Possible new 300m spotted on Daniel Craig

padders · 2024-11-26T12:28:39-0600

redzer007
Does any one have an original Bond SMP, the latest gen and a well graduated measuring cylinder/jug?

I'd genuinely like to know a volumetric comparison (sans bracelet

Yes

But I’m buggered if I’m soaking them for your pleasure! And I can’t be arsed to remove the bracelets either tbh.

I’ve done some good pics comparing the thickness of all the generations before. I’ll find links to that as a consolation prize.

Personally I do think the current watch is too thick and a fraction too big also.

Found it! This very thread in fact but 2 months ago.

https://omegaforums.net/posts/2383435/

padders · Aug 13, 2024

Jakeys
Love this, really puts it into perspective. Wonder if there's any die hards on this forum with one SMP of each gen (Well, first third fourth) they could line up like that? Or even just a first/second and fourth? As the current SMP isn't quite as thick as the PO at 13.6 mm. Though closer to a first gen PO than a first gen SMP by far.

Google fu indicates:

First Gen SMP: 11.5 mm
Second Gen SMP: Unchanged?
Third Gen SMPc: 12.8 mm (+11%)
Fourth Gen SMD: 13.6 mm (+18%)

First Gen PO 42: 14.5 mm
Current Gen PO 43: 16.1 mm

I considered whipping something up in Photoshop, but Omega don't...

Annapolis · 2024-11-26T14:47:48-0600

twizit
…if we're saying that the Sub is the nearest competitor to the Seamaster, then surely the large differences in price have to be factored in?

Depends on how you think about pricing. I’m going on the assumption that it costs roughly the same to make a Submariner as a Seamaster. The price differential is part of the marketing—you’re paying for branding, etc. The Seamaster arguably gives you something substantively better with its exotic escapement, but Rolex is the more “desirable” and “valuable” brand. Which is to say, I look at the branding-pricing factor as a feature of the watch.

The Sub and SM are, to my mind, categorically aligned: both belong to the middle tier of luxury watches—in the 5 to 10k range (give or take), not high horology, mass produced and hype-marketed—steel tool watches with more or less the same specs, and generally appealing to the same buyers. Both have movie tie-ins and celebrity ambassadors. Yes, there a price disparity, but again I’d consider that as just one variable that doesn’t separate them categorically. If that makes sense.

scapa · 2024-11-26T15:45:29-0600

ErichPryde
Here's what I know:

Perfect diameter, lug-to-lug, and good thickness for a "vintage" inspired watch.

I owned a Trilogy SM300, and now the Pro 300m and 300 Heritage. My wrists are 6.75. I can happily wear larger dive watches whilst diving or swimming etc., but for everyday I find the Heritage much more comfortable on the (tapering) bracelet, and still more comfortable on the rubber, though it's close. For me it's more about the L2L and lug curvature profile than about height/ thickness. A Sinn 206 Ar is one of my easiest wears and it's silly-thick for its purpose, but has a relatively compact wrist presence.

I'd be happy with a revised SMP 300m that wore a little thinner, but 13mm and change isn't a dealbreaker for me, given the case shapes. Sinn's U50 and the inevitable BB58 are likely the standard bearers here in terms of blending wearability and diver presence/ utility. A slightly-scaled down 300m that retains the detailed case, dial and adds a soupçon of extra grip to the bezel will sell like hotcakes.

Crappy 2-shot follows...

Vinz Clortho · 2024-11-26T16:31:36-0600

Good perspective is the newer Seamasters gained the Covid 20lbs and never took it back off.

Jakeys · 2024-11-26T18:26:48-0600

josiahg52
For the sake of discussion and comparison, is the Submariner dial ceramic/Cerachrom? 6mm seems awfully thick, but I don't know either. Solid case back, flat crystal, although I wouldn't count the slight dome on the Seamaster or the cyclops on the Submariner in the measurement, either. It adds up when we're talking fractions. The movement values I listed for the movements were found from various calibre websites, articles, and discussions. I tried to find multiple sources so I feel pretty confident.

I only found a couple of articles and I think Caliber Corner referencing that 6 mm movement thickness, for both the Caliber 3130 and 3230. To be honest, I was surprised, I expected the Rolex to be thinner, the usual chat on the net is that the co-axial makes the movements thicker than normal, so I figured the classic Swiss lever Rolex movements would be thinner for sure. Unfortunately, Rolex tends not to give much technical specs, so it's hard to be completely sure.

