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Stainless sports Rolex dealer stock........

wsfarrell
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@Foo2rama
I agree to disagree.
There may be fewer Subs coming to a store near you, but there are certainly a ton of Subs on the "market." The prices are outrageous, and it's because of speculation, not a shortage. Chrono24 currently lists 449 NEW/UNWORN 116610's on its site. That doesn't seem like a shortage to me.
 
michael22
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wsfarrell wsfarrell
@Foo2rama
I agree to disagree.
There may be fewer Subs coming to a store near you, but there are certainly a ton of Subs on the "market." The prices are outrageous, and it's because of speculation, not a shortage. Chrono24 currently lists 449 NEW/UNWORN 116610's on its site. That doesn't seem like a shortage to me.
That's interesting. 449 sounds like a lot, but is it? How many AD/boutiques are there?
449 may be only one watch per shop, so not a significant amount in some ways.
 
chunkythebulldog
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michael22 michael22
That's interesting. 449 sounds like a lot, but is it? How many AD/boutiques are there?
449 may be only one watch per shop, so not a significant amount in some ways.

Yes but you are making an assumption that everybody that buys a Sub immediately flips it.
What are % of people who buy to wear as against buy to flip?
Nobody knows this so nobody therefore knows if supply has been constrained.
 
larryganz
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chunkythebulldog chunkythebulldog
Yes but you are making an assumption that everybody that buys a Sub immediately flips it.
What are % of people who buy to wear as against buy to flip?
Nobody knows this so nobody therefore knows if supply has been constrained.

Not sure you can make that blanket statement - a lot of people have spoken to their Rolex AD and have been told that they are not getting in the watches like they used to. Some even report that their AD or OB are losing employees since they have so few watches to sell.

I have walked into my Rolex AD a few times (65-70 mile drive to either one) only to find tons of DJ in steel gold or TT with and without diamonds, and a few Oysters or Day/Date, but no Subs, Sea-Dweller, Deep Sea, GMT II, Daytona, Explorer I, but maybe the occasional black dial Exp II is there. I saw one SubC smurf with diamonds in the markers, and one Yachmaster in rose gold and PVD.

So, either they aren't getting the watches like they used to, or the AD is lying to those forum members, or the forum members (me and others) are lying.
 
michael22
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chunkythebulldog chunkythebulldog
Yes but you are making an assumption that everybody that buys a Sub immediately flips it.
What are % of people who buy to wear as against buy to flip?
Nobody knows this so nobody therefore knows if supply has been constrained.
I'm not making any assumption.
I'm simply discussing the significance of 449 watches. Significance changes, depending on perspective.
 
chunkythebulldog
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larryganz larryganz
So, either they aren't getting the watches like they used to, or the AD is lying to those forum members, or the forum members (me and others) are lying.

I'm not accusing anybody of lying. Until exact production numbers are released it's one persons opinion against anothers.
How many people buy watches and never set foot on a watchforum? The vast majority, otherwise OF would have millions of active users. How do you know that the vast majority therefore aren't getting these watches and not flaunting them on OF, Twitter etc?

My Rolex AD has told me he can't meet demand for the St St models, he has never once said that his supply has been cut only that demand has increased.
 
larryganz
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chunkythebulldog chunkythebulldog
I'm not accusing anybody of lying. Until exact production numbers are released it's one persons opinion against anothers.
How many people buy watches and never set foot on a watchforum? The vast majority, otherwise OF would have millions of active users. How do you know that the vast majority therefore aren't getting these watches and not flaunting them on OF, Twitter etc?

My Rolex AD has told me he can't meet demand for the St St models, he has never once said that his supply has been cut only that demand has increased.

Both my AD in Denver told me that they get fewer SS Sport models for the past 2-3 years.
 
S
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My local AD has said they have been getting few SS Sport models. However, I think that they use to ‘direct’ customers to other models in the ‘hope’ that they will get the watch they want. Also, the AD start to have the power to pick and choose who gets what. Thus many watches end up going from the AD to the grey market, through ‘friends’. In many cases people only want to have one ‘good’ watch thus spend limits with an AD are not good. For me it just makes me look to other brands. Hence you will find Tudor sales increasing as they cannot get Rolex. Omega increasing prices, supply and ‘brand’ value to fill the gap. Is it good for market? Who can tell. I cannot see droves of people abandoning Rolex to go elsewhere. Rolex’s marketing machine has been too good at getting us to line up like lemmings.
 
STANDY
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S stuart70
Rolex’s marketing machine has been too good at getting us to line up like lemmings to buy Tudors.

FIFY

With a bit of a marketing background, maybe it has been Rolexes deal all along to push Tudor by slowing the SS Rolex availability 😗
(Not for us people as we are nutters to them and most watch brands, but to the mass market)
 
ac106
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STANDY STANDY
FIFY

With a bit of a marketing background, maybe it has been Rolexes deal all along to push Tudor by slowing the SS Rolex availability 😗
(Not for us people as we are nutters to them and most watch brands, but to the mass market)

Interesting.

