This is an interesting debate. I absolutely do think smart businesses have an agenda and attack that agenda from all angles.
Now some businesses are more savvy than others in how they go about it.

Completely agree. At least in the case of buying watches- we have multiple options to exercise. I wish I had that for my cable/internet service who has been regularly me for years now...

 

I recently watch "All the Presidents Men" for the 100th time and was reminded of what it was like not that long ago to be a responsible news organization. Research was the first priority.
Today, the priority is to be first...and the art off research and verify lost. If you haven't seen the film in awhile, its worth watching again, especially in todays climate.

 

Speaking personally HODINKEE / Watchville Blogs were a prime source of info for me before I found OF. I have purchased straps and rolls from them. I still enjoy the articles on both even though I realize that they are largely uncritical. I consume them like I do all media, absorbing different perspectives and forming my own views. When it comes to these forums, the more accurate information here, the better. We all benefit by contributing, absorbing, taking the occasional beat down and sharing experience even if our community includes established, commercialized on line magazines like HODINKEE. Love the ABC analogy @CajunTiger.

 

Yes, like the "Military expert" whom believes and still insists that the Milus SnowStar watches in "Life barter" kits are from WWII.

 

I agree with you @CajunTiger .
At the end of the day, we are all "at risk" for "conflicts of interest," (COIs) if we are calling it that.
We can't judge each other's good faith (or lack thereof), because we don't know, right?

So the options are the following:
1) we ALL disclose ALL potential COIs (example: if you own a Speedy 145.012 that you might sell one day for profit, then you should disclose that you own one before making any comments anywhere about the potential value of a 145.012) any time we post...this doesn't seem reasonable
2) we don't post at all anytime there might be any potential COI...also doesn't sound reasonable
3) or we do our homework (tisk tisk Hodinkee, in this case), stay vigilant, and do out best to contribute to the community...and contributing means both benefitting as well as providing benefit.

I just joined a short time ago - and as a novice, I have learned SO much from being a daily visitor on the site (including from you, @ConElPueblo ; and have done a little business with a couple of you. I think OF is an indispensible resource. I hope that as I grow in my experience, I will be able to contribute more and more as well.

Just my $0.02.

 

by the way, the Nina has been relisted on eBay for a cool 22K OBO...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Ori...311345?hash=item2f07340031:g:-iAAAOSwCkZZVUBtPurchases made through these links may earn this site a commission from the eBay Partner Network

 

Not to pile on but it WOULD be nice if Louis had written a correction (like journalists do) giving credit to the UG forum at OF instead of simply deleting and editing the article.

 

agree 100%

 

Bit of a straw man, this. I specifically mention that the article is "a vehicle for building their reputation as vintage watch specialists" not that they are planning to do as you suggest I suggest. I believe my above mentioned statement is pretty easy to understand and shouldn't be liable for interpretation in the manner you do. I am actually pretty surprised and disappointed to see you trying to credit me for such a ridiculous analogy as the one you posted.

I do speak with my wallet and I also make my feelings and opinions known on OF, as do you - I think that we are all grateful for this place! Imagine someone trying to post these comments on Hodinkee... There would be a rash of censorship

Anyway, I have posted my opinion on this matter and will withdraw somewhat clumsily from the discussion. Having other members twisting my words and arguing over semantics is not my flavour of discussion board

 

So I am new here. I am just some guy who likes watches, and wants to build a decent collection of vintage pieces that look nice. I am extremely grateful that so many members are willing to share their expertise, at no cost, to help me with my hobby.

I cant comment on what this community should or shouldn't be, because you all built it. However, the idea of a dealer or other for-profit entity posting here to get the free advice of experts in order to make a buck just feels wrong to me.

Sure, this guy may be journalist. I used to interact with journalists every day for years, and that interaction was based on mutual benefit - they got their story, and was able to get my boss' message out there. I dont see that mutual benefit here.

Hodinkee makes gobs of money from advertising, watch and accessory sales, and who knows what else. They have private equity backing, and are a major force in the industry. So the idea that they would consult this community on an article like the one in question before it went up just seems wrong, when they could pay a consultant for such analysis or retain an expert on staff.

This site has tens of thousands of threads full of incredibly valuable information that are open to the public that they can use for their benefit. I just dont think its fair for the experts here to become the go-to source for profit-motivated entities, and get nothing in return.

These are just my thoughts. I'm not trying to have an argument, especially with folks who have been here for a long time and have contributed and have a much larger stake than i do.

 

Thats very strange...either the high bidder was a shill or he refused to pay. Not sure why people bid and then don't pay, but something is off with this one.

 

Im going to stop as I clearly misunderstood your intent, but I just wanted to clarify what I said.
I asked "are you suggesting"...I didn't state that you were suggesting this. Big difference. It seems we both just misunderstand each other...so lets move on to the topic.

I agree that Hodinkee should do a better job of research before posting. They must realize that some collectors use them as a reference and posting false information is not a good thing.

 

Hi everyone, thanks a lot for chiming on, just wished to add a couple of words, not on behalf of Hodinkee, just personally as there was a couple of direct questions above - and assumptions - so let me give you some genuine answers.

