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issue with UG for sale here

bgrisso
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@shoota70

no offense intended to you, as you are probably not aware, but the UG TDMP you have listed for sale is, IMO, a redial. You may wish to revise the listing to avoid any potential issues with an unsatisfied buyer.

I assume other members here will agree with my assessment, which may also help to lend credibility to these concerns.

https://omegaforums.net/threads/universal-geneve-white-gold-triple-date-moonphase.144500/

Example below is a SS TDMP with original dial, you can see the numerous differences and overall drastic difference in dial printing quality, especially if you zoom in. Of course not all original UG TDMP dials are the same, but that is not the issue here.
 
_F6F0404_adj.jpg
Zapatta
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I own only one simple UG but can tell from a plane that this one is redialed.
 
sleepyastronaut
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Was the seller claiming it as an original dial? The listing doesn't currently make that claim.

Are you going to report all the other redials for sale here? You the redial police?

There's no prohibition on selling redials, and there's no requirement that seller's state whether watches are redialed. If the listing doesn't state the dial is original, assume it has been redialed, and move on with your life.

Please, save the energy for sellers who claim the dial is original when it isn't.
 
Mark020
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sleepyastronaut sleepyastronaut
If the listing doesn't state the dial is original, assume it has been redialed
I follow your reasoning here but - let's call it forum politeness - I assume that at OF one should say it
 
sleepyastronaut
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Mark020 Mark020
I follow your reasoning here but - let's call it forum politeness - I assume that at OF one should say it

Your assumption is unfounded, redials are quietly bought and sold here everyday
 
Mark020
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Let's agree to disagree
 
Woops
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sleepyastronaut sleepyastronaut
There's no prohibition on selling redials, and there's no requirement that seller's state whether watches are redialed. If the listing doesn't state the dial is original, assume it has been redialed, and move on with your life.

I look at it the other way. I’m not sure how much time you spend in this particular sub-forum but we regularly discuss all aspects of watches on sale in the wider market, including those that are redialled. Are you saying that, paradoxically, watches offered on this very website have a special exemption and should receive a lower level of collector scrutiny?
 
tyrantlizardrex
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sleepyastronaut sleepyastronaut
Was the seller claiming it as an original dial? The listing doesn't currently make that claim.

Are you going to report all the other redials for sale here? You the redial police?

There's no prohibition on selling redials, and there's no requirement that seller's state whether watches are redialed. If the listing doesn't state the dial is original, assume it has been redialed, and move on with your life.

Please, save the energy for sellers who claim the dial is original when it isn't.

Discussion of items for sale is not allowed on the sale listing themselves, but discussion of them elsewhere on the forum is not prohibited.

@bgrisso is discussing a concern and inviting other people to get involved in the conversation.

There's nothing wrong with that, and it's helpful for people who are new to the hobby, or unfamiliar with the watch (type) in question to have that information available.

As to saving energy - if you didn't like this topic, you didn't need to comment on it, and yet here you are "wasting energy".
 
rincondeltiempo
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sleepyastronaut sleepyastronaut
Was the seller claiming it as an original dial? The listing doesn't currently make that claim.
I think he was implicitly claiming it was original by setting the price. Otherwise it would've been much lower IMHO.
 
DirtyDozen12
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tyrantlizardrex tyrantlizardrex
There's nothing wrong with that, and it's helpful for people who are new to the hobby, or unfamiliar with the watch (type) in question to have that information available.

As to saving energy - if you didn't like this topic, you didn't need to comment on it, and yet here you are "wasting energy".
Took the words right out of my mouth.
 
TheGreekPhysique
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sleepyastronaut sleepyastronaut
Was the seller claiming it as an original dial? The listing doesn't currently make that claim.

Are you going to report all the other redials for sale here? You the redial police?

There's no prohibition on selling redials, and there's no requirement that seller's state whether watches are redialed. If the listing doesn't state the dial is original, assume it has been redialed, and move on with your life.

Please, save the energy for sellers who claim the dial is original when it isn't.

The discrepancy in expectations between two members on the same forum is jarring. Call me crazy but my expectation when perusing listings on this forum is that the dial is original unless otherwise stated - not the other way around. If that's the case I have some listings I need to amend.

The only exception that I view as acceptable would be if the seller obviously did not know that the watch he was listing was not original. The contrary would be indicative of deception and much larger issue.
 
Evitzee
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rincondeltiempo rincondeltiempo
I think he was implicitly claiming it was original by setting the price. Otherwise it would've been much lower IMHO.
Every seller can set their own price. The price doesn't imply anything about the piece and if you are making assumptions about the watch based on price you are bound to be disappointed . If you don't like the price just move on. I see lots of prices that I think are fanciful, but the seller can ask whatever he wants, it's his property.

It seems to me this would have been better handled with a PM to the seller if the OP was upset about something, but if I was the seller I would have told him to go pound sand.
 
cvalue13
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TheGreekPhysique TheGreekPhysique
Call me crazy but my expectation when perusing listings on this forum is that the dial is original unless otherwise stated -

I would, respectfully, call you crazy 😁

Unless someone explicitly claims the dial is original, I would instead assume only that the diligence is up to you.

This point, by the way, being a separate if not unrelated to the point from this thread’s current discussion.
 
Dan S
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Evitzee Evitzee
It seems to me this would have been better handled with a PM to the seller if the OP was upset about something, but if I was the seller I would have told him to go pound sand.

Perhaps that already happened, and the OP decided to start a thread for a group discussion. I believe it's permitted. He did not mention the price.

In any case, I agree that the dial has been refinished on the watch that is listed, and I think that it's conventional to disclose major issues in OF listings. Not required, of course. But some degree of self-policing helps maintain the integrity of the listings.
 
Engee
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I haven't purchased from OF yet but one of the things that would encourage me, as a newbie to the hobby, is the belief that listings are made with integrity. It's clear that serious collectors such as congregate here, make a clear distinction between original and redials, yet redials are often difficult to discern. People like me rely on the expertise of other members here to help with this. It may be a mistake, but it's implicit to me that listings are transparent and that a redial will be noted as such. I don't want to be interested in a watch for sale here, and feel the need to post separately to ask if the watch is a good'n.
 
bgrisso
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I'm surprised to see the amount of drama this is generating. I noticed an obvious redial, I asked the Mods what should be done, they suggested I start a thread pointing out the issue, I did so, end of story

F*&^ me I guess, according to some people here.

I could have written the seller, but in my experience this is likely to get bogged down in disagreement between two points of view, and in any event, I was just following Mods suggestion.
 
Davidt
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What utter tosh.

If a watch is being sold on OF and is a redial it should of course be disclosed in the description. As above, the only valid reason for not disclosing it is if the seller is in fact themselves unaware.
 
bgrisso
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sleepyastronaut sleepyastronaut
Was the seller claiming it as an original dial? The listing doesn't currently make that claim.

Are you going to report all the other redials for sale here? You the redial police?

There's no prohibition on selling redials, and there's no requirement that seller's state whether watches are redialed. If the listing doesn't state the dial is original, assume it has been redialed, and move on with your life.

Please, save the energy for sellers who claim the dial is original when it isn't.

I'm not sure what your problem is, but I couldn't disagree more with virtually everything you are stating. All members of OF are the collective OF police, that's what makes this place special. If you want a forum where it's buyer beware, I believe you are in the extreme minority.
 
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