Just how rare is this ?

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It makes me wonder whether this watch belongs in this thread
https://omegaforums.net/threads/fab-suisse-roll-call.20625/page-5#post-1691281
It was after all imported into France
Could the case be French ? Could it have been made and assembled there then taken to the Assay office as a complete watch ? Information on this hallmark suggests it is a guarantee mark for gold standard stamped on a complete item, maybe it was used on imported items but also French items assembled and complete when produced for assessment?

Sorry, no it doesn't belong there. Your dial isn't signed Fab.Suisse or equivalent and that's actually what the thread is about.

I get a little bit of the feeling that you're now hoping for something 'rare' that just isn't there. I don't see anything that makes me believe that the case has anything to do with Omega, be it Swiss or French. If you look through the Fab.Suisse roll call thread you will see many examples of the French Omega precious metal cases and they generally have the same old Omega logo, French case number and various assay marks. Unfortunately yours has none of those things.
 
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Sorry, no it doesn't belong there. Your dial isn't signed Fab.Suisse or equivalent and that's actually what the thread is about.

I get a little bit of the feeling that you're now hoping for something 'rare' that just isn't there. I don't see anything that makes me believe that the case has anything to do with Omega, be it Swiss or French. If you look through the Fab.Suisse roll call thread you will see many examples of the French Omega precious metal cases and they generally have the same old Omega logo, French case number and various assay marks. Unfortunately yours has none of those things.
Well it does have a french hallmark albeit not an eagle head. I noticed a french Connie on the thread that isn’t a Fab. Suisse and although different, it has a connection to the French market.
Yes I’m a little disappointed but it’s still an oddity all the same. I’ve had enough Omegas though my hands over the years to know that the quality is there even if the name isn’t.
It’s a cracking watch whatever and although it may not be worth anymore after all the research, it’s still rare and I’d say it’s better than a redailed Omega 😀
 
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Well it does have a french hallmark albeit not an eagle head. I noticed a french Connie on the thread that isn’t a Fab. Suisse and although different, it has a connection to the French market.
Yes I’m a little disappointed but it’s still an oddity all the same. I’ve had enough Omegas though my hands over the years to know that the quality is there even if the name isn’t.
It’s a cracking watch whatever and although it may not be worth anymore after all the research, it’s still rare and I’d say it’s better than a redailed Omega 😀
Enjoy it for what it is! I had a stunning 18k Omega Geneve in a locally made case. Probably of Italian or Spanish making. I sold it for a small loss 2/3 years later BUT I had all that time to enjoy it. It was a purchase early into my collecting hobby and whilst I look for the properly marked cases these days I don’t regret having owned it! For it was part of my journey and led to greater things 😀
 
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Well I bit the bullet, I wish I hadn’t 😁
Good news and bad
Good News, followed @Bill Sohne advice and used a razor blade without damaging the case. I took my time and didn’t force it at all just slowly worked the razor blade round till it popped off, phew 😀

Ok, it’s not an Omega case 🙁 and the movement is a 265 (11.7M)
It is stamped 18k,7.50 along with a few other marks. It surely can’t be French if it’s stamped with a French Import mark
View attachment 1139913

I’ve been looking for any info on these marks inside the case but without success, hopefully someone will recognise them ?
Here you go. Kind regards, Gary
View attachment 1139914

Hi Gary

Please post a photo of your movement as well..... might give some more insight.

It is what it is ..... unsigned 18k gold cased Omega ....

Good Hunting
Bill
 
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Hi Gary

Please post a photo of your movement as well..... might give some more insight.

It is what it is ..... unsigned 18k gold cased Omega ....

Good Hunting
Bill

Hi Bill
Movement picture
Best regards
Gary
Edited:
 
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Hi Bill
Movement picture
Best regards
Gary
Hi Thanks...

was looking for IMPORT MARK or something else that might have given additional info.... but nothing else to gather....

Best regards
bill
 
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Hi Thanks...

was looking for IMPORT MARK or something else that might have given additional info.... but nothing else to gather....

Best regards
bill
Was it OXG you were looking for ? Would you expect to see that on a U.S./S. American domestic cased movement?
 
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Was it OXG you were looking for ? Would you expect to see that on a U.S./S. American domestic cased movement?

OXG is the US import code for Omega watches and or movements. One would not see OXG on a South American watch.
 
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Was it OXG you were looking for ? Would you expect to see that on a U.S./S. American domestic cased movement?
Hi Flip

was looking to see if maybe the movement was marked fab suisse.... as a last chance that maybe the movement was for the French market .

good hunting

bill
 
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OXG is the US import code for Omega watches and or movements. One would not see OXG on a South American watch.
So assume this coding system is peculiar to the U.S. ? Thanks
 
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So assume this coding system is peculiar to the U.S. ? Thanks

Yes, that's why it's called the US import code. 👍
 
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Yes, that's why it's called the US import code. 👍
Well I asked for that didn’t I 🤪 What I meant was, did any other country use anything similar?
 
