Extract from the Archives rejected with no info and no refund

Wryfox · Oct 19, 2019

I imagine that having the CEO live sign a document attesting to the history of a real omega watch has something to do with the cost, both in taking his time away from more important matters, but also the fact that the chief executive wouldn't dare put his name on something that wasn't fully, completely, and highly valued by the market.

If it was just issued by the historian, I would guess it would only be $50. Cost + like any other roll call task.

SpeedyPhill · Oct 19, 2019

After all it's just an EoA - Extract of Archives ... could this happen with CoA - Certificate of Authenticity 👎

padders · Oct 19, 2019

Wryfox
I imagine that having the CEO live sign a document attesting to the history of a real omega watch has something to do with the cost, both in taking his time away from more important matters, but also the fact that the chief executive wouldn't dare put his name on something that wasn't fully, completely, and highly valued by the market.

If it was just issued by the historian, I would guess it would only be $50. Cost + like any other roll call task.

Uhuh, so why is the fee the same when the president doesn’t have to drag himself away from the golf course or casino? Hard to justify in those terms.

Davidt · Oct 19, 2019

Perhaps I've missed it in the thread somewhere, but what is your serial no (or first few digits).

That dial certainly doesn't match the case back, so this coupled withOmega rejecting your extract does unfortunately suggest you have a franken, or at the very least some replaced parts.

Dr No · Oct 19, 2019

padders
But it always has worked like that until a month ago. I personally think charging full price for a miss match and no issue of a cert is a ridiculous liberty. You are paying for the certificate. If they must reject requests then by all means charge a nominal fee to prevent vexatious requests, £25 maybe, to reflect the effort expended. Or use the new income steam from failed requests to lower the overall fee to something more palatable to lessen the pain for those that get nothing. IMO charging the full fee is very poor from a customer satisfaction POV. I have 2 extracts but I wont be rushing to get one in future if this is their attitude. I wonder if Swatch Stablemate Longines still offer their completely free service or has that been ‘improved’ too. It’s hard to justify a hefty research fee when a closely related arm of the organisation can do it for free.

Robert Redford and Joe Garagiola walk into a barbershop. Both get charged $20. Fair?

😀

Evitzee · Oct 19, 2019

Dr No
Robert Redford and Joe Garagiola walk into a barbershop. Both get charged $20. Fair?

😀

Yes. Why would you need to ask?

larryganz · Oct 19, 2019

Personally, I think omega should have issued an extract for the movement serial number, stating the model or case that it was installed in and the date of production.

Then the watch owner can restore the movement back to the way it was sold if they so wish.

I see no valid excuse for why that would not be done if they were paid to do so.

MSNWatch · Oct 19, 2019

Also how many use this service? I consider myself

STANDY
Half of them are your watches anyway 😉

I've said before they should just put that database that @mac_omega says is in place online and charge a fee to access it - either a one time fee or a subscription fee for access within a specified period of time. There should also be the ability to generate a PDF of the result.

Faz · Oct 19, 2019

watchyouwant
What is the problem? You enter a contract and the contract details are clearly stated. They do their work . The result is not matching your details = No Refund. Try that with Rolex. You are not worthy an Answer..... kind regards. Achim

I beg to differ..with Rolex,you get 30 lashes! :whipped:

STANDY · Oct 19, 2019

MSNWatch
Also how many use this service? I consider myself

I've said before they should just put that database that @mac_omega says is in place online and charge a fee to access it - either a one time fee or a subscription fee for access within a specified period of time. There should also be the ability to generate a PDF of the result.

€29.50 a year subscription just to use it. 👍 That would add up for the one off,s and make its money to cover the multiple users like many here.

Dr No · Oct 20, 2019

Evitzee
Yes. Why would you need to ask?

Precisely.

😉

simonsays · Oct 20, 2019

Dr No
Robert Redford and Joe Garagiola walk into a barbershop. Both get charged $20. Fair?

😀

Did Robert Redford get a certificate saying the hair was all his?

padders · Oct 20, 2019

Dr No
Precisely.

😉

Firstly Being British I have no idea who the second chap is, and assuming he is a baldy, I don't get the parallel to be honest. If both go into a hairdresser, both get a service, one doesn't get told to sod off but to pay for the privilege of them telling him so. A better parallel there would be with a $300 Geneve and a $50K Racing Speedy, both get can get an EOA and both pay the same price but it makes more sense for one than the other. It is the full price charge for no result and no extract which rankles. The hairdresser doesn't say, 'not today Joe, that'll be $20 please'.

gatorcpa · Oct 20, 2019

I think a better analogy would be something like this:

You have a watch that needs service. You take it to a watchmaker that advertises a “free estimate”.

Do you think that there is no labor cost to the watchmaker with the free estimate? Of course not. This is how he chooses to attract customers.

That watchmaker looks at the watch, and tells you that he cannot fix it because parts are no longer available. I’ve just described Longines Extract of Archives process.

