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  1. sheepdoll Jul 25, 2022

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    This was another priority watch. A HeUer before they merged with Tag. Not sure if there is a way to clean the rust off the dial. I am told tea works (tannic acid.) The trick would be not to remove any of the other markings. I am open to suggestions.

    This is also missing the besel and the back not to mention the crystal. IMG_3273.png

    The movement is so so. I have seen a few you tube videos showing simular watches restored, so am feeling a bit inspired. A lot of the reason I am getting the cleaner working again.
    IMG_3276.png
     
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  2. TexOmega Jul 25, 2022

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    You experiment and keep good notes and report back your findings with many cool pictures all along the way.

    I would like to learn.:coffee:
     
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  3. watchyouwant ΩF Clairvoyant Jul 25, 2022

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    You are a brave person. With that rust on the dial, I'd wonder, where it came from.... Maybe the dial side of your movement?
     
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  4. sheepdoll Jul 25, 2022

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    My guess another movement was stacked on top of it. could also have leaked in from the crown. Most of these watches came from the DWC (dead watchmaker corp.) The dealers would cherry pick the rollexes (but not always the older or american cased Omegas.) Then put the boxed lot up on the mart as silent auction. They would usually go for between 5 and 25USD as no one else was really interested.
    -j
     
  5. KLXN Jul 26, 2022

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    What a great find. I would be too afraid of losing printing from the dial to do anything about the rust there. However, I don't know if it won't get worse if nothing is done about the dial.

    I have a watch with a similarly rusted movement, but I'm stuck on step 1 of cleaning it as I couldn't take the stem out and couldn't use too much cleaning products on the movement to not damage the dial.
    I'm very curious to see how you will move forward with that project.
     
  6. sheepdoll Aug 13, 2022

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    No additional photographs, but I thought I would bump this. (taking a break from what I should be doing.)

    This style watch keeps coming up in my parts searches, with some ridiculous prices.

    From what I can tell this rusted movement is the desirable valjoux 72 movement. So parts are available from the usual gray market sources. Even better is I have a bulova valjoux 23 movement with a trashed dial, which I though was another landeron 48. (I have a lot of those)

    Downside is that I can not find the case back. I would have set any Heuer backs aside, as this brand was making a comeback in the 1990s. This watch would however look great with a display back. So I will be wanting to keep an eye out for that sort of thing. (at a reasonable price.)

    I did find a bezel, that looks like it might fit. The crystal on that bezel is crazed/cracked and looks like it might have rust residue.

    The winding stem works in the reverse direction and I can hear the ratchet click. The spring and click may be rusted. One of the dial dogs is rusted, so I will need to remove most of the chrono and what I can access from the back. I suspect the motion works to be rusted up. I do not have much hope for the seconds whee arbor, although the rust blob could be what is left of the hand.

    I should have some Kano Sili-kroil. (Need to find a source for more of that.) I also bought a can of evapo-rust. I can let soak som of this into the stem area, and the damaged dial dog, while I work on the other watches. I can then try the black tea method followed by the evapo-rust to stabilize the cleaned metal.

    The dial is not all that bad. There is no evidence of lume on the dial, Which has nice reflectivity under bright light. A lot of the scale markers are still there, but faint. I like how the You-tubber who refers to such dials as being made from butterfly wings. I do not think it will be possible to remove the rust staining without damaging what is left of the dial.

    I guess the real question is what style hands should I start looking for? I have not seen too many triple register Heuer examples with a black dial and a spiral tachometer scale.

    -j
     
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  7. noelekal Home For Wayward Watches Aug 13, 2022

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    I was going to recommend Kroil, but would ne concerned with how it would treat dial markings.

    You go with the project and please report on your project.
     
  8. sheepdoll Aug 31, 2022

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    IMG_2014 copy.png IMG_2015 copy.png

    I put some sili-Kroil into a solder paste syringe. (These are also sold by material houses such as Esslinger.) This way I could put a few drops on some screws. I did this on one of the Landeron 48 movements. I also though to let it soak into this movement.

    The seconds dial seems to have taken the most hit with the rust. So I went to put a drop on the pivot (which is still there, I think the rust is what is left of the hands.) Of course as luck would have it the applicator dripped on top of the hour register. I quickly dabbed it with some tissue and rodico. Fortunately it did not stain the dial. It may have even helped a bit as the rodico picked up some of the loose rust. I also wiped it with some isopropolol and a distilled water rinse, the results which can be seen. Only the area between 6 o'clock and 10 o'clock were treated. (the camera has a hard time auto focusing on dials.)

    I have not attempted to see if I can loosen any of the screws yet as I am sorting through the Landeron parts first. I have 7 or 8 landerons but this is the only Valjoux 72 I have. (note the distance on the pushers.) I also found a Valjoux 23 case, which may fit the Bulova movement (that I might use for parts to get this back together. Have yet to find a Bulova marked back to fit that case. More concerning is what happened to the engraved back that came with my speedmaster?

    Now if only I could find the case back for this Heuer. I did find a Delbana back for one of the Landerons. What I really want for this is a display back as the results could be quite interesting once the parts are de-rusted.

