Community Stories

First Omega, but I think I was sold a 'Franken' watch.

Archer
Posts
27,313
Likes
69,667
F FinalTuna
To clarify further, I always did allow for the possibility that it was correct. But even if it is right, it's still not the reference marketed to me.

But it is - as per your first post...

F FinalTuna
Omega 2501.81.00

That is exactly the reference you have purchased. That reference can contain either an 1120 or an 1109.

F FinalTuna
While I would own a 1109, they are certainly less desirable, looking at eBay, they take longer to sell, and is therefore worth a somewhat less than what I paid for it. At the end of the day, the dealer is responsible for accurate listings and not the buyer.

Please show us the listing. While I agree that the seller is responsible for accurately listing the watch, they aren't responsible for you going on a wild goose chase that came to completely wrong conclusions, such as this:

F FinalTuna
At this point, I start googling for all the dial color varieties and quickly realize that I have watch with a dial and hands swapped. That dial and that reference don't overlap at all, and I also have gotten a 1109, which is inferior in many ways to the 1120. So I don't have the watch I've ordered, and worse yet, it's got a dial from a completely different watch.

The bottom line is that you received a 25018100. The only thing that you didn't count on was that it was an older version with an 1109, instead of an 1120.
 
sathomasga
Posts
425
Likes
792
F FinalTuna
To clarify further, I always did allow for the possibility that it was correct. But even if it is right, it's still not the reference marketed to me. While I would own a 1109, they are certainly less desirable, looking at eBay, they take longer to sell, and is therefore worth a somewhat less than what I paid for it. At the end of the day, the dealer is responsible for accurate listings and not the buyer.

Definitely. If the listing explicitly said 1120, then the watch was not as advertised. A refund is in order. I don't see any evidence of malintent on the part of the seller, though. In my experience, if you list an item on C24 and enter the reference, C24 will auto-fill many of the details. So the error could well be on C24. Though of course the seller is ultimately responsible.

FWIW, even Omega itself seems to be confused on this topic. So, per the thread title, I don't think you were sold a "Franken" watch.
Edited:
 
Kwijibo
Posts
1,865
Likes
2,273
I agree on one thing, if it was sold as a 1120 and not a 1109 the listing is factually wrong. I just meant that the fact that it's a 1109 does not make it a crappy watch.
Appart from the oscillating weight and it's bridge the movement is almost the same based on a 2892
 
Archer
Posts
27,313
Likes
69,667
sathomasga sathomasga
FWIW, even Omega itself seems to be confused on this topic.

What does this mean? I don't think Omega is confused on anything here - the OP certainly is.
 
Dan S
Posts
20,055
Likes
46,680
The whole thread smacks of buyer's remorse, and making up reasons to justify a return. If you want to return it, just return it.
 
F
Posts
15
Likes
3
Dan S Dan S
The whole thread smacks of buyer's remorse, and making up reasons to justify a return. If you want to return it, just return it.

Sure, no buyer wants to deal with this issue, I've already returned it.
 
F
Posts
15
Likes
3
I'm already on the search for a replacement with a higher (newer) serial number. And before anyone else wants to speak on behalf of the seller, let me ask you this question. As someone who often resells watches (me personally) if I sold it to you, do you think I wouldn't know what movement was actually inside the case? Do you think I would hold that information from you? That answer to that question, is no.

Not only that, but it looks like most of you are are also unsure/can't actually prove anything, which I think means we are looking through a dark glass into a pre-internet Omega that hasn't existed for over 20 years. The only real fix for this problem, is for Omega to start offering a 220.10.41.21.03.004, shrunk down to a 36mm, with different indices and a minute hand that doesn't look like a certain male appendage. They start selling that and I will buy it at MSRP.
 
Archer
Posts
27,313
Likes
69,667
F FinalTuna
I'm already on the search for a replacement with a higher (newer) serial number. And before anyone else wants to speak on behalf of the seller, let me ask you this question. As someone who often resells watches (me personally) if I sold it to you, do you think I wouldn't know what movement was actually inside the case? Do you think I would hold that information from you? That answer to that question, is no.

Not only that, but it looks like most of you are are also unsure/can't actually prove anything, which I think means we are looking through a dark glass into a pre-internet Omega that hasn't existed for over 20 years. The only real fix for this problem, is for Omega to start offering a 220.10.41.21.03.004, shrunk down to a 36mm, with different indices and a minute hand that doesn't look like a certain male appendage. They start selling that and I will buy it at MSRP.

Again, please post the ad for the watch you bought...
 
sathomasga
Posts
425
Likes
792
F FinalTuna
I just want to put this out here as a warning, even if you have been doing this for a long time, Franken watches like this are extremely challenging to spot,

Hmmm. So the point of this thread was to warn us about franken watches by describing the purchase and return of a watch that almost certainly is not a franken watch? Thanks for the warning I guess.
 
F
Posts
15
Likes
3
Archer Archer
Again, please post the ad for the watch you bought...