Now you visit another watchmaker with a slightly better reputation. He charges by the hour for his services and says so in his advertising. That watchmaker looks at your watch and also says that also he cannot fix your watch. Then hands you a $120 bill for his time. That is Omega’s process.

I’m not sure that one is better than another, so long as they are both up front with their business policies.

It is your choice whether to do business with them or not.
gatorcpa

aprax · Oct 20, 2019

There is an element of unfairness here: On the one hand they stress in their ridiculously over-emphasized disclaimer that the extract has absolutely nothing to do with authenticity and/or ownership. On the other hand, they penalize the customer, without caring whether he acts in good faith or not, for not having an authentic watch or not being the owner.
Under some jurisdictions (like the German, with which I am familiar) it could be very well argued that their terms of business were unlawful in that respect.

Archer · Oct 20, 2019

gatorcpa
It is your choice whether to do business with them or not.
gatorcpa

Better analogy, but still flawed. Omega is the sole provider of the service that people are seeking, so in your analogy the watchmaker who charges for the estimate would be the only watchmaker on the planet. If you want your watch fixed, you really have no choice but to risk the initial inspection fee.

By the way, despite my having an issue with the analogy, I don't have an issue with what Omega is doing. There is labour involved, and people who say "it's just looking something up in a database, so how long could that possibly take" aren't really thinking it through. It's not just one guy sitting at a terminal that is involved here. Any purchase or order generates paperwork in the system, collecting of money, accounting, payment of taxes, and all the other things that go into running a business besides the actual work itself. My guess is that even with a no result returned, Omega is not likely making a lot of money on these, if any at all. To know if they were actually making money on the whole, you would have to know a lot more than we do, starting with how many get a good result, or no result at all, plus the costs associated every aspect of it.

Cheers, Al

Archer · Oct 20, 2019

aprax
On the one hand they stress in their ridiculously over-emphasized disclaimer that the extract has absolutely nothing to do with authenticity and/or ownership.

Correct, because it's an extrract of the archives, nothing more. By definition it can't be anything related to authenticity (beyond knowing if the serial number matches the type of watch that left the factory) or ownership once sold. The archives simply are not for that purpose, so calling that out as a "negative" is certainly not "fair" if that's what we are basing things on...

Claven2 · Oct 20, 2019

Davidt
Perhaps I've missed it in the thread somewhere, but what is your serial no (or first few digits).

That dial certainly doesn't match the case back, so this coupled withOmega rejecting your extract does unfortunately suggest you have a franken, or at the very least some replaced parts.

This makes me wonder... if a service dial was put on a watch by Omega Bienne or at an AD service centre (for example, Omega Toronto SC), does that make it fail the EOA test? I rather doubt Omega can cross-reference the original configuration with pre-digital service records in other countries.

I've sent a good few Omega watches back to Omega for restoration or overhaul, and many have come back with significant parts swapping. Generally I assumed this to be for wear or damage or because it was cheaper to replace something than to service it. At one point back in the 90's, Omega used to change to newer dial versions on some watches I sent in because there was a scratch or a bubble or whatever - it used to be part of the service fee, though they now charge hundreds for replacement dials. They did this to a Speedy MkIII I sent in back then, and to be honest, back then people were glad for the newer dials with fresh lume - the "it must be the original dial, even if shabby" trend had not yet started in collecting circles.

I've never had Omega refuse to work on a watch, but I likely never sent in a Franken Watch. I bet they'd still work on one though if you were willing to pay - For example, Rolex will do so, provided you let them return the watch to as-manufactured and will pay for the parts. I'll bet Omega is no different. I wonder if you do that, if Omega will then EOA it?

Sorry for the musings.

Claven2 · Oct 20, 2019

Archer
Correct, because it's an extrract of the archives, nothing more. By definition it can't be anything related to authenticity (beyond knowing if the serial number matches the type of watch that left the factory) or ownership once sold. The archives simply are not for that purpose, so calling that out as a "negative" is certainly not "fair" if that's what we are basing things on...

They DO offer an authentication service - it's about 10X more money (!).

I have zero issue with the EOA service and how it's structured, but the authentication service is a bit too spendy in my view. Makes no sense to pay for it unless it's a 5 figure watch going to the block.

Archer · Oct 20, 2019

Claven2
They DO offer an authentication service - it's about 10X more money (!).

I have zero issue with the EOA service and how it's structured, but the authentication service is a bit too spendy in my view. Makes no sense to pay for it unless it's a 5 figure watch going to the block.

Yes, I'm well aware that they now offer an authentication service. The point is exactly that the EOA is not an authentication service...

Extract from the Archives rejected with no info and no refund

Wryfox

SpeedyPhill

padders

Davidt

Dr No

Evitzee

larryganz

MSNWatch

Faz

STANDY

Dr No

simonsays

padders

gatorcpa

aprax

Archer

Archer

Claven2

Claven2

Archer

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