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Is This MoonWatch Original?

SurvivingJoe
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kov kov
Delete that first picture and you won’t confuse people with it anymore



Based on that serial / period you can securely assume it’s a 3590.50. All the other comments are based on that assumption. I would expect to see a different bezel and a different caseback on this watch to say it’s all original. Now you have all the details to make your homework and find out 😀
I have removed those wrong pictures and thanks for your insight.
 
SurvivingJoe
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Speedmaster101 mentioned 145.022 is manufactured during 1968 and 1978, while I do saw someone get 1985 145.022 w/ extract of archive from Omega. So I wonder when exactly did 145.022 end of manufacturing? Is there any official link to outline the supply time range of each model?
 
kov
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145.022 is the Moonwatch case reference. Basically the regular Moonwatch you buy today still has a 145.022 case. References changed in the early nineties to 3590.50 etc and then to the long references still used today.

In regards to what you've quoted from sp101, 145.022 was produced with sub-references from 1969 (145.022-68) to 1980 (145.022-78) and then from 1980 to 1990 as simple 145.022 without any year suffix in the ref.
 
Archer
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kov kov
This Speedmaster is a 3590.50 produced somewhen in 1991. For sure not in the eighties. And it is not supposed to have a step dial 😉

Interesting...I have a Speedmaster in the shop starting with 4834 with gilt movement like this one, and I have obtained an extract for it that says it's a 35705000 from 1997. Case back is marked 1450022 and 3450022.

So does the range from 4827 to 4834 span 6 years?
 
kov
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Archer Archer
So does the range from 4827 to 4834 span 6 years?

Absolutely. The 48 millions range is a nightmare. @eugeneandresson can tell you what kind of mess it is - as he's managing the ilovemyspeedmaster tool. I've had numerous 48M Speedmasters for which I always ordered an extract so I am using my own archives to place a 48M watch in the timeline.

Basically the easy to remember trick is the following everything below 48 followed by the half of 48 (4824xxxxx) is 98% likely to be from the 1980s. Everything above, (4825xxxx and up) is from the nineties. Span from 1990 to 1997. 😉
 
Archer
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kov kov
Absolutely. The 48 millions range is a nightmare. @eugeneandresson can tell you what kind of mess it is - as he's managing the ilovemyspeedmaster tool. I've had numerous 48M Speedmasters for which I always ordered an extract so I am using my own archives to place a 48M watch in the timeline.

Basically the easy to remember trick is the following everything below 48 followed by the half of 48 (4824xxxxx) is 98% likely to be from the 1980s. Everything above, (4825xxxx and up) is from the nineties. Span from 1990 to 1997. 😉

Just ran this one through ilovemyspeedmaster - came up as a Sept. 1996 watch, so 4 months out...
 
kov
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Yep, I told you it's a nightmare and I'm using my own reference points.

Archer Archer
Just ran this one through ilovemyspeedmaster - came up as a Sept. 1996 watch, so 4 months out...

Which one? OP watch?

upload_2020-3-29_16-49-8.png
 
SurvivingJoe
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kov kov
Yep, I told you it's a nightmare and I'm using my own reference points.



Which one? OP watch?

upload_2020-3-29_16-49-8.png
But the inner case back called out 145.022 sound still correct? And Bezel are also the same since 3590.50 are using non-DON bezel?
 
Archer
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kov kov
Which one? OP watch?

No, the one I have in the shop...
 
kov
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SurvivingJoe SurvivingJoe
But the inner case back called out 145.022 sound still correct?

No, to me it's a service caseback. I would expect it to look like this :

49796insideback.jpg


SurvivingJoe SurvivingJoe
And Bezel are also the same since 3590.50 are using non-DON bezel?

That's wrong. The correct bezel is different. Well if you buy the watch and want to get the correct bezel, I have one left for sale here 😜

Compare them and see, it's different.
 
SurvivingJoe
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kov kov
That's wrong. The correct bezel is different. Well if you buy the watch and want to get the correct bezel, I have one left for sale here 😜

Compare them and see, it's different.
Obviously I will not buy it giving the wrong inner caseback. And the inner caseback looks poor comparing w/ the overall status of the watch.
I read your POST but I still could figure out the different across those bezels🤦. Could you kindly point out the DIFF?
Sorry I couldn't buy you a beer since we're in different country...
 
kov
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@SurvivingJoe TACHYMETRE font is taller and bigger on the correct bezel. The dot at 70 touches the 0.

What you have on your watch is the later, modern, service bezel. Not the one that was fitted on the watches from 1971 up to mid nineties.

If you want to learn more, I would really recommend to buy yourself a copy of the Moonwatchonly book 😀
 
OMEGuy
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kov kov
I would expect it to look like this :

What do you think, the C.R.S. version wasn't used for 1990s examples?

20190516_142514_0011-768x1024.jpg

And how would you date this one?

omega145022KBcaseback_2-800x800.jpg
 
MikiJ
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SpeedyPhill SpeedyPhill
Observation not age brings wisdom ...
What am I missing? Doesn't observation come with experience?
 
kov
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OMEGuy OMEGuy
What do you think, the C.R.S. version wasn't used for 1990s examples?

20190516_142514_0011-768x1024.jpg

I can't say 100% no. But most of the Charles Rene Spielman cases I've seen were from the 1980s.

What I am sure about is that the caseback from OP is a typical service part 😀
 
OMEGuy
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kov kov
I can't say 100% no. But most of the Charles Rene Spielman cases I've seen were from the 1980s.

What I am sure about is that the caseback from OP is a typical service part 😀
Thank you. 😀

I've edited my post above and asked for your opinion on the KB casebacks as well.
 
kov
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OMEGuy OMEGuy
And how would you date this one?

What I can tell you is that there were more than 10 companies making Moonwatch cases for Omega since the Moonwatch exists. HF, CRS, KB and so on. Again, I am not saying that only the caseback I showed is correct. I am saying that the one from OP is not. That's different 😉
 
OMEGuy
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kov kov
What I can tell you is that there were more than 10 companies making Moonwatch cases for Omega since the Moonwatch exists. HF, CRS, KB and so on. Again, I am not saying that only the caseback I showed is correct. I am saying that the one from OP is not. That's different 😉
I'm not doubting what you say, but it confuses me a bit, because I think I have a believed to be NOS watch with the same caseback as on the OPs watch. I'll check this... 👍
 
kov
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I have researched a bit and found several examples with this kind of caseback, like the OP.

img_8173-jpg.223059

The ST 145022 marking, so big and light engraved looks pretty much like the service caseback BUT what's different and what I didn't pay attention to is the fir tree at the top.

I am now thinking I've simply never had such a caseback so far and the fact that the big and light engraved ST 145022 ref looks so similar to the service parts, led me to a mistaken conclusion. This OP caseback can be correct.
 
OMEGuy
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kov kov
I have researched a bit and found several examples with this kind of caseback, like the OP.

The ST 145022 marking, so big and light engraved looks pretty much like the service caseback BUT what's different and what I didn't pay attention to is the fir tree at the top.

I am now thinking I've simply never had such a caseback so far and the fact that the big and light engraved ST 145022 ref looks so similar to the service parts, led me to a mistaken conclusion. This OP caseback can be correct.

This seems to be a very educational thread... 😀
 
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