I write Bring A Loupe out of passion, I loved reading Eric's column and it is an honor to being able to follow him every week for the past two years.
The selection is very straight forward and highly subjective it is just about the watches that I spot, the info that I can find on them in my memory, in the books and online, and where they are offered for sale.
The article is most of the times written through Thursday night as I wish to make sure that the watches picked are still available, after I reached out to the sellers to ask for additional info and pictures.
Of course, nor Hodinkee nor myself does get any commission on those watches, it is just about highlighting some vintage pieces that we love, sharing a passion as you do on this forum - and as I also do on other forums, French speaking ones mostly though

So I am sorry to disappoint the believers in a grand scheme, nothing that sophisticated or devilish in place...
That said any feedback is super helpful to make sure all tmy facts are always correct so don't hesitate to ping me if you feel I should rectify anything, or mention it here, I am there several times a day but you probably saw that from the links to some thread in my articles.

And if you wish to know about my COI... I am heavily biased towards ultra thin mechanical watches from the 1950s, the same watches I saw my grand fathers wear through my childhood.
And even if I talked about those pieces 24/7 on Hodinkee, I doubt the current pool of 3 people interested in them would grow any further

 

Someone sure thought so -- Hodinkee and this same UG reference were the subject of a piece on exactly this type of "situation" (or should I say speculation?) a couple of years ago ...

Watch Collector’s Notebook — The “Nina Rindt” Compax and how markets are made for vintage watches today

http://mansfinelife.com/2015/10/01/...w-markets-are-made-for-vintage-watches-today/

 

well this topic has been debated to death for awhile now...but try to find a Nina or even an evil Nina today. You would be hard pressed to find 2 or 3 legitimate samples for sale on any given day worldwide...if that. Now search for a Submariner, or better yet a Daytona. You will find hundreds of options. IMO this is what influences prices more than anything, more demand than supply. The supply is simply very low...now you can argue that the demand was created by Hodinkee...but could they have created all the demand? There wouldn't be any demand if it wasn't a cool watch, which it is...then add the relative rarity and you have this. Look at the Heuer Panda...if you own one you pretty much name your price and its sold instantly. Its all about the supply, or lack of. Demand in general is up for all vintage watches and Hodinkee is surely part of the reason...but not even close to the only reason.

my .02

BTW- Does this example show a weakening of prices. It wasn't that long ago any Nina that popped up for sale sold within minutes for far more than this buy-it-now. A/S had several that turned into bidding wars and sold in the 30-50k range...crazy!

 

Hello, I signed up to OF a month ago because I discovered I had a bad nina for thirty years since I did not wear watches I would have used it a dozen times on baptism or marriage occasions thanks to you I did a Yes of "culture" and it's amazing how interesting this world is! I decided to share a bit of photos with you, it is definitely one of the first ones released by the universal serial number 2411 ###. Hello to all

 

Very nice, dibs!

 

Hi there,

Hodinkee has had over the years some wonderfully interesting content.
However, all institutions wielding power need scrutiny, because as the saying goes, "absolute power corrupts absolutely".

While @lethalwl is definitely a "writer," I take exception to the use of the word "reporter", or "journalist"
The use of that term implies the core mission is to bear witness and describe (ie "report") events as they happen.
However Hodinkee are a market player which makes money from the sale and marketing of watches.

1/ Louis' LinkedIn Profile lists his title as "Director of Watch Sales at HODINKEE".
Louis Westphalen | Professional Profile - LinkedIn
https://www.linkedin.com/in/louis-westphalen - Traduire cette page
New York, New York - ‎Director of Watch Sales at HODINKEE, Inc. - ‎HODINKEE, Inc.

2/ He gave an interview in that capacity to a Swiss newspaper (Le Temps de Genève) as recently as June 21
https://www.letemps.ch/economie/2017/06/21/hodinkee-bien-plus-quun-simple-blog-horloger
The article entitled «Hodinkee is much more than a horology blog" cites him as director of watch sales,
highlights his MBA background, and the whole thrust of the piece is to highlight Hodinkee's identity as a sales site, an event organizer, and partner to major watch brands for the design and launch of certain products.

Selling what you write about is NOT journalism or being a "reporter".
In fact it flies in the face of the most basic principles of journalism, and calling Hodinkee writers "reporters" or "journalists" is an insult to those who practice that profession for reasons and causes other than financial gain.

While the practice of journalism today is no longer what it used to be at the Washington Post during the Watergate era, there are more journalists than ever who put their lives at risk in war zones and die trying to inform the public or to document injustices in their countries. (as a matter of fact, several died in Mossul just three weeks ago).
To be fair and as @CajunTiger points out many outlets and publications blur the lines, but Hodinkee has squarely crossed the rubicon.

There's nothing wrong with financial gain, but you can't have your cake and eat it.
Don't call yourself a reporter if you're a sales person.

 

Well said @Syrte.
I like some of Hodinkee's content, and whilst there's nothing wrong about making money through self-promotion, you need to state it clearly.

 

Yes "reporter" was not intended, I meant writer...I posted from my cell.
BTW- Great detective work...looks like you did more research than Hodinkee

I agree with all your points...although keep in mind, the article in question is an ongoing series revealing collectable watches in the market (not Hodinkee related). It was started well before they sold watches. I don't think this specific reference benefits from any more hype.