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  1. witti Jun 2, 2016

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    Hi, new member here. I've just signed up to share this Omega related story I started a thread about at TZ-UK, where I was suggested to post it here as well. If it brings any new Information or add any new detail to earlier discussions about this model I'm very happy. Also any comments, or opinions are most appreciated and I'm looking forward to learn more about these watches. So, here we go:


    Finding (or at least defining) the holy grail of watches for most of us - I guess - comes during our WIS journey.
    When we got to know a wider spectrum of watches through owning or simply dreaming about them.
    By this our interest in watches shrinks down to one or several brands, models (ideally :smug: ) .
    And possibly we pick one which is the most sought after for us. Then we have a grail and we would like to achieve to own this Grail at some point.
    In my case it was all different.
    I always loved watches but there was a point in my life when I became a WIS I think.
    I was a teenager and on a regular Family visit my Father proposed me to ask my Uncle - who was retired Chief Director of
    the National Airlines and former Colonel of the Hungarian Air Force -to show his pilot watches.
    He had several timepieces during his career, but had kept only two of them.
    He showed me two identical Omega Military Chronographs. As I got to know later on, they were ref.2451 models with 27 CHRO C12 T2 PC movements.
    Or as later renamed cal.321.
    (Why he had two of them? That's an interesting story. First you have to know that back in the days (saying that because I'm not sure if this is still
    the case today) in the Air Force of Hungary, service watches were gifted to the pilots. Usually pilots received there watches when they finished
    studies and started their career in the Air Force. Officers or commanders also received watches as gifts in special occasions or simply service watches.
    So the watches belonged to the officers and they were wearing them proudly.)
    These Omegas in subject arrived around the time of the 1956's revolution in Hungary. At the time my Uncle was in charge of two Military air bases.
    (After WWII Hungary was officially "liberated", but more of occupied by the Soviets... The country was trying to break out from the Soviet occupation in '56.
    Things were chaotic in the country to say the least.)
    To shorten the story, all those new watches arrived in a box. My Father says around two hundred (!) of them. (Don't forget that the Air Force in
    the country used to be way larger than these days.) Anyway, because of the chaos in the country some suggested to my Uncle to temporary keep the watches because
    they will be lost or stolen anyway. The country experienced basically war time. Huge Soviet forces were crossing the border.
    Also you can imagine how big value this box of Swiss chronographs had in the country which was just out of the wars and being under occupation.
    In fact my Uncle was always straight and honest and was not comfortable with the idea of keeping any watch apart from the one was dedicated to him. At the end he had been persuaded and agreed to keep one for his wife as well.
    I still don't know what actually happened with the watches and how many of them reached the Pilots after the revolution.

    Jumping back to our family visit in the 90s I was looking at those two chronographs which already had such a long history.
    And at that moment my Uncle said:
    - Choose the one you like better and take it!
    To say I was over the Moon is a huge understatement.
    However, there was a big difference between the condition of those two watches.
    The one he used every day for quite long time had a totally faded dial. It was almost impossible to read the time. The other one which was originally kept for my Aunt
    was in much better shape. Even though it's dial also started to fade from one side, but still looked way better.
    So I chose the one in better condition. My Uncle used that also for example when the other one was serviced but more often only when he was older and
    there was some issue with his first one.
    [​IMG]
    Photo from the 90's. The watch is on my Uncle's helmet also a gift from him.
    [​IMG]
    And a dial Close-up
    So that's the story how I started my WIS journey instantly with my all time Grail.
    Unfortunately my Uncle had died long time ago, but of course I always kept the watch.
    But the story of this watch is not ended here. As I said the dial of my watch showed some fading, but I didn't expect I had to witness the total transformation of the watch face in the last two and a half decades.
    I didn't wear the watch and kept it in box always, but somehow the dial faded out the same way as the other example from my Uncle.
    Why this is Happening I don't really know. Also I have no idea why it's happening with some examples and why not with others.
    I have theories, though. There could be more suppliers for the dials, or there was a faulty run on the production? Could it be that there is some kind of clear coat on the paint and
    is not conserving the paintwork? The dial is apparently made of silver. Is there something to do with the oxidation of the silver?
    Or could the radiation burn the paint off this much? This is still a radium dial and I have seen burned spots from hands on dials, if the hands were in same position for years.
    But for this kind of demolition you need real strong radiation, which I never checked on the watch.
    At least the transformation is well documented.
    [​IMG]
    Dial fading through about 25 years. There are years between these shots.

    As you can see the watch is unwearable in this condition and not even reminds me to the watch I received from my Uncle.
    I love the watch and all the history it came with. Even I love very much these classic chronographs not only from Omega, but Universal Geneve, Heuer, Breitling etc.
    They are simply great and were never really outfashionned.
    (And I believe - and can already see the signs - downsizing is the future in watch-world.
    Also this watch with its 35-36mm diameter was a perfectly good men's size back in the days.)
    All in all I needed a solution to get this watch wearable. For long time I was considering to simply send it out to Bienne for a full restoration.
    I believe I would get back a brand new looking timepiece with refinished dial. But that's not what I want!
    The other solution is to source another dial for the watch.
    So the hunt started...
    ...and continued. For more than a decade!
    Even these watches are quite rare, but to find a dial only was almost impossible.
    I say almost, because I have seen once a photo showing several NOS(!) dials on Spanish watch forum. I think the guy was from Argentina who had them.

