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eugeneandresson
·I don't use the post office, and I can assure you FedEx isn't "behind" with regards to how international shipping is done.
Post offices are supported carriers, it’s not ‘just FedEx’ 👍
Anyone ever had a (successful) claim with Secursus?
Locked
Post offices are supported carriers, it’s not ‘just FedEx’ 👍
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerPost offices are supported carriers, it’s not ‘just FedEx’ 👍
You do realize it was FedEx that lost the package member Borosilikat sent, right? So FedEx is extremely relevant to the instance you are arguing about.
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eugeneandresson
·You do realize it was FedEx that lost the package member Borosilikat sent, right? So FedEx is extremely relevant to the instance you are arguing about.
I do realize that yes. But I also realize that is fully irrelevant to the T&C as they pertain to all carriers, where most things are similar wrt what’s inside and what’s outside the package.
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerI do realize that yes. But I also realize that is fully irrelevant to the T&C as they pertain to all carriers, where most things are similar wrt what’s inside and what’s outside the package.
Yes, the T&C's pertain to all carriers. And no where in the T&C's does it say that there is a requirement to tell the insurer the declared customs value, and no where does it say that the shipping label must include such information. It's pretty obvious that although "most things are similar" that not all shipping labels look like the postal label you keep referring to, that doesn't even apply here since it wasn't sent by post.
The member in question could have met all the T&C's without showing the insurer the declared customs value, so this whole argument by you is quite honestly a little bizarre.
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eugeneandresson
·Yes, the T&C's pertain to all carriers. And no where in the T&C's does it say that there is a requirement to tell the insurer the declared customs value, and no where does it say that the shipping label must include such information. It's pretty obvious that although "most things are similar" that not all shipping labels look like the postal label you keep referring to, that doesn't even apply here since it wasn't sent by post.
The member in question could have met all the T&C's without showing the insurer the declared customs value, so this whole argument by you is quite honestly a little bizarre.
Firstly, I am not the one arguing here. I made a point about 20 posts ago, which you (and for the life of me, I can't understand why) refuse to see. And I don't feel like dissecting all the strange things that 'the plaintiff' said/assumed, nor the nature of where the package ended up, or why.
Secondly, I believe I have explained that point pretty well since then...and thus the only bizarre and obtuse thing is the fact that you refuse to see that it is in the insurers rights to request proof that the client, upon making a claim, has done everything he agreed to do and that the insurer requested of him, which, as I have highlighted several times, one of those points is tightly coupled to one of the requirement that 'there must be no information on the packaging that could be used to deduce the nature nor value of the Items' : regardless of the carrier, the only 'information on the package' that could make or break this requirement is the customs declaration (and nothing else), and thus it is fully in the insurers right, to request this information! Which (to me) is a no brainer as in the majority of carriers (exluding Fedex perhaps, never use them as I have had bad experiences with them) this information is printed on the shipping label (as I too have illustrated about 15 posts ago), which is the first document they require one to deliver when making a claim (I also furnished you with links and screenshots to this). I really don't know what all the fuss is about...but I can highly recommend you take a deep breath, relax, and enjoy the rest of your Sunday...and agree to disagree if you like, Im fine with it.
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerI made a point about 20 posts ago, which you (and for the life of me, I can't understand why) refuse to see.
I see the point you are trying to make, and the connection you are trying to make to the carrier asking for the declared value.
I fully agree that people should comply to the T&C's that they said they would when they paid for the insurance. Telling the insurer the declared value just isn't one of them, no matter how much you try to make the connection using a postal label that doesn't apply to this situation. So yes certainly we can agree to disagree on this point.
Enjoy your day.
Cheers, Al
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eugeneandresson
·Telling the insurer the declared value just isn't one of them, no matter how much you try to make the connection using a postal label that doesn't apply to this situation.
