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Watch returned to chrono24 seller due to defects. Who pays the return shipping?

TexOmega
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Evitzee Evitzee
I think you give to much credence to a 'professional' watch dealer, many dealers just want to push product through the pipeline, they are not professional in assessing, grading or pricing watches. They are salesman, just like those that sell refrigerators, stoves and ovens. It's a product to make money on.


That's cold but true and luckily not 100% true. Closer to 100% than 10%, though. Which sucks.

All arenas not just watches, which sucks, too.


But as a great mind stated many years ago, "this is the BEST of all possible worlds!"

Or words to that effect, paraphrasing there.

(Apologies to V)☕
 
STANDY
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Kargol Kargol
No . It’s a professional dealer


Why are there no professional butchers, bakers or florists.

Nothing professional about a watch seller.
 
Kargol
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Evitzee Evitzee
I think you give to much credence to a 'professional' watch dealer, many dealers just want to push product through the pipeline, they are not professional in assessing, grading or pricing watches. They are salesman, just like those that sell refrigerators, stoves and ovens. It's a product to make money on.
Well I wouldn’t agree 100% on that. Most of the professional sellers I have encountered in chrono24 are really experienced watch sellers...
 
onlyomega94
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I can understand that you are based in Greece. I would assume that the seller is also based in the EU. You state that the seller is a professional - that means that if you are buying as a private person you are a consumer and thus protected by EU consumer law. Having worked at the Danish Consumer Appeals Board, I am fairly sure that consumer law has been standardised throughout the EU, meaning that the seller shall reimburse all costs associated with returning a faulty item (including return shipping) if he or she is based anywhere in the EU.

There are consumer dispute centres in all european countries, this been the Greek: https://www.eccgreece.gr/en/about-us/ecc-greece/

Of course filing a complaint is a bit of a proces and if the cost of return shipping is worth it is up to you but at least now you know that it exists. Good luck.

PS: assessing if the dealer is a professional or not is also a question. Typically having a registered business/VAT number makes you a professional or at least buying and selling with the goal of obtaining a profit. But the dispute centres have legally trained staff that can make that assesment.
 
Gav1967
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onlyomega94 onlyomega94
I can understand that you are based in Greece. I would assume that the seller is also based in the EU. You state that the seller is a professional - that means that if you are buying as a private person you are a consumer and thus protected by EU consumer law. Having worked at the Danish Consumer Appeals Board, I am fairly sure that consumer law has been standardised throughout the EU, meaning that the seller shall reimburse all costs associated with returning a faulty item (including return shipping) if he or she is based anywhere in the EU.

There are consumer dispute centres in all european countries, this been the Greek: https://www.eccgreece.gr/en/about-us/ecc-greece/

Of course filing a complaint is a bit of a proces and if the cost of return shipping is worth it is up to you but at least now you know that it exists. Good luck.

PS: assessing if the dealer is a professional or not is also a question. Typically having a registered business/VAT number makes you a professional or at least buying and selling with the goal of obtaining a profit. But the dispute centres have legally trained staff that can make that assesment.
Maybe I missed the point but thought the OP said the dealer had offered to pay the return costs but C24 will not allow it. His complaint is with the terms C24 are insisting on using.
 
Mad Cow
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Know the return policy before you buy her. If you got refunded for the watch, consider that you are lucky on C24.
 
Gav1967
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Gav1967 Gav1967
Maybe I missed the point but thought the OP said the dealer had offered to pay the return costs but C24 will not allow it. His complaint is with the terms C24 are insisting on using.
I cant help thinking the OP should pay the return costs to C24 and then ask the dealer to refund the cost directly to him outside of C24 and then everyone is happy.... I think
 
onlyomega94
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Gav1967 Gav1967
Maybe I missed the point but thought the OP said the dealer had offered to pay the return costs but C24 will not allow it. His complaint is with the terms C24 are insisting on using.
I missed that. But the point still being that consumer rights in the EU cannot normally be deviated against the consumer, making C24’s terms irrelevant.
 
Gav1967
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onlyomega94 onlyomega94
I missed that. But the point still being that consumer rights in the EU cannot normally be deviated against the consumer, making C24’s terms irrelevant.
Agreed but whatever we say doesn't change anything at C24
 
onlyomega94
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Gav1967 Gav1967
Agreed but whatever we say doesn't change anything at C24
True - at least not until someone takes a complaint all the way through the legal dispute system which is a pain.
 
