Breaking News: The New Steel Speedmaster With Caliber 321 “Ed White”

Evitzee · Jan 7, 2020

The 'assembled by one watchmaker' is just silly prattle, some marketing committee's idea of a plan to make the movement seem more precious and rare than it really is. Hundreds of thousands of column wheel movements were made in high volume over many decades without the use of computer aided design or CNC making/finishing of the parts, the story that this rebirth is some sort of miracle in the 21st century means Omega thinks people are fools and will buy the story to help justify the price. Seems many here have indeed fallen for it.

I have no problem with Omega's pricing, they are shooting for a market and have priced it according to what they feel the market will bear. That's commerce. But the marketing is a bit silly.

mancio · Jan 7, 2020

Evitzee
The 'assembled by one watchmaker' is just silly prattle, some marketing committee's idea of a plan to make the movement seem more precious and rare than it really is. Hundreds of thousands of column wheel movements were made in high volume over many decades without the use of computer aided design or CNC making/finishing of the parts, the story that this rebirth is some sort of miracle in the 21st century means Omega thinks people are fools and will buy the story to help justify the price. Seems many here have indeed fallen for it.

I have no problem with Omega's pricing, they are shooting for a market and have priced it according to what they feel the market will bear. That's commerce. But the marketing is a bit silly.

IMHO, who wants to buy a vintage Ed will still buy it and who doesn't want to deal with all the problem of buying a vintage watch( in first place buying something that is 100% authentic, correct and doesn't look like shit, because that is a nightmare this days)but love the look will buy this.

When they are making 1000 yearly, you know that is going to be expensive....

Screwbacks · Jan 7, 2020

only 2020 pieces? it's bang for the bucks. fall in line now.

GadgetGuy88 · Jan 7, 2020

A 2017 grey market ceramic white faced Daytona is selling for $23695 over at RF. For whatever that’s worth...

My OB at midday had 1 deposit in hand and 6 in line and they are asking for 50%.

rominvicta · Jan 7, 2020

repoman
Wonderfully executed by Omega, definitely will be a home run for them. Meanwhile, I'd buy the vintage Ed White @kov has for sale in the private sales forum (recently withdrawn but probably still available via PM) in a heartbeat over the new one. In a pure heads-up battle between vintage Ed White vs Modern Ed White, where the price point is similar, I'd pick vintage every time, but I can definitely see the appeal of this modern execution to the new school group of high-end watch buyers. If these pieces get the Rolex treatment from Omega (i.e. barely a trickle coming about of the factory to create more demand) then resale figures will probably go up, which might drive vintage up a bit as well to match. Should be interesting to observe.

It took Rolex about 30 years for that to happen! It is not just a matter of supply but demand as well. Who the heck beyond this forum has ever been interested in caliber 321 and Moonwatch worn by Ed White? So, I tend to agree as someone mentioned that beyond the first year this watch will get market assessment somewhere between minus 30 to 50%.

eugeneandresson · Jan 7, 2020

MTROIS
Great watch overall, no question! Perfect? Of course not. Here are my “griefs”:
- Colored lume... would have been cool to use Tritium again (I know, unrealistic, but one can dream!) 😉
!

I think this ‘colored lume’ or ‘faux Tina’ is a totally incorrect misconception, and the color on this watch is actually spot on. This is what I believe brand new tritium was colored as in the Ed White era...perhaps with some slight variation in that period (we know mid70-80 was green and thereafter more toffee)...I don’t believe tritium was ever white to begin with, and the ‘57replica and fois have it all wrong.

105012 · Jan 8, 2020

Traveler
Nobody, not even Aldrin, is sure that he wore a 105.012, and as the watch is ‘missing’ we may never know. I believe there is some research suggesting it might have actually been a 145.012.

"The OMEGA Museum works since two years directly with Mr. Ragan (ex-NASA) and at the same time with the Smithsonian Institute as well as with several other sources in Houston. Omega have finally been able to put the whole history together, backed-up by countless original documents – most were previously classified – both in Houston and within countless archives discovered in the vaults of the Omega museum."

"But for Aldrin’s Speedy, it’s another story, as it seems to be lost. Speculations were talking about a ST145.012 – which we know now to be wrong."

"Both Neil Armstrong’s and Buzz Aldrin’s Speedmasters were ST105.012 models."

https://monochrome-watches.com/excl...ences-how-omega-speedmaster-became-moonwatch/

Junta · Jan 8, 2020

I can't say it isn't worth the price, but there are other watches I'd rather buy at that price point.

LeonDeBayonne · Jan 8, 2020

padders
Thing is several people took the time to patiently explain the differences in straight lug bevels and you repeatedly stated that it hadn't been explained to your satisfaction. Each generation of straight lug Speedmaster has substantially different lugs making it a valid topic for discussion IMO. The FOIS and Trilogy lugs had very wide bevels, unlike any Ed White, the -64 variant of which had none. This new watch mirrors the -64 and is unlike the FOIS and Trilogy in this respect. The funky comment was I believe a reference to suspicions that the lugs on those latter 2 were over exaggerated vs the watches they were based on. We can keep discussing it if it helps.

Whereas a plastic fantastic 'Grail' is worth every penny of the £20k dealers are asking. Jog on.

Why are you addressing this comment to me? I was not the one telling that the FOIS and 60th anniversary had exaggerated / funky bevels! I was asking him to expand as I believe it’s totally incorrect. Full point.

