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djmusicman
路I'm curious to see a picture of the said watch. Amongst the 52,769 members on the forum, who is "Mike"?
I think it was this one:
Spacefruits Ed White is pretty nice too:
I think this is quite nice on Ebay 105012
I think it was this one:
Spacefruits Ed White is pretty nice too:
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BenBagbag
路I also think the argument of "the market is soft for bad pieces" is an easy way to write off a low selling price as being an anomaly. As others have said, most mid-range pieces used to sell for much more - but I've only got one Speedy in the collection...
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Dan S
路What I wanted to see is how many (considered) collector grade Speedmasters are around on this forum or that have been seen anywhere else, very very few I should imagine.
Not easy to find straight-lug examples in this category, and I'm guessing that is what you're referring to. With respect to all the curved-lug references, I've seen a lot of really excellent examples on the forum.
I was trying to search for it but after all, I cannot actually use the search function properly 馃榿
See this thread for example: https://omegaforums.net/threads/speedmaster-2998-2.83999/
I found it quickly by using Google to search for msnwatch 2998, and limiting the search to omegaforums.net.
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michael e
路I'd love to make a scatterplot which shows how many people think market is "soft" or "strong" along with how many Speedmasters they own. I'm not sure I could be intellectually honest enough to say market has softened if I had 10+ Speedmasters in my collection.
Only people without Speedmasters and who really want to buy one will say the market is soft, then other people who have listened to them and have 0 Speedmasters will say the market is soft, like a domino affect, this will create a soft market.
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michael e
路Not easy to find straight-lug examples in this category, and I'm guessing that is what you're referring to. With respect to all the curved-lug references, I've seen a lot of really excellent examples on the forum.
See this thread for example: https://omegaforums.net/threads/speedmaster-2998-2.83999/
I found it quickly by using Google to search for msnwatch 2998, and limiting the search to omegaforums.net.
Yes I saw that thread before and did mention Mike's example as an example. This I always though was classed as collector grade.
I do not like using the word collector grade to be honest as it sounds like everything else is not worth collecting, but I have been guilty in the past of using those words with other watches.
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padders
路路Oooo subtitles!Only people without Speedmasters and who really want to buy one will say the market is soft, then other people who have listened to them and have 0 Speedmasters will say the market is soft, like a domino affect, this will create a sort market.
ps note that William has himself now moved away from using the term 'Collector Grade' for the best of the best. His top category is now 'Excellent'
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JwRosenthal
路I think there will be some great values to be had in the coming months/years as the economy stabilizes (comes back to center and less easy money out there) and we see the divide between collector grade and user grade widen. For those who just want a nice vintage Speedmaster and don鈥檛 care about perfection- we will start to see many that have been inflated come back down to reality.
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Dan S
路Yes I saw that thread before and did mention Mike's example as an example. This I always though was classed as collector grade.
I do not like using the word collector grade to be honest as it sounds like everything else is not worth collecting, but I have been guilty in the past of using those words with other watches.
Sorry, I misunderstood. Based on the previous posts I thought you were trying to find a photo of Mike's watch. I probably didn't read carefully enough.
Paul sold a really nice Ed White to @Mad Dog as well.
I agree, let's not say "collector grade", people collect different things.
Edit: Just realized this thread was about a 105.012 example. Not sure how we got onto straight-lug pieces. 馃榾
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michael e
路I disagree. I have 5 Speedmasters and I would agree with those suggesting that the market is softer today than it was 6 months ago. Even good watches are selling slower or selling lower. There is nothing wrong with honest comment on markets. Let's not let this get like the investor forums where buyers deramp and sellers pump then dump. Honesty is the key.
ps note that William has himself now moved away from using the term 'Collector Grade' for the best of the best. His top category is now 'Excellent'
Yes, but it is only softer because people have been talking about it and many have been spreading the word, how many times in the last two/three years have you been warned about the bubble bursting? In my opinion that has caused the softening in the market.
I have conversations every day with buyers who tell me about the softening market.
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michael e
路Sorry, I misunderstood. Based on the previous posts I thought you were trying to find a photo of Mike's watch. I probably didn't read carefully enough.
Paul sold a really nice Ed White to @Mad Dog as well.
I agree, let's not say "collector grade", people collect different things.
