Timing Accuracy Speedmaster

moontag · Jun 3, 2015

Looking for a pre-owned Speedy Pro, and in various offers the Seller states the timekeeping way outside the COSC (-4/+6) specifications. Obviously, anything outside spec would most likely require servicing but is there an upper limit that I should worry about - 50s/d 30s/d 20/s/d etc. - in terms of the health/state of the movement? At what point do I look for a different Speedy or is this a non-issue?

Archer · Jun 3, 2015

Speedmaster Pro's are not COSC movements generally, so Omega specs for the 1861 for example are an average daily rate of between -1 and +11 seconds per day.

Cheers, Al

moontag · Jun 3, 2015

Ahhh. Thank you for clarifying! Admittedly, I'm flying in uncharted airspace.

Archer · Jun 3, 2015

Of course many of the automatic versions are COSC, or have movements that can easily meet the -4 to +6 requirements, so those are options as well. But if you want the manual wind versions, the vast majority of those are not COSC. That doesn't mean they can't be accurate, but they take some work to get there.

Cheers, Al

Maximus84 · Jun 3, 2015

Indeed, there are many examples (mine included) whereby the 1861/3 movement runs much better than COSC. Mine has been running at +1.5spd consistently for the last 3 weeks now. It can be more susceptible to positional variation, however, as Al has expertly explained in the past.

moontag · Jun 3, 2015

Very informative! So, because the Speedy is a workhorse (for lack of a better term), there is no need to worry about the condition of the movement if it is currently at, say, 20s/d (i.e., that is something a servicing will easily be able to correct)?

For clarity: 3570.50 from late 90s to mid-2000s

Archer · Jun 3, 2015

When purchasing a used or vintage watch and considering if you should service it, unless the seller has evidence (not just his word, but a service receipt from Omega or other well known servicer) that it has been serviced recently, I would count on needing a service. If it turns out that it doesn't need a service, consider that a bonus.

The problem with using timekeeping as any sort of indicator is that a watch could be in great shape and running poorly due to not being adjusted well, or not being regulated well, or it could be dried out oils etc. On the slip side, I have shown that a watch that does keep time well isn't necessarily an indication that it doesn't need servicing:

https://omegaforums.net/threads/if-...-does-that-mean-it-doesnt-need-service.20475/

The watch I showed in that thread would have easily run within the -4 to +6 per day tolerances, and yet it was completely dry inside...if I left it to run like that, there is no doubt parts would be damaged.

Cheers, Al

rollee · Jun 7, 2015

I recently picked up a 4 yr old 3570 moonwatch, in the first day it runs at -8s / 24 hours.
After a full wind, the watch looses -12s / 24 hours.

A post here on OF suggest to not fully wind the watch, it now runs -1s / 24 hours, and yesterday it was exact at 0.
I am wondering how come the deviation is this high? It really seems like this watch does not like to be fully winded up.

When the chrono is left on, it runs +2/day.
Does this accuracy seem normal?

moontag · Aug 4, 2015

w/r/t timing: does it matter how I lay the speedmaster down overnight? Flat, on it's side, etc.?

edit: also curious if I should fully wind it daily or just stop at 8-10 turns? It seems like 12-15 turns is what it takes until I can't wind it anymore.

Bruin Watch · Aug 4, 2015

Moontag, from what I've seen so far, the position that you lay it down at night does has an impact... but it varies depending on the watch. I would suggest tracking yours over the course of days/and positions to see for yourself and to make note for future reference! Good luck! 😀

moontag · Aug 5, 2015

thanks for the idea... time to conduct a mini experiment!

STANDY · Aug 5, 2015

moontag
w/r/t timing: does it matter how I lay the speedmaster down overnight? Flat, on it's side, etc.?

edit: also curious if I should fully wind it daily or just stop at 8-10 turns? It seems like 12-15 turns is what it takes until I can't wind it anymore.

Only 12-15 turns on a Speedmaster ? 😒

moontag · Aug 5, 2015

12 is probably too low for estimate purposes (and probably an exaggeration on my part) but the other day I wound it 14/15 winds until it stopped. I will check again over the next few days since I only did 10 winds today.

How many should it take to fully wind the watch from one day to the next?

STANDY · Aug 5, 2015

How old is the watch? Bought new ?

Mine is about 2 years old and I have averaged 30+ a day if I miss a day sometimes 50.

You have to wind it until you can't wind anymore.

moontag · Aug 5, 2015

Hmmm... Now I'm starting to question whether I miscounted. I will pay close attention over the next few days for the exact amount of winds it takes until it stops. Speedy is 3590 cal. 861 from early 90's.

italy1861 · Aug 5, 2015

My Speedy also takes over 30 a day....

moontag · Aug 6, 2015

22 winds this morning... i did let my dad look at the watch on two different days earlier this week. perhaps he wound it up, which would account for the difference. i am going to continue keeping track for a few days. regardless, it's definitely losing time everyday (while i see that others gain time) but i read that is normal for manual wind watches such as a speedy.

i am going to compare the position i lay the watch overnight to see how it relates to number of seconds lost. i suppose each watch has its own "sweet spot" (flat, on its side, etc.) but that is just a guess.

Archer · Aug 6, 2015

Yes, despite those old Rolex cards that tell you what position will gain and what will loose, there is no definite pattern. Each watch will be different in how much in varies and in what positions it might gain, or lose. Keep in mind that it's possible that all positions could be gaining, or all could be losing (again depending on the watch).

Cheers, Al

moontag · Aug 17, 2015

I tested my Speedy for one week. It lost 89 seconds from Sat AM to Sat AM or 12.7 sec/day (ranging from 11 to 14 sec daily). The winding average was about 28 winds/day (low was 26; high was 33). It's fairly consistent day to day so that's good.

Not sure what to make of the results. Speedy is a 3590 from 1993 or so. Thanks for your help!

italy1861 · Aug 17, 2015

Has it ever been serviced? If not, it may be a good time to get it done...

Timing Accuracy Speedmaster

moontag

Archer

moontag

Archer

Maximus84

moontag

Archer

rollee

moontag

Bruin Watch

moontag

STANDY

moontag

STANDY

moontag

italy1861

moontag

Archer

moontag

italy1861

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