    In fact these watches were used by (or maybe even made for) the Argentine Air Force. They are known for this but those examples have the logo of
    "Fuerza Aérea Argentina" stamped on the back. The Hungarian examples have no Military engravings. That is based on the 5-6 examples I have seen all together during the years.
    But that's no surprise if you think they were gifted to the pilots so needed no mil. stock numbers.
    (This was not the case before. During WWII and before Air Force service watches did have engravings, but that's another thread maybe.)
    Anyway I tryed to get in contact with the guy but no success. Chances to get a dial were low. I Saw complete watches (not many times), but went for above my budget. And sometimes wouldn't
    even bother for the dial they had.
    Time passed but I always kept an eye opened if something surfaces. And the reason I started this thread now is because a good example appeared on an auction site.
    It turned out that the seller is from Hungary, even though it was advertised in another country.
    Things started to be exciting! We had several message exchanges. The listing had several errors, was not available world wide and no Paypal security for the buyer.
    So, I was hoping for a good price. Even though it had a minimum price and was not exactly cheap.
    Bidding was low on it until the last second - as usually - and guess what happened. Even though the listing was not really good someone had beaten my final bid.
    Damn! These old Omegas must be desirable if a doggy listing with drawbacks still bring enough attention.
    So the watch was gone, but I still had a message from the seller that he was feeling sorry for me and ensured me if the buyer would pull he contacts me.
    Then days or a week passed. I realized how important this watch was for me. And how stupid I was not offering a little more for it! We all know the feeling I guess.
    When you see an important piece but let it got away.
    This was even worse. My whole hobby was questioned.
    OK, it was not cheap, but what I want if I'm not willing to pay extra for my grail? I was playing poker and lost.
    I was in bad mood especially because I was back in Hungary having a vacation and I know that the watch was still there being organized to take it to the buyer.
    I couldn't stay this situation and called the seller! Turned out that the buyer didn't really know what he was bidding on, or was simply expecting lower ending price...
    It turned out they are organizing a face to face transaction, but the buyer was not fully confident and apparently would be happy to walk away from the purchase.
    And guess what. Yes, I went to see the watch and made an offer.
    The next day the watch was mine!
    [​IMG]
    Looking good on the wrist
    I knew I had to get this watch, because its dial is in way better shape and I know where exactly is coming from.
    (from a heirloom from close to an old military air base in Hungary)
    And on top the serial number is very close to my watch. In fact there is only .....269 between them. On a ten million range number! (Omega production 1944)
    That means this watch is one from that box of Omegas which was once in the hand of my Uncle sixty years ago.
    Amazing!

    So, what's gonna happen now? I could keep them as they are. Keep the gift from my Uncle in the box and wear it's sister. That is the purists way maybe. Which is close to me.
    However, the purchased watch has replaced crown, Crystal, not original Omega. Unfortunately the case has been overpolished. The hands relumed with green lume. :ambivalence:
    My old one is all original. Has never been polished. Original signed crystal, crown. (Usually crown is changed due to wear - hand winding.)
    Movement is in better condition, again didn't run that much. Only the chrono second hand has been changed to a newer one.
    But that is original on the other watch.
    The two watches side by side:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    Now you see where I'm going . Using only the dial and the chrono second hand from the second watch will give me my perfect example.
    From sentimental side, this way I can wear the watch which I received from my Uncle long time ago.
    From WIS side, I will have an unpolished perfect example, with all Omega parts. Even lume will match between dial and hands.
    Maybe not the most purist way. But perfect for me. I only need a good watchmaker with steady hands. :smug:
    And probably will get the second watch's dial refinished at some point. Could be a good pair...
    Thanks for reading,
    Csaba
     
    Blaise, gostang9, lwong and 18 others like this.
  2. calalum Jun 2, 2016

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    I would leave them as found and enjoy them and their history. Thanks for sharing.
     
  3. gop76 Jun 2, 2016

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    witti, you don't imagine how many stories of watches given by uncles appear around here...

    But stories like yours are rare and make a delightful reading.

    Thanks
     
  4. Tom Dick and Harry Jun 2, 2016

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    Bravo sir........ a superb first post
     
  5. ICONO Jun 2, 2016

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    Congratulations on two fascinating timepieces, both enhanced by their back story

    Welcome !
     
  6. watchthirst Jun 2, 2016

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    That's one badass Omega!
     
  7. Dre Jun 2, 2016

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    Dang! What a story! And you sure as hell took some good photographs since the 90s :)
     
  8. drainaps Jun 2, 2016

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    Classy entrance to WUS, that's the least I can say. I always wonder about the history of the many vintage watches I've bought over the years, I wish their past was half as exciting as your Omega's. Thanks for the detailed posting and the great pictures.
     
  9. marturx Jun 3, 2016

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    Great reading, much appreciated!

    If you alter your uncle's watch, You will only regret it. Keep it as is. The ghost dial is pretty cool IMO, and given it's history and age, it's fully acceptable that heavy aging patina. Makes that piece unique
     
    Syrte likes this.
  10. witti Jun 7, 2016

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    Many thanks for all the kind words and shared opinions.
    I was not aware of all those grandpa and uncle stories come up so often here...Funny
     
  11. trackpad Jun 7, 2016

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    Enjoyed your post. I think both watches look great, and I agree with @marturx, keep your uncle's watch as it is.

    Edit: I thought about it some more. I don't think I could resist moving the correct sweep over. Maybe do it at the next full service of both, whenever that is due. The white sweep will also look better on your newer example, and definitely vice versa.
     
    Edited Jun 7, 2016
  12. Furze Jun 7, 2016

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    Wow, great post!
     
  13. lwong Jun 7, 2016

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    A fantastic story. I enjoyed every word, and the dial transformation pics were astonishing. Bravo.