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Opinions sought for this 105.012

L
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Hi all,
I am relatively new to this forum and I read more than I post. In fact, I have been silently looking for a 105.012 for a few months now. I recently chanced upon this. I like the look of the entire ensemble but my relatively untrained eyes tell me that at least the bracelet and the caseback don't seem to originally belong to this speedy. I would like to seek the collective advices of the forum experts here. All opinions are welcome, especially if you see anything not right please. Opinions on an appropriate valuation are also much appreciated. Thanks in advance.
IMG-20190916-WA0002.jpg IMG-20190916-WA0009.jpg IMG-20190916-WA0019.jpg IMG-20190920-WA0036.jpg IMG-20190916-WA0010.jpg IMG-20190920-WA0037.jpg IMG-20190916-WA0011.jpg IMG-20190916-WA0001.jpg IMG-20190916-WA0005.jpg IMG-20190916-WA0015.jpg IMG-20190916-WA0016.jpg IMG-20190916-WA0007.jpg IMG-20190916-WA0017.jpg IMG-20190916-WA0008.jpg IMG-20190916-WA0013.jpg IMG-20190916-WA0021.jpg
 
padders
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Why do you think the caseback is wrong?
 
Screwbacks
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i dont blame you for entertaining some doubts as this could cost you a limb since this is among highly sought speedies. for your satisfaction, check the serial number vis-a-vis the omega serial and year verifier to confirm your question. if that nice piece came from any of the OF members, i have no doubt it's authentic.馃槈
 
vienna
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This looks like a relume to me but wait for the experts opinion. Especially the markers at 9 and 10.

Kind regards Max
 
gemini4
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IMHO, 66 caseback is incorrect with the movement number.
 
padders
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gemini4 gemini4
IMHO, 66 caseback is incorrect with the movement number.
Yes it is early for a 66. Didn鈥檛 check that before my earlier question but it could a swapped movement rather than caseback of course.
 
Passover
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vienna vienna
This looks like a relume to me but wait for the experts opinion. Especially the markers at 9 and 10.

Kind regards Max


upload_2019-9-21_14-56-25.png


The two 12 o'clock plots look strange...

Could the hands be relumed? I had heared that if the lume doesn't fill the sweeping hand completely this indicates a relume
Lume colour on the hands look in general strange to me...
 
kelev_ra
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I am not sure if relumed. Tend to say it is not. It is polished though, has a nice Don, a bracelet in really nice condition - so overall I would just say it is a really really attractive watch.
 
L
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The serial number falls within the 105.012-65 range and yes, the case is seemingly polished even to my untrained eyes. I would have not picked up the signs of a possible relumed dial and hands if I had not sought the advices here....
 
padders
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I personally think it鈥檚 relumed, it鈥檚 the uniformity, it looks like J Hyman鈥檚 (very good) work. It鈥檚 attractive all the same. Might just be a hand relume though.
 
aginoz
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Would have expected a 23m serial but the extract confirm its 1966 and the case back is consistent. The case has been polished a few times. There is minor lume loss in the minute hand - I鈥檇 leave it alone. The deep scratch on the insert needs to be checked to make sure it is not cracked through. IMO the lume on the dial is original. The 1039 looks complete and in good shape. Overall a solid piece.
 
padders
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aginoz aginoz
Would have expected a 23m serial but the extract confirm its 1966 and the case back is consistent. The case has been polished a few times. There is minor lume loss in the minute hand - I鈥檇 leave it alone. The deep scratch on the insert needs to be checked to make sure it is not cracked through. IMO the lume on the dial is original. The 1039 looks complete and in good shape. Overall a solid piece.
The extract does not confirm that it is a -66, the serial is too early and more usual for a -65. This is why there is speculation either the caseback or movement have been swapped. Neither MWO or SP101 think that serial is right for a -66

ps I have never ever personally seen a 23m serial Speedy.
Edited:
 
mr_yossarian
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Looks pretty consistent, except for the caseback. The serial clearly tells it's in the batch range for a -65.
 
kingsrider
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Has the OP purchased the watch or is this a pre-purchase due diligence inquiry?. What is the price?.
I do not understand why one of the most important aspects of these inquiries is left out of the discussion.
If the OP has already purchased the watch and is asking for a valuation, then he need not look any further than the sales receipt for the value.
 
Nla91
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I believe the hands are relume. I don't like the look of them and the colour. Some 65's tend to turn orange on the chronohand, but not the minute and hour hands.
Have you seen the tip of the hour hand? It has lost its orange colour. If they were original tritium hands with lume loss, I would expect to see through the hand. This looks like they were fixed and painted on top.
Sk忙rmbillede 2019-09-21 kl. 22.01.28.png
 
L
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kingsrider kingsrider
Has the OP purchased the watch or is this a pre-purchase due diligence inquiry?. What is the price?.
I do not understand why one of the most important aspects of these inquiries is left out of the discussion.
If the OP has already purchased the watch and is asking for a valuation, then he need not look any further than the sales receipt for the value.
I have not purchased the watch yet as I am unsure on the originality of the parts. Asking price from seller is about 10k Euro, including the bracelet and extract. Key thing to me now is whether the dial (and hands) has been relumed? This has a huge bearing on the watch valuation...
 
L
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Dan S Dan S
Can you request UV pics?
I surely can try. But if I were the seller, I would like to know what is offer price first since I have been going to and fro with him on some of these observations that I have gathered.
I am thinking that a fair valuation of the price of this watch, if hands and dial have not been relumed (and shown via a UV exposure video showing how fast the lume dies off) will be in the right range of the seller鈥檚 asking price. Hope to hear advices from the forum please. Thanks
 
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