Would there be such a demand for the Tudor GMT if you could buy a steel BLRO for retail at any AD you walk in to?

I thought this was a long con to socially engineer their customers to pay 2x-5x retail maybe its to pump Tudor. Or both.

I don't know how one can argue there isn't a constraint. If Rolex wanted to, they could stop producing purple datejusts and diamond set OPs by the thousands and shift those resources toward SS sport models.
 
wsfarrell
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michael22 michael22
That's interesting. 449 sounds like a lot, but is it? How many AD/boutiques are there?
449 may be only one watch per shop, so not a significant amount in some ways.
True enough, but note the chrono24 is ONE online source. There's also eBay, chronext, watchuseek, etc. And take another look at that Hong Kong shop window above.
 
Davidt
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STANDY STANDY
FIFY

With a bit of a marketing background, maybe it has been Rolexes deal all along to push Tudor by slowing the SS Rolex availability 😗
(Not for us people as we are nutters to them and most watch brands, but to the mass market)

I can’t help but look past this.

It must irk Rolex that every man and his dog aspires to buy a Rolex when they ‘make it’ yet the RRP is similar to Omega, when the prestige to the average man in the street is much higher.

Makes perfect sense to acclimatise people to no availability and high grey market prices whilst simultaneously raising rrp to what the market can stomach.

Oh then what’s this coming over the hill? The resurrection of a sister company releasing models similar to those Rolex used to make, at a price point that used to be filled by Rolex itself.
 
wsfarrell
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I think a lot of people are making an assumption that may not be true, and certainly can't be tested. The reasoning is this:
1. Some ADs are getting fewer SS Rolexes.
2. Therefore Rolex is producing fewer SS Rolexes.

How about this instead:
1. Some ADs are getting fewer SS Rolexes.
2. Therefore other ADs are getting more SS Rolexes.
3. These are being sold at RRP+, then immediately flipped at RRP++.
 
Davidt
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wsfarrell wsfarrell
I think a lot of people are making an assumption that may not be true, and certainly can't be tested. The reasoning is this:
1. Some ADs are getting fewer SS Rolexes.
2. Therefore Rolex is producing fewer SS Rolexes.

How about this instead:
1. Some ADs are getting fewer SS Rolexes.
2. Therefore other ADs are getting more SS Rolexes.
3. These are being sold at RRP+, then immediately flipped at RRP++.

I could fully believe that as well.
 
S
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Davidt Davidt
I could fully believe that as well.
Unless Rolex is trying to move the Patek segment. Therefore up prices and drop production however the kicker is fill the gap left in the market by your sister company.
Compare the market strategy to the swatch group that fill all price points with different brands Swatch,Tissot,Longines,Omega,Blancpain .
 
sgrossma
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As the retail-resale price gap widens, at some point Rolex has to ramp up production. There is no reason to lose ever increasing revenue at the expense of building brand value. Especially when there are no real production constraints. It really makes no sense from a business perspective. You have a bunch of people hoarding new watches, forcing people to other brands, losing out on revenue.

The supply should be set just below the demand... maybe 1-2 month wait tops.
 
Foo2rama
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sgrossma sgrossma
As the retail-resale price gap widens, at some point Rolex has to ramp up production. There is no reason to lose ever increasing revenue at the expense of building brand value. Especially when there are no real production constraints. It really makes no sense from a business perspective. You have a bunch of people hoarding new watches, forcing people to other brands, losing out on revenue.

The supply should be set just below the demand... maybe 1-2 month wait tops.
It’s narrowing as seen by all the flippers pieces sitting unsold. If you go back over the past year secondary market prices for subs is dropping
 
sgrossma
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Foo2rama Foo2rama
It’s narrowing as seen by all the flippers pieces sitting unsold. If you go back over the past year secondary market prices for subs is dropping
Really? 114060 and 116610s appear to be steadily rising from what I can see.
 
S
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sgrossma sgrossma
As the retail-resale price gap widens, at some point Rolex has to ramp up production. There is no reason to lose ever increasing revenue at the expense of building brand value. Especially when there are no real production constraints. It really makes no sense from a business perspective. You have a bunch of people hoarding new watches, forcing people to other brands, losing out on revenue.

The supply should be set just below the demand... maybe 1-2 month wait tops.

You have the mistake of thinking that Rolex is a company with share holders - it is not. Rolex has Charitable status - no shareholders to please and I would expect massive reserves. Also a sister company (Tudor) to pick up the slack.
 
sgrossma
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S stuart70
You have the mistake of thinking that Rolex is a company with share holders - it is not. Rolex has Charitable status - no shareholders to please and I would expect massive reserves. Also a sister company (Tudor) to pick up the slack.

I am aware. But even organizations without shareholders still need to make good business decisions.
 
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