Fair point on the slight dome of the crystal, I wouldn't want to count that either. But also, inferring from the fact that the full dome bezel on the newer refs added 0.2, fair to say the normal very subtle dome is probably only adding 0.1 or so. I think the edges of the SMP are flush to the bezel where the Sub is flat but slightly proud so it might even out. Either way, I don't think it's a notable contributor.

twizit
I'm not disagreeing nor taking sides in any of this. Quite enjoying the discussion more than anything else.

Anyway, thought it worth pointing out that whilst we're talking about 10-20% differences being important, we should then look at prices. The Sub is often quoted as the obvious competitor but the no date version is £8,050 here in the UK. This compares to the "std" Seamaster at £5,600. Depending which way you want to do the maths, the Seamaster is 30.4% cheaper than the no date Sub. Or from the other perspective the Sub is 43.8% more expensive than the Seamaster. That's a heck of a difference, and especially given the Seamaster at this price has a date complication and a display case back. Plain steel Sub with a date would be £9,000, so the difference becomes even bigger.

I know we don't buy these watches with value for money as our primary driver but if we're saying that the Sub is the nearest competitor to the Seamaster, then surely the large differences in price have to be factored in?

True, hard to argue with that I guess. To be honest, I see the SMP and the Sub as one in the same in terms of quality, I view the Rolex pricing as more marketing and exclusivity than objective superiority over Omega. But yes, that argument in itself is a huge can of worms, and I am sure the guys on TRF are going to be saying something very different. 😜

ErichPryde · 2024-11-26T18:48:35-0600

Jakeys
I only found a couple of articles and I think Caliber Corner referencing that 6 mm movement thickness, for both the Caliber 3130 and 3230. To be honest, I was surprised, I expected the Rolex to be thinner, the usual chat on the net is that the co-axial makes the movements thicker than normal, so I figured the classic Swiss lever Rolex movements would be thinner for sure. Unfortunately, Rolex tends not to give much technical specs, so it's hard to be completely sure.

Fair point on the slight dome of the crystal, I wouldn't want to count that either. But also, inferring from the fact that the full dome bezel on the newer refs added 0.2, fair to say the normal very subtle dome is probably only adding 0.1 or so. I think the edges of the SMP are flush to the bezel where the Sub is flat but slightly proud so it might even out. Either way, I don't think it's a notable contributor.

True, hard to argue with that I guess. To be honest, I see the SMP and the Sub as one in the same in terms of quality, I view the Rolex pricing as more marketing and exclusivity than objective superiority over Omega. But yes, that argument in itself is a huge can of worms, and I am sure the guys on TRF are going to be saying something very different. 😜

I'd bet the low dome adds more like a minimum of 0.6mm. The rise is so deceptive, it doesn't look like much- but it's at least a half mm. If you have calipers getting a caseback to bezel height measure should be easy.... the low dome on the gen 1 heritage is close to ~~0.8mm and I don't think it's much different than the SMP dome.

I don't think the gen 2 heritage is a LOT less "tall..." (than the SMP) here are the measurements (note: the steel caseback on the 75th is less tall than the sapphire display back, hence the variance)

CASEBACK TO BEZEL:

INCL. CRYSTAL, TOTAL HEIGHT

((and for fun: variation caused by engraving on caseback😀)

ErichPryde · 2024-11-26T18:58:17-0600

josiahg52
For the sake of discussion and comparison, is the Submariner dial ceramic/Cerachrom?

No, I believe Rolex uses a brass dial that is lacquered.

Honestly begs the question as to why this new no date SMP has to be as thick as it is, considering it has an aluminum dial and not a ceramic one. Could easily shave off thickness right there... may be the variation between the heritage and SMP thickness as well.

502 to right · 2024-11-26T19:28:51-0600

To me, the winning combo is the 41mm SMP with a tapering bracelet, such as the 20/17 taper Aqua Terra bracelet.

Jakeys · 2024-11-26T19:50:22-0600

ErichPryde
No, I believe Rolex uses a brass dial that is lacquered.

Honestly begs the question as to why this new no date SMP has to be as thick as it is, considering it has an aluminum dial and not a ceramic one. Could easily shave off thickness right there... may be the variation between the heritage and SMP thickness as well.

I think you're right about the brass/lacquered dial. Same as the recent black AT and the white Speedy, I guess. To be honest, I'd prefer if Omega drop the ceramic dial and go to the aluminium one on the new variants for all future models, though I don't know if they will. Not only can it be made thinner, but I think it just looks way better anyway.

