Ebay Vintage Omega Seller - Needs Some Help

Archer · Jan 31, 2013

V VintageOmega
There is no average buyer, everybody knows what they are buying

I guess this means if someone buys one of your creations, you are off the hook because everyone knows it's not an original design, right? Looks like a really nice rationalization you have going on there...

Not that I think you will change your ways, but someone else brought up car restoration in this thread. You are not restoring these watches - in car terms what you would be doing would be called a "restomod" because it has features that were not original to the watch.

Since you like to quote Wiki, I'll do the same:

"Restoration is sometimes confused with the term "restomod." A restomod places some portions of the car as they were when the car was first offered for sale, and changes (updates) others. If any part of the car is updated, the car has been "restomodded," and not restored. An "original restoration" puts a car in the same condition as when it was first offered for sale."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_restoration

You keep asking what more could you do? Well, indicate in your listing that this model never existed with the dial shown. That would be truthful.

Cheers, Al

VintageOmega · Jan 31, 2013

Archer
I guess this means if someone buys one of your creations, you are off the hook because everyone knows it's not an original design, right? Looks like a really nice rationalization you have going on there...

Not that I think you will change your ways, but someone else brought up car restoration in this thread. You are not restoring these watches - in car terms what you would be doing would be called a "restomod" because it has features that were not original to the watch.

Since you like to quote Wiki, I'll do the same:

"Restoration is sometimes confused with the term "restomod." A restomod places some portions of the car as they were when the car was first offered for sale, and changes (updates) others. If any part of the car is updated, the car has been "restomodded," and not restored. An "original restoration" puts a car in the same condition as when it was first offered for sale."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_restoration

You keep asking what more could you do? Well, indicate in your listing that this model never existed with the dial shown. That would be truthful.

Cheers, Al

Cheers,

Google definition of refinished dial and you tell me what it means. As stated on the listing dial refinished. But i get you are a die heart Omega collector with 5 Seamasters tight up in your closet. What you know about Omega i already forgot and what you have in your closet most likely needs service and refinishing of a dial, i buy from people like you all day long so i can restore it and sell. It has nothing to do with sellers, buyers, eBay or anybody else. The only person that has a problem with this is you. Market demand for restored vintage watches is thru the roof just look at eBay. So till you stop self hypnosis in this forum, everybody is going to be wrong seller buyer & eBay.

Archer · Jan 31, 2013

V VintageOmega
Cheers,

Google definition of refinished dial and you tell me what it means. As stated on the listing dial refinished. But i get you are a die heart Omega collector with 5 Seamasters tight up in your closet. What you know about Omega i already forgot and what you have in your closet most likely needs service and refinishing of a dial, i buy from people like you all day long so i can restore it and sell. It has nothing to do with sellers, buyers, eBay or anybody else. The only person that has a problem with this is you. Market demand for restored vintage watches is thru the roof just look at eBay. So till you stop self hypnosis in this forum, everybody is going to be wrong seller buyer & eBay.

I know what redial means, and I know a bad redial when I see one, but thanks for posting your examples as they are great illustrations of poor redialing.

I am not an Omega seller or collector, I am a watchmaker (trained by Omega) who sometimes has to break the bad news to my clients that the "9.5/10" Omega they bought on eBay is really not a model that existed, and needs a lot of work and expense to properly restore it to something remotely like original condition. I deal with the fall out from sellers who misrepresent the watches they sell frequently, so you can keep saying "everyone knows what they are buying" but it's garbage, and you know it.

It's pretty clear you were not really looking for help when you posted this in the first post of this thread:

"I had this Omega watch listed on eBay and had it removed by someone reporting that dial has been incorrectly refinished and does not match the case and its none Seamaster. Need some help at this point to better understand the issue"

People here have done nothing but try to help you understand why your listing was pulled and why what you are saying is not representing the true condition of the watches you are selling, but I think you were just fishing hoping to get someone to agree with you.

As I said, not likely you are going to change your ways. I agree there is a healthy market for restored watches - if you were selling those you could really capitalize on that market instead of selling franken watches...

Cheers, Al

Trev · Jan 31, 2013

VintageOmega: Ebay thinks you're wrong, along with every member here. I'm not exactly sure what sort of answers you expected regarding the watches.

Furthermore, your disrespectful attitude is disruptive and ruining the friendly atmosphere we have here at ΩF. Parroting the same arguments is also getting old rather quickly. I think it would be beneficial to not have you posting here.

