Anyone ever had a (successful) claim with Secursus?

Dan S · Apr 22, 2021

Why is there a need for an insurance company to fall back on such a technicality? Presumably, they can clearly see from the FeDex tracking that the package has been delayed in transit. As noted, this 14-day limit seems designed as a way to get out of paying a legitimate claim. The T&C also seem quite vague. Normally the time interval for making a claim is clearly stated, e.g. after 30 days but before 90 days. In this case, it sounds like one cannot make a claim before 14 days, but one also cannot make a claim after 14 days. When exactly do they want you to file a claim?

WatchCor · Apr 22, 2021

kov
you have to inform them asap that something isn't running as should.

Don't misinterpret me, I sincerely hope that you get your case covered, @Borosilikat .

I've used them a couple time and one time I this exact scenario happened when the parcel hadn't a registered event for over a week (~ day 10 of transit). I was aware the 14 day time limit , so I sent them a mail and they extended the insurance window for four weeks from the day of me contacting them.

Similarly not taking sides and I hope sincerely your parcel is found or you get reimbursed @Borosilikat

Shabbaz · Apr 22, 2021

kov
Certainly not trying to play devils advocate here but my interpretation of this is : when you are shipping a parcel insured via Secursus and something goes wrong, for example :

you have to inform them asap that something isn't running as should.

Don't misinterpret me, I sincerely hope that you get your case covered, @Borosilikat .

Note for myself : rather open a case at Secursus for nothing if a parcel is delayed or the tracking doesn't update as fast as expected, than having to fight with them when it's too late. 🤪

Good note! 😁

I do however think the way the 14 day period is communicated by Secursus is saying something about the nature of this company. I know I am a bit of a left wing insurance company hater but for a normal person it's not logical to start a claim when it's not even sure the package is lost. The same with damage. When a storm is nearby your house you dont call the insurance company to start a claim. You do this when you know for sure your roof is gone.

loniscup · Apr 22, 2021

Shabbaz
When a storm is nearby your house you dont call the insurance company to start a claim. You do this when you know for sure your roof is gone.

But when you ship with an express ("swift") courier, after 2-3 days (EU) and after 5-6 days (international) you must inform them as @WatchCor said because there is a high possibility your roof will fly. I wouldn't sleep at night after that period of time to be honest.

Shabbaz · Apr 22, 2021

loniscup
But when you ship with an express ("swift") courier, after 2-3 days (EU) and after 5-6 days (international) you must inform them as @WatchCor said because there is a high possibility your roof will fly. I wouldn't sleep at night after that period of time to be honest.

So you think it's logical for most people to inform your insurance company after 14 days of shipment? And if they dont the claim gets denied? Is that reasonable? Where does secursus mention the 14 days? Why do they have this in their T&C and not prominent on their website?

jaguar11 · Apr 22, 2021

eugeneandresson
I can't see that in their T&C's.

The way I understand it is, if you sell your Ed White to me, for $5, and you ship it to me, then I am the 'client' and a dated certificate of sale between you and I is all that is needed if the watch does not arrive at my home, as well as the proof that I paid you $5 for it...(edit : naturally all pics and other things...but they don’t care about the history of the watch, ie where you bought it from, it’s just the current transaction) As always, I am happy to stand corrected to all the terms and conditions that may come into effect that I may have overlooked![/QUOTE

You may of course be completely correct in your interpretation but this is what I was advised by them (in a question relation to the shipping of my watch for service). Personally I would rather have some "proof of purchase" and as much other evidence as possible (including an appraisal) rather than argue the toss over this at a later date.

loniscup · Apr 22, 2021

Shabbaz
So you think it's logical for most people to inform your insurance company after 14 days of shipment? And if they dont the claim gets denied? Is that reasonable? Where does secursus mention the 14 days? Why do they have this in their T&C and not prominent on their website?

No it certainly isn't, I am not trying to find excuses for them. To me the most logical "deadline" would be 25-30 days. And they should mention it with Bold at their home page!! The majority of sellers are not familiar with those little details, it is inexcusable not highlighting this very important one. But still I don't find reasonable either to ship using Express service and after 5-6-7...10 days, to act like everything is ok.