Edit: Just realized this thread was about a 105.012 example. Not sure how we got onto straight-lug pieces. 馃榾
No worries. 馃憤
I didn't mean just the straight lugged Speedmasters, I wanted to see vintage Speedmasters 57-76? like Mike's that are as good as you can get, or what I thought where considered as collector grade watches.
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bazamu
路I disagree. I have 5 Speedmasters and I would agree with those suggesting that the market is softer today than it was 6 months ago. Even good watches are selling slower or selling lower. There is nothing wrong with honest comment on markets. Let's not let this get like the investor forums where buyers deramp and sellers pump then dump. Honesty is the key.
I witnessed this in vintage Heuer - speculators who had piled into early Autavias started to panic, then the second wave was people who didn't even collect Heuer but would make blanket statements such as "nobody wants Heuers anymore, they're trash!" (i.e. herd mentality), and the third wave is an actual impact on people who would have liked them but for the negative pervading sentiment about their perceived value. It's not reducing the watches to investments...it's just people being cautious with their hard-earned money when they're about to jump into a new brand that they don't know inside and out.
I'm not saying we can't discuss negative trends at face value here...just suggesting that it should be done carefully. Also, note that I'm not making any assertion that the Speedmaster market is on fire. Just trying to provide a counter balance.
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Dan S
路No worries. 馃憤
I didn't mean just the straight lugged Speedmasters, I wanted to see vintage Speedmasters 57-76? like Mike's that are as good as you can get, or what I thought where considered as collector grade watches.
Sounds like a great topic for a separate thread. Given the title of this thread, people may not see your question here.
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bazamu
路No worries. 馃憤
I didn't mean just the straight lugged Speedmasters, I wanted to see vintage Speedmasters 57-76? like Mike's that are as good as you can get, or what I thought where considered as collector grade watches.
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ATWG
路This is a healthy debate to have from various factions of the hobby. Each is entitled to their own POV l, in the end the market has spoken and eyes don鈥檛 deceive.
BTW - no one on this thread is suggesting or has come close to saying Speedmasters are trash. I love mine and are part of my regular rotation, specially my 105.012 which is not collector grade.
BTW - no one on this thread is suggesting or has come close to saying Speedmasters are trash. I love mine and are part of my regular rotation, specially my 105.012 which is not collector grade.
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michael e
路Sounds like a great topic for a separate thread. Given the title of this thread, people may not see your question here.
You are correct regarding a seperate thread.
Someone mentioned collector grade in this thread and it got me wondering what the consensus was regarding what was considered collector grade among other collectors.
Cheers, Michael
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michael e
路This is a healthy debate to have from various factions of the hobby. Each is entitled to their own POV l, in the end the market has spoken and eyes don鈥檛 deceive.
My thinking is that the lovely watch rightly highlighted by William was a great watch that sold too cheaply due to people thinking it was going to go much higher, I wonder how many people didn't watch the end because they thought it was going to go a lot higher?
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Dan S
路My thinking is that the lovely watch rightly highlighted by William was a great watch that sold too cheaply due to people thinking it was going to go much higher, I wonder how many people didn't watch the end because they thought it was going to go a lot higher?
This is an interesting perspective, and I suppose it's a possibility. But overall, if I had a Speedmaster for sale in an eBay auction, personally I would be happy to have @Spacefruit highlight it in an OF thread, especially with favorable comments. I think that the conventional wisdom suggests that better advertised auctions generally bring higher prices.
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michael e
路This is an interesting perspective, and I suppose it's a possibility. But overall, if I had a Speedmaster for sale in an eBay auction, personally I would be happy to have @Spacefruit highlight it in an OF thread, especially with favorable comments. I think that the conventional wisdom suggests that better advertised auctions generally bring higher prices.
Yes, I would love William to highlight one of my watches too, from a person who lives and breathes Speedmasters it is a great thing to get a thumbs up.
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JwRosenthal
路This is an interesting perspective, and I suppose it's a possibility. But overall, if I had a Speedmaster for sale in an eBay auction, personally I would be happy to have @Spacefruit highlight it in an OF thread, especially with favorable comments. I think that the conventional wisdom suggests that better advertised auctions generally bring higher prices.
There are several sites (Fratello comes to mind) that highlight active eBay auctions and it does the same thing- pumps those watches up due to more eyes on the auction. We all like to grab a bargain when we can- but anyrhing with the word Speedmaster in the title is gonna see all hands on deck for those who are even remotely interested.
