Omega Holy Grail ref. 3760822 hands set

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Maybe we can get EdistoJim to chime in as he's got 2 of these.
IMHO using the term "terrorists" when discussing watches is distasteful at best.
 
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Sorta worth mentioning what most here already know: Omega was/is sometimes pretty bad about substituting things like dials
and hands depending what they had on hand at the time. Didn't happen all that often but it happened nonetheless. I always shy away from calling someones watch a frankenwatch because it very well could have come from Omega just that way. Is a watch a franken if the hands were replaced at a factory center or at the actual factory? Not to my way of thinking. I have two 376s, they have different hands but according to Omega service both are correct and I have letters to that effect. I had a gentleman interested in one and I was thinking of letting one go. He all but called it a fake, he didn't but he got very close. This watch was acquired through Chuck Maddox himself. Letter from Omega Service center stating it was correct. Did no good. To him it was carved in stone. I like to keep an open mind and research things. Just my two cents, I could be wrong and often am. Great discussion.
 
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I have also noted a difference in lenght of minute hand tritzio space.
Are both correct hands in your opinion? Or they have the same tritzio window lenght?
(courtesy of TsoloT's website).

In this pictures, I can see two different minute hands, because the tritzio window finish in a different position.
Which is the correct one?

I post also a Mark 5 with a correct hand set to compare.
 
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In my opinion both are correct. I've seen 3 distinct examples and I know the watches. They came from Omega that way but the archives say otherwise on one. They match up very close but the fact is that the backs have never been off other than when at the service center or at the factory.
 
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kov kov
By the way, I am surprised that this one didn't sell since months... 🤨
So am I, its a nice piece……….10 grand? I'll pass.
 
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So am I, its a nice piece……….10 grand? I'll pass.

Considering the value of a regular Holy Grail at the moment and the fact there were only 200 ever produced of those bi-color LE's... this looked to me to be a bargain. BUT (!) According to @TsoloT (above in the thread) the movement isn't in a correct range - maybe this explains that... I don't know.
 
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In my opinion both are correct. I've seen 3 distinct examples and I know the watches. They came from Omega that way but the archives say otherwise on one. They match up very close but the fact is that the backs have never been off other than when at the service center or at the factory.

Both hands are correct because they come from Omega factory.
The question is: which is the original configuration?
 
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The hands in the pic above appear to be the same length to me. Angle and / or refeaction from the bend in the crystal may cause them to appear slightly different.

$0.02 CAD

I certainly don't know everything about these, but i've never heard mention of two different style of these "slim" hands. What's more common of course is the fatter Mark hands .
 
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Hi @TsoloT
Really? You want to present yourself as an "expert " in an area of watch collecting. You are hosting sites on certain watches .... With this level of participation in this community, you are held to a higher standard .This is of your own doing. This just happens the more you publish ...

After reading your posts here and on other threads. There seems to be a common theme when another member in the community has an opposing view, differential comment or statement. You conduct yourself in almost nasty, rude matter. I find very distasteful and it does not serve you well at all. Looking back now I agree with you I that it is a good thing you don't link your real name to you sites.


I am asking you for the last time to be more civil on the forums or if you can't control yourself. Then don't post. No one is forcing you to post.

Pretty simple.

Regards

Bill Sohne

One of many moderators here at the OF





Firstly you are quoting old information not current ...since the creation of the site I have had the opportunity to modify my information with lots of new examples sent to me through the site

Your analysis and comparison in reference to a 145.022 is arrant nonsense that massive production run goes on for nearly 20 years starting in 1968 ....how can you use such twisted logic to compare that with the grail was a very small production run composed of 150 batches in a very short period of 2 years

And my balance of probabilities is not your balance of probabilities suggest you look at normative distribution and the 1 -3-5 sigma rules. And your trite observation about binary is is diametrically opposed to your other point about probabilities

How is taking images from one source ‘the internet ‘ is not arbitrarily it is by any definition skewed and unreliable...You haven’t even begun to do justice to forensic analysis ...your approach is laughable

Then looking at 400 images [ tried your test and counting out the first main page I couldn’t reach 90 of which a number were my own images repeated where did the other 300 come from ?....is this a another joke .]

