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Omega „Seachero” or not?
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Tony C.
··Ωf Jury memberyes, it appears to be a "Seachero".
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sneer
·Thanks Tony. And there is no issue that was delivered to Finland instead of Sweden?
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Pvt-Public
·You know it was delivered to Finland? The extract doesn’t even match the watch pictured. Different movement number, and different caliber number.
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sneer
·PVT_PUBLIC I have been added wrong picture with the movement of another omega - now is correct one. Watch i bought in Sweeden but from extract was delivered to Finland.
Oppinion of one of our collegues is :
"To be a 'Seachero' the watch need to originally be a Ranchero model. The dial was then replaced with a Seamaster dial (and some had Railmaster dials - they are highly sought after).
THIS watch was never a Ranchero as established by the EoA - it was produced as and has always been a Seamaster."
And i would like to understood if he is right or me to have clear situation
Thanks in advance for your help!
Oppinion of one of our collegues is :
"To be a 'Seachero' the watch need to originally be a Ranchero model. The dial was then replaced with a Seamaster dial (and some had Railmaster dials - they are highly sought after).
THIS watch was never a Ranchero as established by the EoA - it was produced as and has always been a Seamaster."
And i would like to understood if he is right or me to have clear situation
Thanks in advance for your help!
Edited:
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Tony C.
··Ωf Jury memberOppinion of one of our collegues is :
"To be a 'Seachero' the watch need to originally be a Ranchero model. The dial was then replaced with a Seamaster dial (and some had Railmaster dials - they are highly sought after).
THIS watch was never a Ranchero as established by the EoA - it was produced as and has always been a Seamaster."
I'm no expert, but do not believe that assertion. To my mind, any Seamaster housed in that Ranchero-style/reference case is known, colloquially, as a Seachero. If collectors who specialize claim to be able to distinguish between the small subset mentioned above, perhaps they can, perhaps not. But any of the those with Seamaster on the dial in that case fall into the basic category.
And there is no issue that was delivered to Finland instead of Sweden?
As far as this goes, I would argue that it should make no difference, and especially given the relatively close proximity of the countries.
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gbesq
·Seamaster dial in a Ranchero 2990 case = Seachero. It doesn't matter where it was delivered. I have one that was delivered to Japan. The only Seacheros that are not Seacheros are franken watches that have recently been put together with parts from different watches. Many of those are out there and it's even worse with Rancheros. That's why it is very important to get an extract from the archives with these watches. My Ranchero on the left and Seachero on the right. Same case. The only difference is the case back. The Ranchero has a flat case back whereas the Seachero has a domed case back to accommodate the taller sweep second hand caliber.
Edited:
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sneer
·Seamaster dial in a Ranchero 2990 case = Seachero. It doesn't matter where it was delivered. I have one that was delivered to Japan. The only Seacheros that are not Seacheros are franken watches that have recently been put together with parts from different watches. Many of those are out there and it's even worse with Rancheros. That's why it is very important to get an extract from the archives with these watches. My Ranchero on the left and Seachero on the right. Same case. The only difference is the case back. The Ranchero has a flat case back whereas the Seachero has a domed case back to accommodate the taller sweep second hand caliber.
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Pvt-Public
·In my opinion, no, it is a proper Seamaster, the extract confirms this. It was we, the “watch nerds” that came up with the nicknames. The widely used “Seachero” and the rarely used “Ranchmaster”.
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gbesq
·If i well understood its mean that this extract confirm that is proper Seachero ?
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ConElPueblo
·As I understand it, the extract will have to state Ranchero, but the dial be a Seamaster variant.
IIRC, the Searchero moniker was originally coined for those specific few watches that had their dial replaced prior to the sale.
Perhaps @tdn-dk could share his view?
IIRC, the Searchero moniker was originally coined for those specific few watches that had their dial replaced prior to the sale.
Perhaps @tdn-dk could share his view?
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Zapatta
·
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tdn-dk
·As I understand it, the extract will have to state Ranchero, but the dial be a Seamaster variant.
IIRC, the Searchero moniker was originally coined for those specific few watches that had their dial replaced prior to the sale.
Perhaps @tdn-dk could share his view?