    -j

    Edit: I went back and read the first post. I think I found the bezel and crystal. (which would imply the thing was indeed filled with water at one time as the rust stain on the crystal seems to follow the rust on the dial)
     
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  9. sheepdoll Sep 9, 2022

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    Taking a break from my Landeron 48 while it ticks away, (for the most part.)

    The Kano Sili-Kroil was a success. I safely got the dial off and the stem and crown out as a whole piece. Surprisingly not rusted. I put the parts under the microscope. The motion works is still seized. Some of the rusted screws will not budge. I have been using a watch oilier to drip Kroil on them.

    The hammer took the worst of the damage and is locked in place. Hand stems are present and accounted for.
    No rust on the back of the dial, so the rust spots probably are the hands I took some photographs through the microscope. Makes things look better in places than when looking at it by eye.

    I should probably join the TagHeuer forum. There are no marks or serial numbers on the movement. I got as far as learning this was not uncommon for Heuers of this age. The question will be is what should the hands look like. It is hard to find images of other Heuer's with the spiral dial marking.

    Photographs rather than words this evening.
    -j

    IMG_3409.png IMG_3410.png 2022-09-09 16:11:12 -0700.png 2022-09-09 16:13:11 -0700.png 2022-09-09 16:14:45 -0700.png 2022-09-09 16:08:31 -0700.png
     
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  10. Davidt Sep 10, 2022

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    Thanks for posting, really interesting.
    Looking forward to seeing your progress.
     
  11. Davidt Sep 10, 2022

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    Hands perhaps like this?

    280F6A2B-0D1F-4277-9D40-0F0AF95A5248.png
     
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  12. WilyB Sep 11, 2022

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    [​IMG]

    This is a circa 1940 Heuer 36mm (w/o crown) with a Valjoux 71.
     
    Edited Sep 11, 2022
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  13. sheepdoll Oct 4, 2022

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    IMG_3477.png
    I posted this to the springs chat over the weekend. Thought I would add it here as well. The kano sili-Kroil allowed me to loosen a few more parts. Unforntunatly the seconds wheel #225 was rusted and snapped when I touched it. (I have a donor V23 movement to work with. visible on the right.) I can loosen the wheel train bridge, but not the balance bridge. Would like to get the balance out, It may still be good as it does turn stiffly. I did get a new staff anyway. Mostly this area of the watch looks more dirty than rusty.

    The rest of the parts in the photo are the landeron parts I got on eBay or other spares. I keep excising great fortitude (and a blown watch parts budget.) to not rush and purchase expensive valjoux parts until I know exactly what I need. New parts would be used to restore the donor movement If I can get this working.

    -j
     
  14. Canuck Oct 5, 2022

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    To cannibalize an equivalent movement that is in better condition for the parts required to resuscitate the rusted hulk, would not make sense (to me)! To me, it would make better sense to service the donor movement and use that, rather than this mess.
     
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  15. sheepdoll Oct 5, 2022

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    The movement is a valjoux 72 with a decent dial. the donor is a valjoux 23 base caliber with a totally trashed dial. Mostly the parts involved are the setting parts and the wheel train parts. Eventually the donor will probably also be restored depending on costs.
    My interest and motivation is seeing if the watch is salvageable at all.
    -j
     
  16. Syrte MWR Tech Support Dept Oct 5, 2022

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    You sure like a challenge :confused:
     
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  17. sheepdoll Oct 7, 2022

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    IMG_3499.png
    Tonight's progress. Finally got the balance bridge screw loose. Now I can get to the pallet fork screw.
    It is interesting how the rust splotches in localized places. I am able to loosen the bridge screws. The return spring screws do not want to shift. May have to pull the bridge plates in order to get the kroil onto the lower part of the screw.
    The balance does not look too bad. I got a new staff. Some staffing practice is probably not a bad thing.
    -j
     
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  18. noelekal Home For Wayward Watches Oct 7, 2022

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    I don't know.

    I'm scared after seeing that last photo you posted.
     
  19. MoclovFlop Do the Electric Boogaloo. Oct 7, 2022

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    Just a heads up, that movement actually looks like a Valjoux 71, so equivalent parts would need to come from the Valjoux 22. I'm not sure how much cross over there is between 71/72 and 22/23, but don't be surprised if you aren't able to share most of the parts.

    But good luck, i've seen worse come back form the dead. Anything is possible with time and money.
     
  20. sheepdoll Oct 7, 2022

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    Yeah I have been wondering if this is actually a V71. The base plate does seem to be 13L. V71 is 14L. The other issue is my esembl-O-Graph books have two Valjoux 23 variations old and new. Part 8080 wraps differently. This is the old variation. The other differences are the dial separators. On most refs this is a bridge. on this watch they are screws.
    I have also noticed similar variations in the now 9 Landerons I have. Revisions seem to be quite commonplace. The old chronograph text books have a lot on adjustments.
    Curiously I have 3 Valjoux 321.8219 hammers, which seem to be for a stopwatch caliber. It is also interesting is that 8219 and 8220 are both hammer part numbers. At one point I thought this was the difference between cam an pillar variations.
    Time I have, money not so much. Especially after my e-bay and goodwill binges. 3 Landeron 48.225 seconds wheels arrived yesterday. I only need one, but the price was right and the seller had 3. One to use one to loose, and one for the spare parts bin.
    -j
    Edit: confirmed this is a V72 early model.
     
    Edited Oct 9, 2022
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