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Cad290
·Nothing stirs up controversy like an Ultraman!!
Another potential Ultraman...
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FlyingSnoopy
·A bid shady for me....
Cheers
Cheers
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Spacefruit
··Prolific Speedmaster HoarderEveryone seems to be getting worked up here, over nothing.
It will be VERY hard to fake an Ultraman.
First, it has to have an extract from Omega, who hold records of these watches, and the individual watches that have had orange chrono hands fitted at the factory have a note in the production record of "Special Equipment" being fitted. While it does not say orange hands in the records I am not entirely sure what other special equipment could go onto a 145.012. A dial for example, is mentioned specifically I believe.
There are VERY few of them. Thats why many serious collectors buy them as they are a solid investment grade watch. I dont know many people paying this much for an Ultraman to wear it for fun, no they are wealth converting.
The hand is a very difficult thing to reproduce. And even if you could, like the 220 bezel, you can fit it to a small number of watches to be correct.
The dial is not confirmed in my experience. It may be so, that there is a special finish on all UM dials originaly, but that is not what you see if you go digging through old photos.
Fake UM's don't scare me.
As for the OP watch, looking at the IG account of the seller, then he definitely knows it is not a UM and I suspect he also knows how the orange hand got there and by whom.
Here is a resource page I put together on UM's. (feel free to suggest improvements, as you know I am fallible and rely on kind souls who know better than me to keep things up to date).
It will be VERY hard to fake an Ultraman.
First, it has to have an extract from Omega, who hold records of these watches, and the individual watches that have had orange chrono hands fitted at the factory have a note in the production record of "Special Equipment" being fitted. While it does not say orange hands in the records I am not entirely sure what other special equipment could go onto a 145.012. A dial for example, is mentioned specifically I believe.
There are VERY few of them. Thats why many serious collectors buy them as they are a solid investment grade watch. I dont know many people paying this much for an Ultraman to wear it for fun, no they are wealth converting.
The hand is a very difficult thing to reproduce. And even if you could, like the 220 bezel, you can fit it to a small number of watches to be correct.
The dial is not confirmed in my experience. It may be so, that there is a special finish on all UM dials originaly, but that is not what you see if you go digging through old photos.
Fake UM's don't scare me.
As for the OP watch, looking at the IG account of the seller, then he definitely knows it is not a UM and I suspect he also knows how the orange hand got there and by whom.
Here is a resource page I put together on UM's. (feel free to suggest improvements, as you know I am fallible and rely on kind souls who know better than me to keep things up to date).
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MCC
·@Spacefruit great response and I think you summed up my feelings exactly, UM's have largely become the preserve of investors in watches rather than those of us that like to wear what we own.
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simonsays
·First, it has to have an extract from Omega, who hold records of these watches, and the individual watches that have had orange chrono hands fitted at the factory have a note in the production record of "Special Equipment" being fitted. While it does not say orange hands in the records I am not entirely sure what other special equipment could go onto a 145.012. A dial for example, is mentioned specifically I believe.
I have never heard this before, and have seen several examples of incorrect looking watches given extracts, notably the Bukowski watch that was given an extract with the wrong serial number, then given one again with a new serial number. Are we to believe both serial numbers applied to watches fitted with special equipment?
Also watches given extracts with no mention of special equipement, then given 'Ultraman' extracts when reapplied for. Why?
When we see a punched card, or some micro fiche with this information mentioned I will believe it. If it is mentioned as you state I wish Omega would release this into the public domain.
Edited:
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kov
·First, it has to have an extract from Omega, who hold records of these watches, and the individual watches that have had orange chrono hands fitted at the factory have a note in the production record of "Special Equipment" being fitted. While it does not say orange hands in the records I am not entirely sure what other special equipment could go onto a 145.012. A dial for example, is mentioned specifically I believe.
That’s a good one. 🤦
To me, the problem is that most of readers here will take this statement as reference and will have no way to verify whether it is correct or not.
I claim BS.
Please explain how can you back your statement.
Nobody at the museum (Petros, David, Alain) as well as the authors of Moonwatch Only have ever mentioned anything of that kind. And Ultraman is with no doubt a topic I’ve discussed with them more than anything else.