TDBK
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@Kargol have you tried contacting Chrono24 and asking them to adjust the refund amount because the seller has agreed to cover return shipping, or how you should get it in this case?

Alternately ask the seller to pay for the shipping and send you a waybill; this is actually ideal because it makes the seller the shipper's customer and then if there is a shipping problem that calls for insurance or something, you are not further involved.
 
Kargol
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TDBK TDBK
@Kargol have you tried contacting Chrono24 and asking them to adjust the refund amount because the seller has agreed to cover return shipping, or how you should get it in this case?

Alternately ask the seller to pay for the shipping and send you a waybill; this is actually ideal because it makes the seller the shipper's customer and then if there is a shipping problem that calls for insurance or something, you are not further involved.
I did both your solutions. Two days ago.
I am still waiting for chrono24 reply. They seem like confused now because they usually reply in some hours ...
I am also waiting for the return slip(is it called this way?), by the seller . He also seems confused because he also replied in less than an hour.

or maybe I got them both shortly before the weekend ? I will know on Monday I guess. I hope I get replies from both of them
 
Kargol
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onlyomega94 onlyomega94
I can understand that you are based in Greece. I would assume that the seller is also based in the EU. You state that the seller is a professional - that means that if you are buying as a private person you are a consumer and thus protected by EU consumer law. Having worked at the Danish Consumer Appeals Board, I am fairly sure that consumer law has been standardised throughout the EU, meaning that the seller shall reimburse all costs associated with returning a faulty item (including return shipping) if he or she is based anywhere in the EU.

There are consumer dispute centres in all european countries, this been the Greek: https://www.eccgreece.gr/en/about-us/ecc-greece/

Of course filing a complaint is a bit of a proces and if the cost of return shipping is worth it is up to you but at least now you know that it exists. Good luck.

PS: assessing if the dealer is a professional or not is also a question. Typically having a registered business/VAT number makes you a professional or at least buying and selling with the goal of obtaining a profit. But the dispute centres have legally trained staff that can make that assesment.
Thank you my friend !! Good to know
 
Kargol
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Mad Cow Mad Cow
Know the return policy before you buy her. If you got refunded for the watch, consider that you are lucky on C24.
Why you said that I should consider myself lucky to get a refund? I never had any problems and it’s not my first time. Their service for faulty items or replicas is wonderful. The issue is the return shipping here
 
ZIELSZIEK
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Hi Kargol, I can imagine this sucks and offer you my empathy but here are my two cents on the matter:

1.The return shipping sum is way too small to be worth arguing over(I understand the seller agreed to pay it, but hear me out). I see that it has been mentioned above that in the case of a return, shipping costs are to be supported by the seller(if the item is deffective/misrepresented) according to the EU law.
This, in my opinion, is not valid within all of the EU. Where I live, a return is to be supported by the buyer at all times, even in case of a deffective product. Some companies will pay for it, but that is only a part of their own return policy and has nothing to do with the law. In my country, for example, the only thing that is stated is that in the case of a misrepresentation/faulty product sold by a professional seller(as in registered) it is mandatory for a return to be accepted, provided it is initiated within 14 days of recieval.

2. You will not be able to get Chrono to deviate from their policies(speaking from a veeery recent experience of mine). Despite the buyer having sent the watch to a service center(without my consent) Chrono refused to release the funds to me. I believe they do this in order to not create a precedent, if this is the optimal way to do it or not, I cannot offer any opinion. I know nothing about running a business that has to do with selling watches.

Since the seller offered to pay for the return, I'd just live with the possibly of him not returning that 30 euro sum. I would also make sure to leave negative feedback, since having such flaws in a product, without acknowledging them, is simply carelessness. Maybe even post the name of the seller/dealer here in the feedback section? Let's say that a faulty crown might just be hard to spot, but a bezel?

I hope this works out in your favor.
 
Kargol
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To sum it up , I thank you all for participating . It’s been a very constructive dialogue.

I would like to remind:

1. Chrono24’s policy is that buyers should pay the return shipping for faulty watches.

2. PayPal DOES support buyers and refunds return shipping . They have a limit per usage and per amount, but it’s better than nothing.

3. Try to talk with the seller . To me it didn’t work 100% in the past, but it’s really nice of them and a big plus if they finally agree. To me, most sellers of course agreed to pay return shipping at first, but when they got the watch in their hands they never replied to my emails (so they got a big zero rating from me of course). This mostly happened to me in eBay.

Thanks ,
Panos
 
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