How important is a great movement in a watch to you?

argonbeam · Jun 17, 2017

Competing for ugly movement crown would be this Scottish-made Timex. Can't find a jewel or even a regulator but that big plate is likely in the way.

That being said, is only about +10 sec/day since I got it and I love wearing it. Will be curious to hear my watchmaker's opinion when I get it serviced.

gatorcpa · Jun 17, 2017

argonbeam
Will be curious to hear my watchmaker's opinion when I get it serviced.

Not sure anyone can service that movement. The plates are soldered in place, I think.

The idea was to replace the movement with a new one if it stopped keeping time.
gatorcpa

argonbeam · Jun 17, 2017

gatorcpa
Not sure anyone can service that movement. The plates are soldered in place, I think.

The idea was to replace the movement with a new one if it stopped keeping time.
gatorcpa

Good call. That never occurred to me but makes sense once you mention it. I'll look a little closer with the loupe.

argonbeam · Jun 22, 2017

gatorcpa
Not sure anyone can service that movement. The plates are soldered in place, I think.

The idea was to replace the movement with a new one if it stopped keeping time.
gatorcpa

My watchmaker says there are 4 screws that hold the whole gamish together. "Very hard to work on. Timex was the worst". Nuff said. In penance for asking him about Timex movements and polluting this thread with pictures thereof, I brought him a '66 Sport Chief to service. "Ah... nice watch. Fun to work with".

valjoux72 · Jun 23, 2017

Well it isn´t all about movements, but I really admire rare and/or nicely finished movements

Sometimes a movement can catch my eyes, even if it is not a big brand...

This beautiful Moeris 13´´´ movement for example ...

O.K. the dial is quite nice too😉. Love the watch, even if it is "only" goldplated...

RonSwanson · Jun 23, 2017

Movement matters to me on a visceral level, as an admiration for the micro engineering and mechanics and craftsmanship is why I am drawn to mechanical watches in the first place. I just recently fondled my first few pateks, some with microrotors, some with complications, all finished to a ridiculous degree. I have to admit, if I ever own one I will look down on my wrist with pride, picturing the hand chamfered brides, polished screws, and Geneva seal finishing. Just as knowing a rotor in your watch is capturing your movement was exciting when you learned about it, knowing the movement is an absolute piece of first-world hand made art is equally exciting.

I would actually like some insight on the inverse. If you do not care about your watches movement, why not wear a quartz, or look at your iPhone?

Matty01 · Jun 24, 2017

Tony C.
Is that a thinly veiled Black Hole joke? 🙄

Only if by way of a seamless segue to a dissertation on the milky way

Matty01 · Jun 24, 2017

Mad Dog
Or...what's under two hoods. 👍

Two hoods, siamese twin?

Oku · Jun 25, 2017

For me, the movement is important. Not because of the finish. A nice finish is a plus. But I think that the movement also represents some kind of value, craftsmanship, effort that was made. Personally, I don't understand why some watches with very common movements like valjoux 7733 become so expensive and better movements can be bought for much less.
Just for illustration: valjoux 7733

vs. Mathey Tissot

gatorcpa · Jun 25, 2017

Oku
Personally, I don't understand why some watches with very common movements like valjoux 7733 become so expensive and better movements can be bought for much less.

Because the name on the dial is "Heuer". I like their styling on vintage watches, but until very recently, they have always been a purchaser of whole movements from others. Maybe they did a tweak or two to the movements.
gatorcpa

GuiltyBoomerang · Jun 25, 2017

Oku
Personally, I don't understand why some watches with very common movements like valjoux 7733 become so expensive and better movements can be bought for much less.

As @gatorcpa point out, anything with a brand name known by the general public tends to stoke the imagination (and the purse strings.) Heuer and Breitling both used 7734/7736 as well as the column wheel 22/72 movements, with a minor amount of decorating in their watches for a period of time. Now that the vintage chronograph market is going up by leaps and bounds, their prices have also grown astronomically as well. The Heuer/Buren/Hamilton collaborations highlight @gatorcpa's point as well.

Back to the original topic...I'd say that the movement is something I prefer to see and savour over the dial sometimes. My ETA 1168 'chronostop' looks good on the dial:

Opening up though, the manufacturer DAMAS have turned this rather plain looking movement:

into this:

That's the sort of thing that brings a smile on my face 😀

Rumar89 · Jun 25, 2017

GuiltyBoomerang
As @gatorcpa point out, anything with a brand name known by the general public tends to stoke the imagination (and the purse strings.) Heuer and Breitling both used 7734/7736 as well as the column wheel 22/72 movements, with a minor amount of decorating in their watches for a period of time. Now that the vintage chronograph market is going up by leaps and bounds, their prices have also grown astronomically as well. The Heuer/Buren/Hamilton collaborations highlight @gatorcpa's point as well.