Very curious to see where does this come from 😀
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Spacefruit
··Prolific Speedmaster HoarderI too am going on what I was told by a member of Museum staff. I was told the orange hand was not specifically mentioned as a fitment. It was simply mentioned that the watch was fitted with special equipment. Which was why they started asking for photos when this whole UM thing got going. (To see what that special equipment might be or to confirm the Orange hand).
Is my information wrong?
True the rest of what I wrote is speculation regarding what else the special equipment could be. I was under impression that dials, for example were mentioned specifically rather than under special equipment.
So I was really saying that while the mark in the archives might only say special equipment it was likely a correct interpretation that it was an orange hand, because what else could it be?
Now if my information is wrong, that the records mention that the watch left the factory with an orange hand, then I am happy to stand corrected.
And indeed I will be left to wonder why I was told that.
Is my information wrong?
True the rest of what I wrote is speculation regarding what else the special equipment could be. I was under impression that dials, for example were mentioned specifically rather than under special equipment.
So I was really saying that while the mark in the archives might only say special equipment it was likely a correct interpretation that it was an orange hand, because what else could it be?
Now if my information is wrong, that the records mention that the watch left the factory with an orange hand, then I am happy to stand corrected.
And indeed I will be left to wonder why I was told that.
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kov
·I have referred to specific people I am dealing with. @Spacefruit if you dare giving the name of that ‘Member of the Museum staff’, I will gladly double check next time I’m there 😀
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drhex
·Museum told me there is no mention of anything special in the archives and they go by photo. Know of one extract for a watch with white second hand though which was issued as Ultraman, museum could not explain that 👎.
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simonsays
·They are dangerous watches now they are achieving such premium prices. I think there will be a few investors ending up with a case of emperors new clothes, with an extract of archives that has lost its credibility.
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OMEGuy
·Don't know, but when the day comes that I have to think an official Extract of the Archives from OMEGA might be wrong, I will stop collecting watches, I guess.
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Spacefruit
··Prolific Speedmaster HoarderOr you could do this........
A while ago I had this with a missing Chrono, so I put an orange one on. Sacrilege!
But Fun. That's why we are all here right?
Just to be clear, this isn't an Ultraman, but doesn't it look good?
Its a 145.022-69 with an added orange hand.
A while ago I had this with a missing Chrono, so I put an orange one on. Sacrilege!
But Fun. That's why we are all here right?
Just to be clear, this isn't an Ultraman, but doesn't it look good?
Its a 145.022-69 with an added orange hand.
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OMEGuy
·Or you could do this........
A while ago I had this with a missing Chrono, so I put an orange one on. Sacrilege!
But Fun. That's why we are all here right?
Just to be clear, this isn't an Ultraman, but doesn't it look good?
Its a 145.022-69 with an added orange hand.
While your sweep second is too short, I remember this recent thread:
https://omegaforums.net/threads/interesting-speedmaster.90631/
in which the sweep second hand was told to be too long by the experienced members.
Looking at the OP's watch in question, I'd say there are comparable measurements regarding the tip size.
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nttisch23
·Can’t wait to watch this to see how much I can’t afford one 😵💫
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sdre
·There is nothing new about inacuracy and inconsistency on the remarks section of Omega Extracts of Archives.
I remember reading a thread about UM last year October, where there were claims that EOA was issued WITHOUT an orange chronohand, then after speaking to Omega/Museum (i honestly forgot which one), then the EOA was reissued with the statement, about the orange second hand (somewhere along that line)
The gist i got from that thread was that it SEEMED that Omega could switch and change their issuing of EOAs accordingly; which seem to suggest Omega might NOT have the complete information on their side.
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wouter van wijk
·My guess is that this watch will fetch 20k anyhow. It's also a bit with the 6542. People tend to love great stories. Some of the collectors don't care if it is 100% right or just take the risk. And there is always one kid that hasn't done his homework.
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cristos71
·But Fun. That's why we are all here right?
Well, that's how collecting watches started out for me, although the game has certainly changed a lot over the last few years...and not for the better I might add.
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