That’s not the connection at all. The only thing that could compromise that particular point is the customs declaration. And that just happens to be on a lot of labels, but when not, then they apparently ask for it. And I think rightly so, as that’s the only way to prove compliance as the customer (there is no other way). Anyhoo…
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerThat’s not the connection at all. The only thing that could compromise that particular point is the customs declaration. And that just happens to be on a lot of labels, but when not, then they apparently ask for it. And I think rightly so, as that’s the only way to prove compliance as the customer (there is no other way). Anyhoo…
Compliance with what? If the label doesn't show the value for customs, the customer has complied, period. There is no need and no requirement in the T&C's for them to have the customs declared value.
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Joe_A
·The thread title:
Anyone ever had a (successful) claim with Secursus?
And the answer is . . .
Anyone ever had a (successful) claim with Secursus?
And the answer is . . .
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Dan S
·FWIW, I also don't see anything in the T&C about disclosing the customs declaration to the insurer, or even about the amount of customs declaration at all. And I've read them carefully, several times trying to understand where Eugene is coming from.
It seems to me that the relevant part of the T&C is simply emphasizing the point that it is permissible to declare the value of the watch on the customs declaration, but that it should not be visible on the package.
In any case, still waiting for a successful claim.
It seems to me that the relevant part of the T&C is simply emphasizing the point that it is permissible to declare the value of the watch on the customs declaration, but that it should not be visible on the package.
In any case, still waiting for a successful claim.
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eugeneandresson
·FWIW, I also don't see anything in the T&C about disclosing the customs declaration to the insurer, or even about the amount of customs declaration at all. And I've read them carefully, several times trying to understand where Eugene is coming from.
Between 'Article 8' and '8.1' -> The parcel insurance will not apply if the customer does not meet all the following requirements.
Then requirement 3 -> There must be no information on the packaging that could be used to deduce the nature nor the value of the items...
Then common practice -> International parcels have a usual requirement : customs declaration. As far as I know, this is the only bit of 'information on the packaging' (at least to my experience) that could disclose the nature and value of the items. See further description in point 3 -> The customs form is not considered as an indication of the value. Unless it is, which they clearly do not want anywhere outside the package, then you have defaulted (according to the T&C). Well, badly packed items could be 'fingered and guessed'. For that, see point 1 under 8.1.1.
When things go wrong, and making an insurance claim (at least to my experience with travel insurance, household-insurance etc), it is usually up to me, the person making the claim, to furnish all necessary proof to validate that I upheld my end of the deal. I am mighty interested in how y'all might wish to furnish proof of compliance with point 3, other than (if your shipping label doesn't contain it) showing your customs declaration. And if one stubbornly refuse to do this, I believe they are just as stubbornly entitled to assume one did not meet this criteria. 'Spite your face and cut off your nose' as the saying goes.
It seems to me that the relevant part of the T&C is simply emphasizing the point that it is permissible to declare the value of the watch on the customs declaration, but that it should not be visible on the package.
By my reading of 'There must be no information on the packaging that could be used to deduce the nature nor the value of the items...The customs form is not considered as an indication of the value' is in strong disagreement with this statement. But maybe that's just me...
In any case, still waiting for a successful claim.
Me too. And don't get me wrong, I am trying to be 100% neutral here ... I just find it extremely odd that people don't want to prove compliance with the requirements they agreed when taking out the insurance upon when making a claim...
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Dan S
·
Between 'Article 8' and '8.1' -> The parcel insurance will not apply if the customer does not meet all the following requirements.
Then requirement 3 -> There must be no information on the packaging that could be used to deduce the nature nor the value of the items...
Then common practice -> International parcels have a usual requirement : customs declaration. As far as I know, this is the only bit of 'information on the packaging' (at least to my experience) that could disclose the nature and value of the items. See further description in point 3 -> The customs form is not considered as an indication of the value. Unless it is, which they clearly do not want anywhere outside the package, then you have defaulted (according to the T&C). Well, badly packed items could be 'fingered and guessed'. For that, see point 1 under 8.1.1.
