Forums Latest Auctions Members

SM 165.024-63 - “hallmark” and thoughts

  1. khanmu

    khanmu Mar 5, 2020

    Posts
    987
    Likes
    7,937
    All

    I know, I know, check first and then buy.... but sometimes in the moment I think you have to take a chance and trust in the “infrastructure” (PayPal, eBay, credit card company) to back you up, and to be fair to Amex they always have..

    Anyway - two questions to our experts here on a recently acquired 165.024-63

    1. Hallmark

    When changing the strap, I saw this little mark between the upper lugs. Has anyone else seen one or know what it is?

    20DC0AD2-EEE3-47B7-9E1B-07A6878D9AB5.jpeg

    2. Any general thoughts on the watch l? My assessment was:

    - Serial nos in the right range
    - Not the first thin font bezel, but the one fitted came out in 1964 so probably within tolerances
    - correct crystal with omega logo
    - crown - correct type but maybe a service one - should it have the “Mercedes” symbol in the middle?
    - hour and minute hand probably relumed at some point
    - dial looks nice - gilt I think and no “T”s - could possibly be a relume but nicely done if so
    - double bevel caseback

    Photos below - and I’d welcome any comments or thoughts - extract ordered so will post the details when it arrives.

    Thanks in advance

    7A78CF6A-2C5E-4C5E-B3A2-09F07C3138E4.jpeg



    C2519CB4-3499-4E0C-8370-FBBF7146DA78.jpeg
    38326967-7E7A-4840-B157-F6E0E2B70C0F.jpeg
    1DFE3175-3310-4338-B53F-1B587F778A17.jpeg
    D45FAD38-C566-4F20-BA1A-104E97944790.jpeg
    BA5F6FA9-3CD2-41FC-B05B-7757BE0AF711.jpeg
    023BCB43-27A5-4036-B2E0-E99C3F2B7736.jpeg
    4A1A89A8-57D9-4F5E-BF58-0E91933ED783.jpeg
     
    733E33AA-C7CC-4710-A427-7F72464B3D53.jpeg
  2. Cuttysark

    Cuttysark Mar 5, 2020

    Posts
    576
    Likes
    1,781
    Really nice watch!
    Never seen the hallmark you posted..
    The tritium on the dial seems to be original.
    The dial is good for the reference. Gilt numbers and no Ts.
    The original crown would be without Mercedes. It's easy and not so expensive to find an original one. Check on Ebay.
    I attach a pic of the original crown.
    The second hand is correct for the early reference. This type of hand was on some 14755s, on all 165014 and the early (until 24 mil. circa) 165.024s.
    Maybe the hour and minute hands relumed? I'm not sure.. I've seen on some Seamaster 300 the different color beetween hands and dial. And they were not relumed. You need a UV lamp to tell if the eventual relume was done in recent time with glowing paste.
    Nice case. Looks unpolished and in very good conditions.
    https://omegaforums.net/data/attachments/893/893759-76b249b6941fa4daae671d3a16507d2b.jpg
     
  3. khanmu

    khanmu Mar 5, 2020

    Posts
    987
    Likes
    7,937
    Thank you - that’s really helpful. The seller said the watch had been in a drawer for a number of years and hadn’t been touched in a while - the photo shows some gasket melt. So I suspect the hour and minute hand were relumed in the past and the crown changed. I’ll look for an original crown and ask my watchmaker to fit one when he services the watch.
     
    Cuttysark likes this.
  4. JanV

    JanV Mar 5, 2020

    Posts
    811
    Likes
    2,134
    This 165024-63 reference is really an interesting one indeed. I’ve seen a lot of these (at least 4 pieces) -63’s with this bezel but without gilt numbers, with T Swiss Made T markings, with 165024-63 markings inside the case back, and with 22.9xx and 23.000 serials and confirmed eoa’s for 165024. So somehow this reference has been made in at least two batches, with some time in between. Anyone else here knowing anything about this? Mine says hi.