Back to the original topic...I'd say that the movement is something I prefer to see and savour over the dial sometimes. My ETA 1168 'chronostop' looks good on the dial:

Opening up though, the manufacturer DAMAS have turned this rather plain looking movement:

into this:

That's the sort of thing that brings a smile on my face 😀

I think there is one notable exception to this: Seiko. Despite crafting some truly exceptional watches, the brand's public image is tainted by a perception of cheapness (at least in the US among non-WIS). The fact that they aren't Swiss also likely plays into the lack of regard. It's a real shame, because some of their best offerings are as good, if not better, than anything put out by the Swiss.

GuiltyBoomerang · Jun 25, 2017

Rumar89
I think there is one notable exception to this: Seiko. Despite crafting some truly exceptional watches, the brand's public image is tainted by a perception of cheapness (at least in the US among non-WIS). The fact that they aren't Swiss also likely plays into the lack of regard. It's a real shame, because some of their best offerings are as good, if not better, than anything put out by the Swiss.

True, the 6139 is a prime column wheel movement - and from what I hear, a technical masterpiece that can be tricky to service. They can still be had relatively cheaply, as you say, though the 5717/5719 Olympic timers are far rarer and command a higher premium...though nothing compared to some other brands 😀

Citizen cop some flak too, yet they also had 12 hour counters in their mechanical chronographs of the time...

Riviera Paradise · Jun 25, 2017

Although I do not own anything spectacular in terms of movement finishing (modern Omegas, sports Rolexes, a Breitling and a JLC reverso), I do appreciate the exhibition case back of some of my Omegas, allowing you to see the pretty (industrial) finishing. The Tresor has the most interesting finishing within my collection, but from an aesthetic POV what really makes it standout is the Clous de Paris dial.

IMO seeing the movement does add significant charm to a mechanical watch, but it would not be my first priority choosing a watch, at least within my current collection acquisition range.

From a performance perspective, I do value the accuracy and robustness of the Rolex movements and the efforts Omega have made with anti-magnetic technology. Still, for a basic three hander we all know that a well regulated ETA/Sellita can hold its own. Indeed, I would have no issue purchasing an IWC 3229 powered by a Sellita movement.

Taking this even further: I would actually prefer a 3229 over the new extremely boring 3-hander Ingenieur, even if the new 2017 Ingenieur model sported an in-house movement and exhibition case back as part of the package.

So an exhibition caseback can tip the scales if I have to make a choice between two similar watches, and it did contribute to me choosing the SM300MC vs the Rolex no-date Sub, but it would not necessarily be a high level priority item over other aspects of the overall watch design.

Mad Dog · Jun 25, 2017

Q: "What's that dude in 13B doing?"

A: "Showing us how important the movements of his railroad grade 23j Waltham Vanguard and railroad grade 23j Elgin B. W. Raymond are!"

Good times! 👍 👍 👍

MaiLollo · Jun 26, 2017

A great movement mainly adds value if I can feel it: for instance, I've not felt a big difference between the 321, 861 & 1861 speedys that I have owned (I'm going to get flack for this), but as a guy that does not open his watches and that runs the chronograph from time to time, I just wouldn't know if someone put an 1861 in my Ed White (OK, apart the slower beat rate).
However, there are some movements that I enjoy operating much more than others: the 321, V72s and v222/230/235 that I've experienced are much smoother than a Valjoux 7733 for instance. So, I would pay a premium for a V72 over a 7733 just because I like the feel of the pushers more on the 72.
That being said, I get a kick from knowing that I own a sought-after and respected movement, because I trust people that know better than me 😀

sgrossma · Jun 26, 2017

As long as the watch runs well I am typically happy. I care more about the design and feel of the watch.

Rumar89 · Jun 26, 2017

Since I see @argonbeam dropped a 30L earlier, how about we throw its relative in here.

There is a beautiful austerity to the Longines hand winds of this era. No extraneous finishing, just a great movement. Nice dial too:

Mad Dog · Jul 1, 2017

I just can't explain the serenity I derive from seeing/hearing/smelling the movements of these vintage railroad grade machines...I just can't explain it...and the watch pictured below isn't even worth much money since it's not rare, isn't in very good overall condition, is a recase and has a replacement dial...

18s 21j Illinois A. Lincoln c. 1910...

Oku · Jul 2, 2017

gatorcpa
Because the name on the dial is "Heuer". I like their styling on vintage watches, but until very recently, they have always been a purchaser of whole movements from others. Maybe they did a tweak or two to the movements.
gatorcpa

I also like their styling of dials. But in my eyes it is not worth a premium of several thousand bucks...

You can get so nicely finished movements for less:

How important is a great movement in a watch to you?

argonbeam

gatorcpa

argonbeam

argonbeam

valjoux72

RonSwanson

Matty01

Matty01

Oku

gatorcpa

GuiltyBoomerang

Rumar89

GuiltyBoomerang

Riviera Paradise

Mad Dog

MaiLollo

sgrossma

Rumar89

Mad Dog

Oku

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