Dan S · Apr 22, 2021

Shabbaz
So you think it's logical for most people to inform your insurance company after 14 days of shipment? And if they dont the claim gets denied? Is that reasonable? Where does secursus mention the 14 days? Why do they have this in their T&C and not prominent on their website?

UPS says claims must be filed within 60 days, FedEx within 9 months. In both cases, the earliest a claim may be filed is 24 hours after the expected delivery date.

140dave · Apr 22, 2021

Borosilikat · Apr 22, 2021

To me the only valid reason for even having a clause like the insurance only being valid for 14 days is so you don't for example send something from France to India using snail post and it stops moving and gets lost 20 days after being shipped.

And I reiterate this again

5.1. For Items entrusted to a Carrier, the Parcel Insurance enters into effect at the moment when the insured Items, packaged in accordance with the requirements set out in article 8, are handed over to the Carrier, and ends upon delivery, to the Recipient, against receipt issued by the latter, or, at the latest, 14 (fourteen) days as from the Pick-Up Date, this regardless of the means of transportation.

The item is insured for 14 days so if damage occurs within that time frame as in the item is lost they have to pay.

7.1. The Parcel Insurance only applies to Packages shipped by signed-for delivery service to the Recipient. The Parcel Insurance is effective for 14 (fourteen) days from the initial shipment departure. Make sure you opt for a fairly swift shipment service to ensure the parcel is delivered within that time

This doesn't contradict 5.1 it only reiterates it.

10.3. In case of an Incident, the customer must inform Secursus without delay, and in any case within no more than 3 days from the originally scheduled delivery date, doing so by sending an email to [email protected]. The email must clearly describe the Incident, must have a picture of the Package and of its content prior to shipment, and must have the Carrier tracking number given to Secursus when taking out the Insurance Service.

Why ?

I mean if my house burns down today and it's insured until next week and I make a claim with proof two weeks from now the insurance would have to pay, no ?

The house burned down while it was insured, the package was lost while it was insured.

10.3. In case of an Incident, the customer must inform Secursus without delay

What is an incident ? I mean who would think that you need to inform your insurance company of a package being lost before the carrier considers it lost ? It's totally unreasonable to expect this of people especially when you don't make it prominent on the site, when I called Fedex they told me for the longest time that it's just a routine delay and not to worry.

Does being told by Fedex that your parcel is just delayed due to covid and "not to worry sir it will move again soon" constitute an incident ?

In any event, I sent a strongly worded message to Secursus and they seem to have changed tune saying they are just innocently collecting documents and will forward this to their insurer and that they simple wanted to let me know that obtaining compensation could be complicated.

I assume it was simply a routine attempt to get out of paying on an unenforceable technicality but I remain to stand corrected and if and when Secursus pays out I will let you all know.

I hope I have simply overreacted due to being stressed by the entire situation and Secursus will do the right thing and earn a positive review in the end.

BlackTalon · Apr 22, 2021

The "It's not us, it's those darned insurance providers we use" that gets rolled out every time an incident is reported begins to look pretty bad after multiple experiences are all published in a single thread.

Shabbaz · Apr 22, 2021

Shabbaz
True. The problem is, we only know when something goes terrible wrong.

The reason I was asking about the double insurance. I can insure a shipment within the EU up to eur 5.500 from my local courier. It's the dutch postal office. When they deny my claim I can go to a dutch court and dutch law will be applied. As a lawyer I think that's quite reinsuring. With secursus... well, that will be a different and more complicated story. Where do I go to if they deny my claim and I disagree. So double insurance is a insurance itself against bad behaviour from a foreign insurance company or broker.

I was reading back in the thread about double insurance...

kov · Apr 23, 2021

Dan S
UPS says claims must be filed within 60 days, FedEx within 9 months. In both cases, the earliest a claim may be filed is 24 hours after the expected delivery date.

This as a compliment for above note for myself : When I book a Priority shipping service at Fedex, the expected delivery date is provided and is usually within a couple of days. If, for any reason, 24h after expected delivery date, the parcel is still not with the buyer, file a case with Secursus and preventively request extended coverage. Better safe than sorry.