    Btw, are the hands on OP’s watch straight without curvature, can’t really tell so good from these pictures. If so, they could be service ones from the seventies, at maybe the same era when this greenish lume started popping up on the military dials?
     
    481516CF-E232-4BC3-B13A-CED37E4D5575.jpeg
  5. khanmu

    khanmu Mar 5, 2020

    Posts
    987
    Likes
    7,937
    I wonder if they made the first batch, waited to see how successful it would be, then made adjustments for the second batch - materials, specs, perhaps suppliers etc - I think it’s a common manufacturing practice for new product launches...
     
    JanV likes this.
  6. Baz9614

    Baz9614 Mar 5, 2020

    Posts
    1,786
    Likes
    17,796
    Interesting Hallmark!! I checked my BT but nothing :(
     
  7. JanV

    JanV Mar 5, 2020

    Posts
    811
    Likes
    2,134
    Could sound like a feasible thing, would be interesting to hear from @kox what information their research has got them.
     
  8. kox

    kox Mar 5, 2020

    Posts
    539
    Likes
    2,367
    @JanV, are you absolutely sure the ones you have seen are subreference -63's and not -64's? If you have any -63´s with those parts in the 229x or 230x range I would really like to see them.

    As I recall it your example above is a 165.024-64....right ? ;)
     
    TexOmega and JanV like this.
  9. JanV

    JanV Mar 5, 2020

    Posts
    811
    Likes
    2,134
    Oh man, am i getting senile or what, even if i’m not even that close to 50 yet... You are just so right, mine is a -64 god damnit. :) What was i thinking, and yes, all the other ones i was referring to where -64’s as well.
     
  10. kox

    kox Mar 5, 2020

    Posts
    539
    Likes
    2,367
    :D
     
    ConElPueblo, Dash1 and omegastar like this.
  11. JanV

    JanV Mar 5, 2020

    Posts
    811
    Likes
    2,134
    Would the a B2 bezel then be considered correct for a -63, should not this one have the first edition bezel? Just thinking out loud...
     
  12. kox

    kox Mar 5, 2020

    Posts
    539
    Likes
    2,367
    Depends on the production date, but I guess the OP's would be a spring 64 production....so yes, it should have the B1 bezel and not the B2 .... IMO
     
    sdre likes this.
  13. Foo2rama

    Foo2rama Keeps his worms in a ball instead of a can. Mar 5, 2020

    Posts
    12,271
    Likes
    16,828
    That dial.....
     
    JanV likes this.
  14. JanV

    JanV Mar 6, 2020

    Posts
    811
    Likes
    2,134
    This teaches me not to respond to OF questions during work, and to get my mind in order first prior to responding. :whistling:
     
    khanmu likes this.
  15. tamura

    tamura Mar 6, 2020

    Posts
    513
    Likes
    1,485
    Baz9614 and omegastar like this.
  16. Baz9614

    Baz9614 Mar 6, 2020

    Posts
    1,786
    Likes
    17,796
  17. khanmu

    khanmu Mar 6, 2020

    Posts
    987
    Likes
    7,937
    Interesting - at first I wondered if it might be an owners mark, but now I think it might be either a makers mark or an indication that the case (and the buckle example) are made from “base metal” to differentiate from silver or white gold. Or of course it’s a fake case...Will have to see what the extract says!
     
    Baz9614 likes this.
  18. cristos71

    cristos71 Mar 6, 2020

    Posts
    5,201
    Likes
    22,642
    Don't worry you're not the only one, @kox knows more about my 300's than I do too :D
     
    Mark020 and JanV like this.
  19. zoohannover

    zoohannover Mar 6, 2020

    Posts
    231
    Likes
    1,160
    Edited Mar 6, 2020
  20. omegaman

    omegaman Mar 6, 2020

    Posts
    215
    Likes
    305
    Nice looking example, I like that gilted dial. As others said before, bezel should rather be a B1 and the hour and minute hand seems to be relumed. Nothing to worry about FMPOV. And good catch with that case marking!
     
    khanmu likes this.