I have never got confirmed if the dials was changed in the country where they were sold, it is a theory. Kaplans have used the term "Transformed Ranchero" for a long time in Sweden. So i guess there to scenarios, those sold directly from the factory with Seamaster dials (mostly the normal Omega logo) and the ones sold in Sweden with the rounded logo (called transformed Ranchero. The theory is JP Brandt (the Omega Agent in Sweden at the time) bought them af swapped the Ranchero dials with thes round logo service dials).
I dont know if Omega know what dial left the factory, but today You have to add pictures of the dial, so when you get an extract I guess they put the name the dial shows on the extract?
The "rounded" logo:
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sneer
·In my opinion, no, it is a proper
I have never got confirmed if the dials was changed in the country where they were sold, it is a theory. Kaplans have used the term "Transformed Ranchero" for a long time in Sweden. So i guess there to scenarios, those sold directly from the factory with Seamaster dials (mostly the normal Omega logo) and the ones sold in Sweden with the rounded logo (called transformed Ranchero. The theory is JP Brandt (the Omega Agent in Sweden at the time) bought them af swapped the Ranchero dials with thes round logo service dials).
I dont know if Omega know what dial left the factory, but today You have to add pictures of the dial, so when you get an extract I guess they put the name the dial shows on the extract?
The "rounded" logo:
Thanks @tdn-dk ! Please tell me if in your opinion my omega could be named Saechero or shouldn't?
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tdn-dk
·The references 2990 and 2996 are Ranchero references.
The Seachero is a nickname for the Seamaster dial fitted ones, and no more.
The new thing is Omega have started to mention them as Seamaster on the extract.
Here are the old data from the archives, that also mention other dials, but reference still named Ranchero.
Other references have multiple dial names on them like the Seamaster 600/Genéve 600/Seamaster Genéve 600, but only one reference name.
The Seachero is a nickname for the Seamaster dial fitted ones, and no more.
The new thing is Omega have started to mention them as Seamaster on the extract.
Here are the old data from the archives, that also mention other dials, but reference still named Ranchero.
Other references have multiple dial names on them like the Seamaster 600/Genéve 600/Seamaster Genéve 600, but only one reference name.
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gbesq
·^Exactly right. The 2990 is the subsecond version and the 2996 is the sweep second version. Both exist with Ranchero or Seamaster dials.
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ConElPueblo
·I didn't make the distinction between "Searchero" and "Transformed Ranchero" in my post - I didn't know there was one!
To me, a different name for a reference commonly known under another one doesn't warrant any special interest, we see it loads of times on later references as @tdn-dk writes. I guess that "Pre-DeVille" Seamasters also share reference number with the SMDV?
To me, a different name for a reference commonly known under another one doesn't warrant any special interest, we see it loads of times on later references as @tdn-dk writes. I guess that "Pre-DeVille" Seamasters also share reference number with the SMDV?
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Kiwibloke
·Oppinion of one of our collegues is :
"To be a 'Seachero' the watch need to originally be a Ranchero model. The dial was then replaced with a Seamaster dial (and some had Railmaster dials - they are highly sought after).
THIS watch was never a Ranchero as established by the EoA - it was produced as and has always been a Seamaster."
This is my comment and lies at the heart of the thread. I assumed that the EoA would show any 'Seachero'/'transformed Ranchero'/'whatever label is used' as a Ranchero model as that is what would have left the factory. The EoA pictured above has the model as 'Seamaster'.
But comment from @tdn-dk above - The new thing is Omega have started to mention them as Seamaster on the extract. - indicates that the model may not be 100% accurate.
SO - if a watch (belived to be genuine vs franken/assembled) with CK-2990 case and cal 267 movement was a Ranchero at some point, then my concern is allayed...
As always, the informed discussion on OF is more than valuable! 😀
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Tony C.
··Ωf Jury memberSO - if a watch (belived to be genuine vs franken/assembled) with CK-2990 case and cal 267 movement was a Ranchero at some point, then my concern is allayed...
I'm not following your argument. Are you suggesting that all watches in those cases, but with Seamaster dials, originally left the factory with Ranchero dials? If so, I don't believe it. If not, please try to help me understand your position.