Shabbaz · Apr 23, 2021

kov
This as a compliment for above note for myself : When I book a Priority shipping service at Fedex, the expected delivery date is provided and is usually within a couple of days. If, for any reason, 24h after expected delivery date, the parcel is still not with the buyer, file a case with Secursus and preventively request extended coverage. Better safe than sorry.

Yes. That's good advice! The fact the shipment is lost or not is not relevant. But according to their website they will only pay out if you provide them with a certificate of loss provided by the carrier.

Lonestar · Apr 23, 2021

Borosilikat
To me the only valid reason for even having a clause like I assume it was simply a routine attempt to get out of paying on an unenforceable technicality but I remain to stand corrected and if and when Secursus pays out I will let you all know.

I hope I have simply overreacted due to being stressed by the entire situation and Secursus will do the right thing and earn a positive review in the end.

And we will all watch this space closely for sure - hope it turns out ok (even if the most ok scenario would be the package re-appearing somehow...) 👍

Lonestar · Apr 23, 2021

Shabbaz
Yes. That's good advice! The fact the shipment is lost or not is not relevant. But according to their website they will only pay out if you provide them with a certificate of loss provided by the carrier.

and indeed the issue is, the shipper usually won't know within "only" 14ds that it's lost for good and not just covid-delayed.

loniscup · Apr 23, 2021

Lonestar
and indeed the issue is, the shipper usually won't know within "only" 14ds that it's lost for good and not just covid-delayed.

About 3 months ago I sent an Eterna movement to France (from Greece) using the same express shipping I use for watches too, meaning it should be there in 1 or 2 days. In the 5th day the package showed it was in France but not delivered. I let UPS know my package is missing and they said they will try to search for it. 10th day still searching for it.. 15th day UPS declared the package lost, they didn't know where it was. I refunded the buyer of course after all that and in the 25th day I got a message that the package was delivered to its destination.
My point is, if you inform them and let them know of the situation and as mentioned before, they indeed extend the waiting period, then the time is enough I think. Always speaking for express courier shipping and not regular "signed for" mail of course.

watchyouwant · Apr 23, 2021

Shabbaz
https://www.secursus.com/terms-and-conditions.php

Article 7 - Approved Carriers and Delivery methods
7.1. The Parcel Insurance only applies to Packages shipped by signed-for delivery service to the Recipient. The Parcel Insurance is effective for 14 (fourteen) days from the initial shipment departure. Make sure you opt for a fairly swift shipment service to ensure the parcel is delivered within that time.

Not correct. you have an column at secursus, where you report a delay. and can do so many times. as long as tracking shows it is still tracked . That should be normal in Covid times. but is not. ebay and paypal have their own shipment timeframe. if that is not met due to shipment problems these days, the buyer can ask and will be granted a chargeback. and you can not even insist on getting your stuff back first to inspect it.... and for the naming of items: postal services like EMS courier take your money as high as you want. if lost, they ask you what was inside. if you mention Watch, they say..... Oppssss, jewellery/Watches are only insured up to US$ 500 something. no matter what you wanted and paid for. Every carrier will wiggle out of any claim, if possible.

eugeneandresson · Apr 23, 2021

jaguar11
You may of course be completely correct in your interpretation but this is what I was advised by them (in a question relation to the shipping of my watch for service). Personally I would rather have some "proof of purchase" and as much other evidence as possible (including an appraisal) rather than argue the toss over this at a later date.

Certainly. But that goes hand in hand with sending a watch in for service, which is a totally different thing to having just sold a watch (where the buyer has already paid you, and you are shipping to him). If you send a watch for service you will not have a sales contract with the recipient at the final destination, you would have not received his money etc...

Shabbaz · Apr 27, 2021

As a left wing insurance company hater I must admit I was wrong (or secursus changed this after this thread). But the 14 days period is mentioned on their homepage...

Anyone ever had a (successful) claim with Secursus?

Dan S

WatchCor

Shabbaz

loniscup

Shabbaz

jaguar11

loniscup

Dan S

140dave

Borosilikat

BlackTalon

Shabbaz

kov

Shabbaz

Lonestar

Lonestar

loniscup

watchyouwant

eugeneandresson

Shabbaz

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