
14900/14902/168.005/167.005
168.004/168.010

For these you are listing the 'incorrect' (in terms of originality) replacement crowns which are a different style to the original crowns.

If you haven't seen it, you might find Desmond's essay on crowns useful
http://omega-constellation-collectors.blogspot.com/2009/01/omega-constellation-crowning-glories.html

Image from Cousins - replacement crowns- 'incorrect' (in terms of originality)
dogleg

168.010

168.004


14381 etc

My apologies for the incorrect listings, I am still very new to the Omega world and was relying on the part numbers in this post: https://omegaforums.net/threads/crown-glass-gasket-list.81619/#post-1424034 and this thread: https://omegaforums.net/threads/vintage-crown-stem-case-tube-size-list.123385/#post-1658884 . I did read through Desmond's essay and he makes it a point that the original design language calls for decagon crowns, so I did find it strange that the scans in the post lists the original crowns for ref. 2652 to ref. 2988 but then uses the replacement crown numbers for ref. 14381 onward (excluding ref. 14900 that lists crown 42004).

I tried to look up the case tube size for the following: 42050, 42055, 43041 and 43048, the 1st three are 2mm from what I can find but the last I cant find any info on case tube size. Are 42050, 42055 & 43041 the replacements of 42004 or 42009 since they are the same case tube size?
What about 42019 which is 2.5mm case tube?
 
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My apologies for the incorrect listings, I am still very new to the Omega world and was relying on the part numbers in this post: https://omegaforums.net/threads/crown-glass-gasket-list.81619/#post-1424034 and this thread: https://omegaforums.net/threads/vintage-crown-stem-case-tube-size-list.123385/#post-1658884 . I did read through Desmond's essay and he makes it a point that the original design language calls for decagon crowns, so I did find it strange that the scans in the post lists the original crowns for ref. 2652 to ref. 2988 but then uses the replacement crown numbers for ref. 14381 onward (excluding ref. 14900 that lists crown 42004).

I tried to look up the case tube size for the following: 42050, 42055, 43041 and 43048, the 1st three are 2mm from what I can find but the last I cant find any info on case tube size. Are 42050, 42055 & 43041 the replacements of 42004 or 42009 since they are the same case tube size?
What about 42019 which is 2.5mm case tube?


Sorry, without researching it I can't answer all your questions regarding tube sizes.
The replacement crowns are as I note above, the 14381 etc and doglegs have the same replacement crowns

The earlier Constellations do use decagonal crowns but they are the 'fat' versions with the 2.5mm tube, they are used up to and including the 2852.
These are still available, new, from Omega.

From the 14381 etc Constellations swapped over to the 'thin' decagonal crown with the 2mm tube (this is a bit of a simplification as the thin scalloped crown also appears on these references)
These are not still available, new, from Omega and the less attractive (if infinitely more practical) replacement crown was substituted for the decagonal crown.

I don't know what the jumbo references used/use as crowns

The 'hidden crown' Constellations - I include 168.010s, although not strictly fully hidden, are a different story again - but both now use one of two versions of 'expressed' replacement crowns.
 
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Hallo friends of Omega Constellation,
I miss one reference here its the
- Omega 168.7239 with cal 1001
I got it from Norway to where it was shipped in the 70s. It seems to be the predecessor of ref. 168.0055.
Especially I did find several references 4-digit with '7' starting even for well known watches with '0' as first of the 4-digit part.
What are these?
Greetings Konrad

 
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Hi all. Constellation quartz 198.0117 on the way to me. Would be good to add this into to the master list of constellations. I will date the watch once it arrives but assuming c1977. Not much reference to quartz models on OF so would be good to know more about this period of omega history
 
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Friends of Constellations,
I collect 18k Omega Constellations with date!
So I have some thoughts to share on the often double reference markings in the back.

The Omega ref code table says clear,
- the 168.xxx is a 'water resistant chronometer calendar'
- the 166.yyy is only a water resistant calendar.

=> First example, very clear:
The 168.033 / 166.052: (with pictures)
So obviously Omega has double referenced this case back, to use this case as well for the
- ref 168.033 with chronometer movement cal 1001 and dial with '..officially certified' and the
- ref 166.052 with non chronometer movement 1002 with Constellation dial but without 'chronometer off.. cert...'.
Both examples of these watches exist and are easily found in the web.
(Though its odd to use 'Constellation' for a non chronometer, as well as there are 'Seamaster' with chronometer movement.)

=> Second example, with confusion:
The integrated bracelet models 168.047 / 166.059, both references are mostly marked in the back.
The first is the model with a chronometer movement 1001. It exists!
The other is the non chronometer watch with cal 1002. I never saw this!
But: If you search for 168.047, you may find almost none.
If you search for 166.059, you will find several, but all are chronometers with cal 1001.
I did write to some of these offerers, that they chose the wrong ref., a non chronometer ref for a chronometer dial and movement.
But nobody believes me, because when one sheep jumps into the hole, all the others follow, except a very few.
If they would mention both references as is in the back, nothing would be wrong.
And when I make my inquiry:
Omega 168. 18k, I would get them all.
Btw the successor watch with almost the same case and bracelet is ref 168.059 with chronometer cal 1011. I think the second half of the digits .059 is common and causes these above mentioned errors.
Konrad

(old-omegas.com)


First example:


Second example:
Edited: