Procrastination, Depression, Paralysis - A Turning Point

GuiltyBoomerang · Jun 5, 2018

Hi Larry,

I am upping the dose as part of the doctor's request, in order to judge how I feel based on dosage. I need to gauge the effects of one tablet (yesterday,) two tablets (today) and possibly three tablets tomorrow if today there are no ill effects. If I feel vastly better at a lower dose then there is no need of course, so this is a trial period to find the right amount and when.

Just took two tablets about 15 minutes ago and that...odd mind numbing/sleepiness effect has kicked in like it did yesterday, so I will monitor how I am once the drug has passed through the system (about 45-60 minutes.)

Larry S · Jun 6, 2018

I've raised a kid with severe ADHD,,,Work with your Psychiatrist to settle on the regime that works for you. There are many drugs on the market for this condition. My son after years of trying different therapy's is having good success with Quillivant at present. His doctor, also an ADHD patient, uses it himself. The other challenge at least in the US is finding a sympathetic pharmacy to keep these treatments in stock as they are schedule drugs and subject to abuse..... Make sure you allow plenty of lead-time to re-fill your meds.

GuiltyBoomerang · Jun 6, 2018

Hi @Larry S,

Yes I will bear those thoughts in mind. As a stimulant, I found that taking three today (what my psychiatrist asked me to get to) incurred not much of a tiredness factor after 15 minutes. I found that odd since on one tablet it was a struggle for the first hour and half, where as on three tablets I am very alert and awake. My procrastination it seems will need to be worked on as part of CBT/Counselling rather than being taken care of by meds.

The meds have helped in:

*initiating and engaging in conversation, and keeping eye focus. On one tablet I was somewhat slow and really taking time to talk, where as on three today talking is almost the same however my thoughts seem clearer to an extent and I could still pause.

*anger management: I used to get very upset about being asked to do tasks, especially with my parents. Over the last couple of days, my conversations and interactions with my peers/children (clients) and family have been quite pleasant. While I do have some random thoughts I have been talking rather than grunting/complaining etc.

*overall focus: While I can still get drawn into doing something interesting at the expense of other things, that ability to realise "Ah I should really be doing this now" and "If I do this it will be good for me" is slowly developing. I still need some willpower however I have noticed that mundane tasks which I used to put off (showering/cleaning dishes/washing clothes) don't require much force to do and sometimes I just see it and do it. That "flow" of getting things done seems to be appearing more often.

It will be a tough journey, however each journey starts with a single step.

larryganz · Jun 6, 2018

GuiltyBoomerang
Hi Larry,

I am upping the dose as part of the doctor's request, in order to judge how I feel based on dosage. I need to gauge the effects of one tablet (yesterday,) two tablets (today) and possibly three tablets tomorrow if today there are no ill effects. If I feel vastly better at a lower dose then there is no need of course, so this is a trial period to find the right amount and when.

Just took two tablets about 15 minutes ago and that...odd mind numbing/sleepiness effect has kicked in like it did yesterday, so I will monitor how I am once the drug has passed through the system (about 45-60 minutes.)

I never had a patient with ADD or ADHD complain of the mind numbing effect, although they might complain about being over-focused and unproductive if old enough to describe the effect, or if too young then the parent would complain their child was "zombified".

Either way, it always had us concerned about being over-medicated, and I was always cautious about how quickly we would titrate the dose.

Fortunately the medication is short lived, and the dose you take one day has no effect on the effects the next day, so changing the dose each day with give a different result each day.

larryganz · Jun 6, 2018

GuiltyBoomerang
Hi @Larry S,

Yes I will bear those thoughts in mind. As a stimulant, I found that taking three today (what my psychiatrist asked me to get to) incurred not much of a tiredness factor after 15 minutes. I found that odd since on one tablet it was a struggle for the first hour and half, where as on three tablets I am very alert and awake. My procrastination it seems will need to be worked on as part of CBT/Counselling rather than being taken care of by meds.

The meds have helped in:

*initiating and engaging in conversation, and keeping eye focus. On one tablet I was somewhat slow and really taking time to talk, where as on three today talking is almost the same however my thoughts seem clearer to an extent and I could still pause.

*anger management: I used to get very upset about being asked to do tasks, especially with my parents. Over the last couple of days, my conversations and interactions with my peers/children (clients) and family have been quite pleasant. While I do have some random thoughts I have been talking rather than grunting/complaining etc.

*overall focus: While I can still get drawn into doing something interesting at the expense of other things, that ability to realise "Ah I should really be doing this now" and "If I do this it will be good for me" is slowly developing. I still need some willpower however I have noticed that mundane tasks which I used to put off (showering/cleaning dishes/washing clothes) don't require much force to do and sometimes I just see it and do it. That "flow" of getting things done seems to be appearing more often.

It will be a tough journey, however each journey starts with a single step.

Glad it is helping. I haven't treated Adult ADHD, but have a 20 year old son with it and a 22 year old daughter with it. Both have become over-focused and unproductive when they grew out of a dose and needed it reduced, but a consequence of the ADD med reduction was an increase in anxiety. It's not a perfect world.

GuiltyBoomerang · Jun 6, 2018

larryganz
I never had a patient with ADD or ADHD complain of the mind numbing effect, although they might complain about being over-focused and unproductive if old enough to describe the effect, or if too young then the parent would complain their child was "zombified".

I might need to look into that, since on one tablet I definitely had a slow down and today on three it's almost as though I can comprehend everything and I'm typing like the non-medicated me would and yes possibly being overfocused. Hmm.

larryganz · Jun 6, 2018

GuiltyBoomerang
I might need to look into that, since on one tablet I definitely had a slow down and today on three it's almost as though I can comprehend everything and I'm typing like the non-medicated me would and yes possibly being overfocused. Hmm.

Overfocused might have you sitting at your computer and you have to write a paper, but you stare at the screen and are thinking about why the retina display fools you into not seeing individual pixels, and how close do you have to get to see pixels, and do you need to turn up the brightness to see them or squint your eyes, and 15 minutes later realize you haven't started typing your paper yet.

GuiltyBoomerang · Jun 6, 2018

larryganz
Overfocused might have you sitting at your computer and you have to write a paper, but you stare at the screen and are thinking about why the retina display fools you into not seeing individual pixels, and how close do you have to get to see pixels, and do you need to turn up the brightness to see them or squint your eyes, and 15 minutes later realize you haven't started typing your paper yet.

Oh wow. Now that is something that hasn't happened yet, the unproductiveness I'm now is of the being hyperfocused on non essential tasks of I'm given the opportunity. That said...it also does feel like I'm telling the truth more often, and not not avoiding saying something because of the fear of what might happen.

larryganz · Jun 7, 2018

GuiltyBoomerang
Oh wow. Now that is something that hasn't happened yet, the unproductiveness I'm now is of the being hyperfocused on non essential tasks of I'm given the opportunity. That said...it also does feel like I'm telling the truth more often, and not not avoiding saying something because of the fear of what might happen.

I described a non-essential task above.

How about this. So, you should be writing a paper for school, but instead you're stuck trying to get your Starbucks account set up so you can pay with your phone, but the credit card you're using isn't being accepted, and you try another and it doesn't work and you try another. But instead of going back to do this later you hop in your car to go to Starbucks and buy a gift card so you can add the gift card to your account so that you'll have money in your account to pay with your phone app, and now your paper hasn't even been started yet and it's past your bedtime.

GuiltyBoomerang · Jun 7, 2018

larryganz
I described a non-essential task above.

How about this. So, you should be writing a paper for school, but instead you're stuck trying to get your Starbucks account set up so you can pay with your phone, but the credit card you're using isn't being accepted, and you try another and it doesn't work and you try another. But instead of going back to do this later you hop in your car to go to Starbucks and buy a gift card so you can add the gift card to your account so that you'll have money in your account to pay with your phone app, and now your paper hasn't even been started yet and it's past your bedtime.

Ah in that case. I experienced that today.

I had driven some children as part of my work and returned to my car. I needed to return to perform some activities. I spent the next hour or so trying to figure out how to create a US eBay account to use a discount coupon, trying to setup a US PayPal account, trying to create a US phone number...before I knew it close to two hours had gone by and I called my workplace to let them know I was returning.

Perhaps one tablet might be for the best.

Larry S · Jun 7, 2018

larryganz
I never had a patient with ADD or ADHD complain of the mind numbing effect, although they might complain about being over-focused and unproductive if old enough to describe the effect, or if too young then the parent would complain their child was "zombified".

Either way, it always had us concerned about being over-medicated, and I was always cautious about how quickly we would titrate the dose.

Fortunately the medication is short lived, and the dose you take one day has no effect on the effects the next day, so changing the dose each day with give a different result each day.

My son often mentions that he feels like he missed out on social interaction as a child particularly HS because the meds turned him into a “robot”.

GuiltyBoomerang · Jun 7, 2018

Larry S
My son often mentions that he feels like he missed out on social interaction as a child particularly HS because the meds turned him into a “robot”.

Ah, that's never a great thing to know. Your son is very courageous in saying that sort of thing, and full credit goes to him for his perseverance.

Well I can say that on three tablets - driving felt like I was on rails. I was a bit more euphoric as well. While my mind wasn't racing, my tendency to be distracted was slightly higher than the last couple of days, and body heat was warm. As well, while I didn't rush my conversations, there were a couple of instances where my old overexhuberance showed. I did write a list of things to do and have gotten a fair few of them, though do concede that not all of them will get done today however they will be by the end of the week.

Will be on one tablet tomorrow as three, while getting me super alert, seems to be a bit too alert.

gostang9 · Jun 7, 2018

Fascinating conversation and I'm impressed by the openness on a public forum.

I have a nephew who has been put on medication and the difference is very obvious and tangible as his performance in elementary school has improved considerably. It was a difficult decision for his parents to come to, so far they have found the trade-offs are worth it.

GuiltyBoomerang · Jun 7, 2018

gostang9
Fascinating conversation and I'm impressed by the openness on a public forum.

I have a nephew who has been put on medication and the difference is very obvious and tangible as his performance in elementary school has improved considerably. It was a difficult decision for his parents to come to, so far they have found the trade-offs are worth it.

Yes, as a worker in the children's services industry, I can tell you that for parents, admitting their child may need extra support is difficult, and you can do your utmost hardest to tell them that (as we are not doctors) there are signs of a condition and they just do no want to listen.

Perhaps fear? monetary cost? perception by others? time factors? there is always a reason for families who do or do not make that decision.

I agree that the openness is a great touch and knowing that you are not alone is a powerful thing.

One thing I have noticed is that my evenings are more relaxed than before, despite doing much more! I now seem to be zoning in on tasks such as unopened letters, getting dinner/shower/rubbish etc. without much fuss and if my father asks me to do something, I'm not grunting or saying "Whatttttttt" and rather...

Oh wait, let me reverse that after speaking to my dad tonight.

I quite calmly told him what was happening and what my condition was etc.

Without being unbiased, he basically said my condition was due to me being "able to complete everything under pressure," that bullying got to me, and that I went into school early because Hong Kong doctors had said I was fine whereas my preschool teachers had advised an extra year. There's more to the conversation, however I'm unsure if posting everything here would be appropriate. Long story short, he felt that I could fend for myself if I was left in the street at 16...or words to that effect.

During the conversation, at first I was very attentive. Over time however, I lost that focus and by the end of it (11:30pm or so) I was feeling the same irritability and tiredness I got at the end of a normal day.

I guess I'm now feeling the effects of the drug wearing off.

larryganz · Jun 7, 2018

GuiltyBoomerang
Ah in that case. I experienced that today.

I had driven some children as part of my work and returned to my car. I needed to return to perform some activities. I spent the next hour or so trying to figure out how to create a US eBay account to use a discount coupon, trying to setup a US PayPal account, trying to create a US phone number...before I knew it close to two hours had gone by and I called my workplace to let them know I was returning.

Perhaps one tablet might be for the best.

Yeah, if your dose of been too low you would’ve been constantly switching between tasks and not finishing any of them on time.

With a good dose, you could redirect yourself to do whatever task is needed most at the proper time, go back to another task when you need to, and still finish everything on time even while multitasking. EDIT - assuming your todo list is reasonable and is something a non-affected person could finish on time.

larryganz · Jun 7, 2018

Someday I’ll try to type up my talk that our medical group would give to school resource officers at a conference each year. But I’m not sure how to condense it, or if I have the energy anymore (retired), and it was always given from memory.

tikkathree · Jun 8, 2018

sdre
I hear you mate. I'm quite the opposite, but i do procrastinate on things i DO NOT want to do... like admin work at work etc...

I stumbled upon a video on reddit recently and I have saved it.

Take a look and see if it works for you.

https://www.reddit.com/r/GetMotivated/comments/49rlwp/video1_hour_lecture_by_the_worlds_leading/

Tan

I've always made it a rule to do first the things I'd rather leave until last.
Oh I don't mean perversely going against priorities but that phone call you don't want to make, that assignment , that admin task you're always putting off until tomorrow; do it now and get it out of the way.

GuiltyBoomerang · Jun 8, 2018

tikkathree
I've always made it a rule to do first the things I'd rather leave until last.
Oh I don't mean perversely going against priorities but that phone call you don't want to make, that assignment , that admin task you're always putting off until tomorrow; do it now and get it out of the way.

In the words of Mark Twain, "eat a frog the first thing of the day and nothing else will compare throughout" (terrible paraphrasing.)

It's when your procrastination is a habit built up as part of a condition that is tricky. I know right now, that with the meds, while starting tasks is much easier and there's less...well, a fight or flight feeling everytime I deliberate and just get out and do it, hyperfocus can sometimes also kick in and suck some time away.

Today I completed a few tasks, got over some hurdles in initiating and accepting some frustrations, found I acted possibly too quickly without reading and getting more knowledge and then calmed down and got reassurance...I'd say the meds have been a help.

Now I just need to be consistent and monitor for another week or so.

GuiltyBoomerang · Jun 10, 2018

Well the weekend has gone by, and the meds have been taking effect.

My first day on one tablet was nice and subdued. The last couple of days I've been on rails, getting some frustration and outbursts get the better of me, and sleep is an absolute mess.

So yesterday I simply took the three tablets on their own with water, no caffeine/multivitamins/glutamine supplement.

If I thought my procrastination was bad, I found hyperfocus worse. I only slept a couple of hours.

I'm going to try 1.5 tablets in the morning, and then 1.5 just before midday. Definitely less jittery, but we're getting there.

My mum is a bit more open and now understands that if I am getting off the meds I really do go back to what I could be like and worse. Sleep would be lovely, so early night today...

When I got focused into doing something on my to-do list, I could either do it for a long time or would flit around and I was forgetting occasionally because I was so focused on multi tasking.

My dad on the other hand has been a bit more odd in his approach, really saying that "I was normal in every respect" and constantly telling me that my "mother's side of the family taught you to be like this." I have heard this so many times, that hearing it yesterday, drugged up, and with the meds being too strong, I just told him to keep his own business since I'd just heard it too much. Not saying that he doesn't understand, just that his way of caring for me is very influential, but then again what parent isn't, especially if they're separated?

Making a post on Facebook surprised a couple of people, and there were a few posts telling me that all they ever thought was that I was the sweetest soul in the world. That does bring me comfort, and it's just about taking it one day at a time. Selling things I've hoarded for so long due to impulse. And that fun part of recognizing what watches I don't need to keep.

Especially with medical bills.

GuiltyBoomerang · Jun 23, 2018

After a couple of weeks of being on medication, I'm recognising that certain behaviours of mine are ingrained and that having that focus does allow me to take a step back and evaluate what's happening.

Habits are taking some time to reform and be a constant. Selling watches has been a hit or miss; while I would not see them as potential investments those lessons of "condition condition condition" are now hitting home quite hard. Only getting back 30-60% back of your investment in a not so well known/lesser condition is a major wake up call, and while I would have probably wallowed in self-defeat earlier, I know that a few deep breaths, a few more sales of other items, and things will be ok. And if not, then find other ways.

Learning how to budget and stick to budget is, I can see, a key point in ensuring I won't get drawn into impulse buys. Yes money does make me anxious, perhaps overly so.

I've found that a split dose of two tablets in the morning and one in the late morning/early afternoon will tide me for the day without too many side effects.

Procrastination, Depression, Paralysis - A Turning Point

GuiltyBoomerang

Larry S

GuiltyBoomerang

larryganz

larryganz

GuiltyBoomerang

larryganz

GuiltyBoomerang

larryganz

GuiltyBoomerang

Larry S

GuiltyBoomerang

gostang9

GuiltyBoomerang

larryganz

larryganz

tikkathree

GuiltyBoomerang

GuiltyBoomerang

GuiltyBoomerang

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