Not sure why you want to see that? Anyway, it's a lazy mistake but I don't think the seller would like being indexed by the great eye of google and tied to this thread. Simply not going to do that.
 
F
Posts
15
Likes
3
sathomasga sathomasga
Hmmm. So the point of this thread was to warn us about franken watches by describing the purchase and return of a watch that almost certainly is not a franken watch? Thanks for the warning I guess.

It could also be a warning that this is normal and nothing to worry about. Lots of discovery going on here, therefore a valuable thread. These watches are starting to grow in popularity again, nothing wrong with this discussion the way I see it.
 
padders
Posts
9,500
Likes
14,985
OP, you may have a point but as it is you come across as a bit of a wanker so either post the original ad you bought from or just piss off.
 
Scarecrow Boat
Posts
6,146
Likes
25,702
Archer Archer
Again, please post the ad for the watch you bought...
F FinalTuna
Not sure why you want to see that?
You have claimed this watch is a franken and what you bought isn’t what was advertised…
F FinalTuna
it's clearly not what was advertised
It’s been pointed out that the watch you received is genuine. So, if the watch isn’t what was advertised, share the ad…
 
sathomasga
Posts
425
Likes
792
FWIW, I don't have much of a problem believing that the listing described the movement as an 1120. As noted, that could simply be nothing more than the result of a Chrono24 autofill. Although the seller is ultimately responsible for the accuracy of their listings, I wouldn't really fault them for what could be considered a minor mistake.

I do have some takeaways:

1. Omega (and other brands) routinely upgrade the movements in their long-lived references. If, as a buyer, the specific movement matters to you, best to confirm before purchase.
2. When something seems to go amiss in a transaction, it's probably worth exercising a little humility and not leaping to the conclusion that the other party has commited intentional fraud. You might be the one that's mistaken.
3. Likewise, it's also worth treating information on the internet, even (especially?) from Omega's vintage database, with some skepticism. At the very least it's unwise to assume any particular source is comprehensive. (Maybe @Archer is an exception; I'd certaintly trust him pretty much completely.)
Edited:
 
Archer
Posts
27,313
Likes
69,667
F FinalTuna
Not sure why you want to see that? Anyway, it's a lazy mistake but I don't think the seller would like being indexed by the great eye of google and tied to this thread. Simply not going to do that.

Given how far off the mark all your research was, I would like confirmation that the advert actually said it was an 1120, or if this was simply your expectation.
 
Dan S
Posts
20,055
Likes
46,680
F FinalTuna
It could also be a warning that this is normal and nothing to worry about. Lots of discovery going on here, therefore a valuable thread.
There is definitely a warning in this thread, but maybe not the one you're thinking of.
 
southtexas
Posts
932
Likes
1,283
I think an important comment has been glossed over….what did the watch smell like?
 
F
Posts
15
Likes
3
padders padders
OP, you may have a point but as it is you come across as a bit of a wanker so either post the original ad you bought from or just piss off.

Why? I opened an account on this forum and wrote all that out not because I was convinced I was right. I said I think not I know. Some of you have chimed in with some great points and some pretty enlightening information about how organized Omega was in the 90s (and wasn’t.) I spent hours researching before posting and couldn’t find the information from this thread. Further, no example photos of this watch in this config existed before the thread was posted.
Some of you want to see the listing because you think you are the return or validation police or something. Also, why name the dealer when something could have been changed by the prior owner during the Clinton Administration? @sathomasga takeaways are spot on and I agree with what he is saying. I’m over it at this point and I’m moving on to another product.

Perhaps I’m paranoid and looking for fraud, but on the other hand, I also had higher expectations of Omegas databases. I have about 10 Vostoks (some I picked up in Russia) and I expect half of them to be weird because they Russian disposables, but even those are better documented. Clearly there is some gray area here.

Good evening to all of you and thanks for your helpful information.
 
3 More Posts...
Sign up or log in to reply...

Similar threads

A

I think I was duped - Seamaster

avischio Vintage Omega Watches Help, Discussion and Advice
NotJackson
NotJackson
Posts
16
Views
2K
alexk105

Need help - is this a franken-watch?

alexk105 Vintage Omega Watches Help, Discussion and Advice
malilis
malilis
Posts
8
Views
2K
hansaboy

Omega Speedmaster 2998-1 on an auction - A Franken!

hansaboy Vintage Omega Watches Help, Discussion and Advice
Mkw
Mkw
Posts
20
Views
2K
B

Inherited an Ed White Speedmaster - I think. Suggestions for repair shops

benkaf2 Vintage Omega Watches Help, Discussion and Advice
wagudc
wagudc
Posts
7
Views
3K
L

Could I Get a Little Help with My First Omega?

Liketowatch Vintage Omega Watches Help, Discussion and Advice
JimInOz
JimInOz
Posts
15
Views
2K
97'vintage

What should I get done on my 1962 Omega?

97'vintage Vintage Omega Watches Help, Discussion and Advice
97'vintage
97'vintage
Posts
10
Views
3K