X350 XJR · Jan 31, 2013

un·scru·pu·lous

/ˌənˈskro͞opyələs/
Adjective
Having or showing no moral principles; not honest or fair.

SpikiSpikester · Jan 31, 2013

It looks like I've missed all the excitement on this thread.

But one thing I should draw to everyone's attention - including the OP if he is interested in his legal position - is that permitting a purchaser to believe they are buying something (such as an Omega Seamaster watch) when the item is an Omega but NOT a Seamaster, constitutes an actionable misrepresentation exposing the seller to remedies including rescission of the contract (I.e. return and refund, with full reimbursement of all postage or other associated costs) or possibly even damages for loss of enjoyment, distress (e.g. Discovery that a treasured gift on a milestone birthday was not what it was supposed to be) and so on, depending on circumstances.

The act of displaying a watch that is marked "Seamaster" is a clear representation. A misrepresentation can then only be avoided if the seller actively states that the watch is not a Seamaster, despite the marking indicating it is.

As I don't practice in the US I can't say what the US legal position is, but on these sorts of issues it is typically based on the same original common law principles.

While the seller is free to transact his business in the way he wants, the law is well developed in dealing with issues of the type described in this thread. From a legal perspective, I'm not at all surprised that eBay were not willing to risk legal exposure by ignoring complaints about a listing exhibiting this type of selling style.

The seller asks what more he could have done. One very obvious thing he could have done would have been to clearly state, in a visible place, that the watch was not a Seamaster model and the Seamaster marking on the dial was incorrect.

The impression of expertise given in a sellers listing very much counts against the seller in these situations as the buyer is entitled to rely on the sellers expertise (which itself is a representation, and may therefore be either true or false), making misrepresentation regarding the item even easier to demonstrate in the event of legal dispute.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Misrepresentation may assist those who are interested to begin further investigation.

...and they say lawyers don't know how to have fun 😀

watchyouwant · Jan 31, 2013

somehow i did not want to participate in this thread, that only wasted cyber bandwidth with old & negative & selfrightious rantings from a new guy. you posted on the wrong forum. here most people try to understand vintage omega and go to great lengths in preserving and restoring. you find a knowledge here, that is ( maybe ) only matched by the old watchrestorers in the factory,in biel. so, we are comparing your power selling ebay niche with this forum and see, that you should not compare apples with oranges. solution: you are on the wrong forum ! you have a legit profit orientated " whatever it takes" view and these guys here do the same, but in the name of originality and provenance. your playing field is par with a few indian re-dialers, who print you any watch you want with every colour, known to man. i`ve seen these decades ago with cheap rolex models and the unfortunate buyers, who did not their homework before buying, tried to sell these strange beasts and everybody was laughing at them. that is your niche. again: all legit in the name of money making. they say: your last shirt has no pockets. but you can wear a watch, my friend ! here it is a bit more about money spending in the name of originality. so, here we are. apples and oranges. maybe you move on. there are other fora in cyberspace with less knowledge. and don`t get me wrong: i`m dealing in vintage watches for nearly 25 years now. have sold ....mhhh..... maybe 25.000 watches? all brands;only vintage. with profits ; with loss. but every single one was a learning curve. and my way leads to the preservation of watches in the name of an amazing achivement of mankind: the mechanical watch. in the end we are only guardians for our items.
your watch got pulled by ebay ? wow, that is an achivement ! their rules are relaxed and you can get away with plenty.... but if you want to know from this forum , why it was pulled, you should be able to listen. not rant in a selfrightious way to defend that bullshit watch. the internet is not about who is right or wrong. there are as many rights and wrong`s, as there are internet users. so, whatever your response will be, i`m not interested in answering. maybe others should do the same and this looooonnnnnnngggggggggggg nonsense thread will die..... kind regards. achim

cicindela · Jan 31, 2013

Gentleman: Please understand, as indicated in Trev's post above, the OP is no longer with us. The thread remains open of course.

alam · Feb 1, 2013

For some reason I get the feeling the OP will not make it to the "Favorite Sellers" list for many of us here....and BTW, as the original title indicates, he does need help 😒

Ebay Vintage Omega Seller - Needs Some Help

Archer

VintageOmega

Archer

Trev

X350 XJR

SpikiSpikester

watchyouwant

cicindela

alam

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