What filter did you use to eliminate duplicates and how did you manage to find 400 images of different watches which has a total original population of 1500 given attrition probably now 1300 ....are you are trying to persuade me that close to a quarter of all watch owners have decided to put their watch photos on the net ?


Where is your bench mark reference watch ? I used the 1985 speedymoon with a production run of 1300

In respect of the ‘Moonwatch’ reference...before I put my research to scrutiny by people such as yourself I take the time and trouble to actually examine real watches [I currently own 5 and have owned and have examined many more ]and unlike you I also spoke to one of the authors of the book you quote , who conceded that he had not done the research to any depth and that he had relied upon simplistic information which did not examine the construction of the watch just what was contained in the archives

So in summation you claim that HUNDREDS of watches with B4 bezels which never went for service [you claim that nothing had been changed on them ] have mysteriously appeared on or within a very small production of 1500 Watches run at a time when the B2 bezel was the standard and the B4 came in much later and which has never appeared in any published catalogue of Omega nor on any watch either owned or referenced by Chuck Maddox despite in all his and his cohorts very extensive and detailed analysis of this model over 10 years ago
Plus having seen in excess of 20 red dot and nos models from all over the world with varied delivery dates I have never seem 1 with a B4 bezel ....I am very sorry if someone has sold you a none authentic watch or you have service parts on yours or whatever but this posting of your reminds me of another grail owner whose postings were eventually stopped as he was becoming and more ridiculous over a fake Dial
Go buy the right bezel and stop this tendacious diatribe.

Finally your selective arbitrary and disputational approach completely ignores my first statement that the guide is not to be used dogmatically

Try constructing something not blowing it up ...advice to terrorists
 
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The hands in the pic above appear to be the same length to me. Angle and / or refeaction from the bend in the crystal may cause them to appear slightly different.

$0.02 CAD

I certainly don't know everything about these, but i've never heard mention of two different style of these "slim" hands. What's more common of course is the fatter Mark hands .
I'll let him speak for himself @milhouse but I think he's refering
to the position the lume ends and that it seems different.
I had to look up "tritzio" (tritium?)
 
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Both hands are correct because they come from Omega factory.
The question is: which is the original configuration?
Both may very well have.
 
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I'll let him speak for himself @milhouse but I think he's refering
to the position the lume ends and that it seems different.
I had to look up "tritzio" (tritium?)
Still the same I think . The lower one would appear elongated because of the crystal, imho.
 
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I'll let him speak for himself @milhouse but I think he's refering
to the position the lume ends and that it seems different.
I had to look up "tritzio" (tritium?)

Yes, correct.
I'm talking about the position of the lume window. The lower seems finishes before than the upper one.
 
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Still the same I think . The lower one would appear elongated because of the crystal, imho.

I’m not talking about lenght of hands. I refer to tritium position. The space between the end of tritium and the tip of the minute hand is not the same.
 
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More info about the Holy Grail here

Thank you for the Excellent and Thorough work updating the Holy Grail information!!
You've saved a lot of collectors from damaging their watches and the value degradation
that some bad information floating around could have caused.
Your book should be a part of any serious Speedmaster collectors library.
 
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Someone owes me an apology! @TsoloT

As I said earlier, foisting incorrect information
can cause serious damage to other collectors.
I hope no one changed their bezel to the wrong one.
You damaged the value of my watch and anyone
else that has a b4 bezel on their Grail, until this
Moonwatch Only information surfaced, and I
don't appreciate it.
Edited:
 
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Interesting piece of research ......Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery.......it is conceded by the writers that they have never seen a post Feb 1988 watch with a b2 bezel and according to them there are as many b2 as b4 ....in fact there are 3 Watches I know of that have B2 bezels after Feb 1988 and I am sure there are members of the forum who know of more and any analysis of all the available images show there are at least 70 % of them with B2 bezels ...

So sorry that the value of your watch has been damaged next time get one with a b2 to be sure