I assumed the new no date SMP, being just a variant of the existing gen, is basically just the same watch with slightly different bezel insert and dial. It's probable they could have made that plenty thinner if they wanted but for a variant it wouldn't have been worth the cost and tooling. I don't think we'll really see any significant dimension changes like that until the standard models are refreshed with a new gen.

502 to right
To me, the winning combo is the 41mm SMP with a tapering bracelet, such as the 20/17 taper Aqua Terra bracelet.

Yeah, this is awesome. That suits amazingly well. I hope to see a tapering Bond bracelet one day. I'm convinced it would look great, though some people feel it will look weird. Wait and see I guess.

Which bracelet is this? It looks like it has a typical Seamaster/Speedmaster clasp, but I thought the ATs all had integrated clasps.
EDIT: Never mind, found it in your post history. Very nice. Was hoping maybe something better existed for my 19 mm lug width AT Railmaster. Guess not. 😜

josiahg52 · 2024-11-26T20:21:34-0600

rebar
I think this was directed towards my comment. That is true, but it also looks to me that the watch could not comfortably fit under his shirt cuffs.

If I at 6'4" ~270# with an 8" wrist can get my shirts properly fitted so I can wear a watch with them, so can puny and rich Daniel Craig. If he really wanted to. He's an ambassador, he wears Omega watches because he's paid to, he might even like them, you're supposed to see the watches he wears.

ErichPryde · 2024-11-26T20:52:14-0600

Jakeys
I assumed the new no date SMP, being just a variant of the existing gen, is basically just the same watch with slightly different bezel insert and dial. It's probable they could have made that plenty thinner if they wanted but for a variant it wouldn't have been worth the cost and tooling. I don't think we'll really see any significant dimension changes like that until the standard models are refreshed with a new gen.

Agreed, on all points.

rebar · 2024-11-26T22:11:18-0600

josiahg52
If I at 6'4" ~270# with an 8" wrist can get my shirts properly fitted so I can wear a watch with them, so can puny and rich Daniel Craig. If he really wanted to. He's an ambassador, he wears Omega watches because he's paid to, he might even like them, you're supposed to see the watches he wears.

Ha fair point. Sorry to say it’s not one that moves me much but it was a funny way to put it.

Of course Craig has shirts that allow him to fit that watch under his cuff. The White Speedy looked very elegant on him. No comical tugging up of his sleeves to do it. Many shirts I enjoy wearing would not fit this SMP300 under their cuff and that’s something that is important to me.

Difference between me and Craig is that while we both like Omega watches, I pay to wear them. As do most people. My opinion about the thickness isn’t a unique one.

I’m glad you get your shirts properly fitted. Lets not make this about one’s ability to have shirts properly fitted.

josiahg52 · 2024-11-27T02:10:07-0600

rebar
Ha fair point. Sorry to say it’s not one that moves me much but it was a funny way to put it.

Of course Craig has shirts that allow him to fit that watch under his cuff. The White Speedy looked very elegant on him. No comical tugging up of his sleeves to do it. Many shirts I enjoy wearing would not fit this SMP300 under their cuff and that’s something that is important to me.

Difference between me and Craig is that while we both like Omega watches, I pay to wear them. As do most people. My opinion about the thickness isn’t a unique one.

I’m glad you get your shirts properly fitted. Lets not make this about one’s ability to have shirts properly fitted.

Definitely a concern I share when they try and put me in those Euro cut shirts, slim-fit or sporty shirts, whatever they're called. Even my old SM300 won't fit. I politely refuse. I always have to get my jackets let out a bit because I'm usually carrying a Glock or H&K. I like wearing watches and have other requirements so I surely try and make sure my wardrobe "fits" my choices whenever I can. Fortunately, most of my life, relatively speaking, is spent in simple t-shirts and jeans. Life's too short to wear ill-fitting shirts!

I do wonder how pervasive - if that's the word - the agreement is. Does Omega insist on ol' Danny using that tape what women use to help keep their strapless attire in place to keep his shirt cuff in place. Poor guy. Might as well be one of those watch stands in the display case.

Possible new 300m spotted on Daniel Craig

padders

Annapolis

scapa

Vinz Clortho

Jakeys

ErichPryde

ErichPryde

502 to right

Jakeys

josiahg52

ErichPryde

rebar

josiahg52

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