When things go wrong, and making an insurance claim (at least to my experience with travel insurance, household-insurance etc), it is usually up to me, the person making the claim, to furnish all necessary proof to validate that I upheld my end of the deal. I am mighty interested in how y'all might wish to furnish proof of compliance with point 3, other than (if your shipping label doesn't contain it) showing your customs declaration. And if one stubbornly refuse to do this, I believe they are just as stubbornly entitled to assume one did not meet this criteria. 'Spite your face and cut off your nose' as the saying goes.
By my reading of 'There must be no information on the packaging that could be used to deduce the nature nor the value of the items...The customs form is not considered as an indication of the value' is in strong disagreement with this statement. But maybe that's just me...
Me too. And don't get me wrong, I am trying to be 100% neutral here ... I just find it extremely odd that people don't want to prove compliance with the requirements they agreed when taking out the insurance upon when making a claim...
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eugeneandresson
·I am reading exactly the same language but my interpretation is the opposite of yours. You have made your point many times now, and I can’t follow it at all. There’s probably no point in continuing.
Maybe a lawyer could help 😀
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Oku
·Also I want to mention that Secursus does not have a telephone number to contact and the only way to communicate with them regarding your claim is through a very awkward to use chat interface that seems more designed for instant messaging with your buddies than dealing with an insurance company.
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerThe customs value is often different to the insured value and it is nothing to do with the insurer, as Al has said. It wouldn't be different if you are selling a watch but, it is when you return a watch after a service, for example. In that case, the receiving country customs are interested in charging duty on the value added during the service - let's say that's €400 and so, the customs declaration essentially shows €400. But the watch may be worth €10000 so it is insured for that.
Indeed, you and I would be sending packages with a different customs value to insured value all the time. For sellers an buyers, this can happen also. For example if I buy watch from someone in another country, we have an agreement on price, fully documented, and the watch is sent to me. I find that for whatever reason it is not as described, and I want to return it. The watch going back to the seller would have zero customs value (as returned goods with no value added while it was out of the country), but would be insured for the full value.
In many cases, the declared value and insured value will be the same, but also in many cases it will not be, and still be perfectly valid.
Cheers, Al
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerWhen things go wrong, and making an insurance claim (at least to my experience with travel insurance, household-insurance etc), it is usually up to me, the person making the claim, to furnish all necessary proof to validate that I upheld my end of the deal. I am mighty interested in how y'all might wish to furnish proof of compliance with point 3, other than (if your shipping label doesn't contain it) showing your customs declaration.
I can't fathom how you are twisting point 3 to conclude that it in any way requires the person to disclose the customs declared value, if it is not on the label.
What is it that Secursus is going to do with this value exactly? How is it relevant to the insured value and payout? The answer is, it isn't.
If it's not on the label, I have held up my part of the agreement, and they should pay. Asking for it is exceeding the requirements of the T&C's, so this appears to be nothing but a ploy to deny coverage. If you are happy to use a company that uses tactics like this, that's your choice, but I wouldn't certainly.
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eugeneandresson
·If it's not on the label, I have not been able to show compliance to one of the points required of me.
FIFY.
Another example of a difference in understanding . . .
My understanding is that we have yet to have an answer to the question.
Oh, guys, pile on why dontcha 🙄
While this is a thread on OF, by definition...
Maybe we should fix the dictionary to ...
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Joe_A
·Piling on?
A question has been put to the community and thus far, there is no case offered up where the question has been answered.
The question is a fair question.
It's very similar to the kind of question put forward here when someone asks of the community: "Has anyone had experience with seller %$#@*& or has anyone bought a watch from %^&)#@?"
"What was the experience like?"
Would you promote a seller with whom you have had no experience?
A question has been put to the community and thus far, there is no case offered up where the question has been answered.
The question is a fair question.
It's very similar to the kind of question put forward here when someone asks of the community: "Has anyone had experience with seller %$#@*& or has anyone bought a watch from %^&)#@?"
"What was the experience like?"
Would you promote a seller with whom you have had no experience?
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