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Hi Flip

was looking to see if maybe the movement was marked fab suisse.... as a last chance that maybe the movement was for the French market .

good hunting

bill

No it would appear the only connection is the import into France, Loire-Atlantique to be precise

 
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Hello,

I do not think anything in the watch can be related to one French department in particular. The Owl is an import hallmark - or a hallmark for unknown origin items. That’s it! Your watch is still nice and still has an interesting size, but it has no more relationship to the French market.

Cheers,
François
 
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Hello,

I do not think anything in the watch can be related to one French department in particular. The Owl is an import hallmark - or a hallmark for unknown origin items. That’s it! Your watch is still nice and still has an interesting size, but it has no more relationship to the French market.

Cheers,
François
Hi François,
I feel we’ve had this conversation before but to reiterate the owl hallmark carries a number on its chest. Each Assay office has its own number. Paris has the number 75 as per previous photo posted. Mine has the number 44 on its chest which is the number for Loire -Atlantique
Regards
Gary
 
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Hi Gary,

You are right! We discussed this issue before, but I wanted to point that, even IF the 44 really refers to the French departement which has this number, it would only tell that your watch has been assayed in that place. It would not have any other particular relationship with that departement.

By the way, I said "IF" because I am not sure of the meaning of the number on the chest of the owl. Like you, I have read online that this number relates to the assay office which tested the gold item, and that 75 refers to Paris' assay. It may be true even if I have not found any official proof of that statement. But I wonder if any French departement had its own assay office. Today, there are 10 "bureaux de garantie" in France - including the ones outside the metropole - and I would be surprised if there were about 100 of them by the past. Thus I am not sure that 44 actually refers to one particular departement. But it is only a doubt I have: I have not found yet any clear data concering this issue.

Best regards,
François
Edited:
 
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Hi Gary,

You are right! We discussed this issue before, but I wanted to point that, even IF the 44 really refers to the French departement which has this number, it would only tell that your watch has been assayed in that place. It would not have any other particular relationship with that departement.

By the way, I said "IF" because I am not sure of the meaning of the number on the chest of the owl. Like you, I have read online that this number relates to the assay office which tested the gold item, and that 75 refers to Paris' assay. It may be true even if I have not found any official proof of that statement. But I wonder if any French departement had its own assay office. Today, there are 10 "bureaux de garantie" in France - including the ones outside the metropole - and I would be surprised if there were about 100 of them by the past. Thus I am not sure that 44 actually refers to one particular departement. But it only a doubt I have: I have not found yet any clear data concering this issue.

Best regards,
François

Hi François,
I forwarded your reply to a French contract who is currently researching the history of French cases, this was his reply ....

“Hi, very interesting, I would agree that it’s highly unlikely that each department had its own assay office, but since the watches which were indeed treated by the parisian office were marked with the number 75, I’d say it’s not a coincidence. My guess is that the 44 on your watch means that the watch was treated by the Loire-Atlantique assay office but that doesn’t mean that the watch was necessarily sold in that department”

We agree that it was a complete watch of unknown origin when it was stamped at the assay office 👍
It’s an odd one whatever it’s history

More research needed, which to me is all part of the fun of owning vintage Watches 😀
 
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Thank you for your answer, Gary! I would tend to agree with your friend, although we cannot be sure that 44 refers exactly to one
Hi François,
I forwarded your reply to a French contract who is currently researching the history of French cases, this was his reply ....

“Hi, very interesting, I would agree that it’s highly unlikely that each department had its own assay office, but since the watches which were indeed treated by the parisian office were marked with the number 75, I’d say it’s not a coincidence. My guess is that the 44 on your watch means that the watch was treated by the Loire-Atlantique assay office but that doesn’t mean that the watch was necessarily sold in that department”

We agree that it was a complete watch of unknown origin when it was stamped at the assay office 👍
It’s an odd one whatever it’s history

More research needed, which to me is all part of the fun of owning vintage Watches 😀

departement.

There is indeed still much to find is this topic!
 
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Ok, just a little update
The unusual marks inside the case are similar but not identical to some I’ve seen in other Swiss cases such as Movado though as stated not identical so not conclusive.
I decided to contact David Boettcher FBHI to see if he could shed any light on the case.
For those of you not familiar with David, here is a link to his very informative website

https://www.vintagewatchstraps.com/casemarks.php

To reiterate I could not understand why this watch WAS imported into France as a complete watch, not as a raw movement. After some correspondence sending images of the case and movement and waiting for a response I eventually received a reply from David confirming that “the case would have been made in Switzerland” 😀
Now, I know it’s not signed Omega but I don’t think it’s unreasonable to assume that the case maker wasn’t obligated to stamp Omega into the case at that time. We are talking circa 1948/9 and it is well documented that Dennison and at least one other Omega contracted maker (JPB) didn’t stamp their cases Omega during this period.

As David is a leading authority in this field I’m happy with his assessment.

As a footnote I would add that the quality of the case is as good as any other Omega case of the period. The design is similar/identical ?? to the 2609/2181 Jumbo references, it’s just not stamped as such. Still a 100% original Bobby Dazzler though
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