Comtaygious · Jan 8, 2020

Can someone explain how this is worth 14k? What! Octo finnisimo or go seventies chrono for me.

jw0n · Jan 8, 2020

I can't say much about how this watch is over-priced, but it certainly is expensive.

padders · Jan 8, 2020

eugeneandresson
I think this ‘colored lume’ or ‘faux Tina’ is a totally incorrect misconception, and the color on this watch is actually spot on. This is what I believe brand new tritium was colored as in the Ed White era...perhaps with some slight variation in that period (we know mid70-80 was green and thereafter more toffee)...I don’t believe tritium was ever white to begin with, and the ‘57replica and fois have it all wrong.

This had occurred to me too Eugene. This lume is different to the toffee/beige colour used on the earlier recreations, it’s more like the colour of new tritium so it can perhaps be forgiven and maybe even embraced. Super white would look wrong here. If they had wanted to go full faux then I would have expected a darker colour. This is recreating a watch that used tritium, the earlier ones like the Trilogy or SM300 or ‘57 were mimicking radium though so perhaps that has some bearing on their choice.

Strangedream · Jan 8, 2020

I call it collector's bait. Ceramic bezel, sapphire crystal, and display case back aren't needed and only add to the already high price. If I had $14,000 I would definitely buy an original 105.003 or 105.012 on the bay or the gray market, and I would still have some leftovers for a spare display case back and a nice stand.

If Omega had brought back the cal. 321 in its standard Moon watches (either as a 1861 replacement or alongside the 1861/3861) for a $5k-6k price tag, people would literally line up in front of their AD's. I know I would.

tyrantlizardrex · Jan 8, 2020

Strangedream
If Omega had brought back the cal. 321 in its standard Moon watches (either as a 1861 replacement or alongside the 1861/3861) for an almost reasonable $5k-6k price tag, people would literally line up in front of their AD's.

Would they? I don't really see that most people give a toss, beyond some of the more intense elements of the collector/investor crowd.

This is the beginning of a two tiered, and much more expensive manual wind Speedmaster range, where the RRP is now going to solidly be north of £7k if you want into a "traditional-esque moonwatch".

Strangedream · Jan 8, 2020

tyrantlizardrex
Would they? I don't really see that most people give a toss, beyond some of the more intense elements of the collector/investor crowd.

This is the beginning of a two tiered, and much more expensive manual wind Speedmaster range, where the RRP is now going to solidly be north of £7k if you want into a "traditional-esque moonwatch".

My rationale is that if people buy a standard Moon watch they're after authenticity. Something that's close to the real deal. This is why the Speedmaster is probably one of the few watches in this price range where a plastic glass is as desirable as a sapphire crystal, and retained most of its original design. Hence I believe a lot of people would definitely be interested in a cal.321 traditional Moon watch priced at entry level.

Now I understand Speedy prices are only going up from here on, especially after the introduction of the new 3861.

tyrantlizardrex · Jan 8, 2020

Strangedream
Hence I believe a lot of people would definitely be interested in a cal.321 traditional Moon watch priced at entry level.

I just don't see that the demand is there for a 321 in a regular production watch over a 1861 for the average customer - of which watch collectors are not - the wider watch buying world does not give a toss which 50+ year old movement powers their watch, they just want reliability, reasonable servicing costs, and lets be frank, a certain amount of "it went to the moon" cool points.

I suspect we can forget all about Omega pricing anything at entry level - they've drunk far too much of their own Kool Aid now for that. 😉

Martin_J_N · Jan 8, 2020

New 321 for me, no interest in 50 year old watches. Fully understand that for many a vintage 'Ed White' is a grail watch, something to aspire to own, or for some to nurture and look after as they already have the watch. But I don't want a 50 year old watch, I have investigated owning a vintage watch and although I thought it would be great in reality it just doesn't appeal. So Omega, thank you for this new watch now I can aspire to owning a modern Speedmaster with a version of the 321 movement that pays it's respect to the original Ed White.

padders · Jan 8, 2020

Strangedream
I call it collector's bait. Ceramic bezel, sapphire crystal, and display case back aren't needed and only add to the already high price. If I had $14,000 I would definitely buy an original 105.003 or 105.012 on the bay or the gray market, and I would still have some leftovers for a spare display case back and a nice stand.

If Omega had brought back the cal. 321 in its standard Moon watches (either as a 1861 replacement or alongside the 1861/3861) for a $5k-6k price tag, people would literally line up in front of their AD's. I know I would.

As Chris says, the problem with your plan is that they seem to want to push the regular Moonwatch up to the ~$7K region, thus the 'premium' halo product needs to be considerably above that. Where would be the sense in selling the limited production models at the same money. No going forwards I would expect that we we see the 3861 MW for circa $6-7K, the inevitable stream of LE models at maybe $10K (see Buzz Butt for an early example), the 321 range at $13-15K (I bet they do a 321 105.012-65 reissue at some point too) and the precious metal models at $30K,40K whatever. You only need to look at the pricing of the '57/44mm Racing or XSOTM ranges to see that Omega have been keen to push prices for chrono's up for a while. The fact is, the std 1861 watch has lagged behind Omega's market place aspirations and until recently was out of step with the of some other models. They are making changes as a justification for price increases. The sunlit uplands of the brave new world are for the increasingly wealthy.

Om3ga321 · Jan 8, 2020

Martin_J_N
New 321 for me, no interest in 50 year old watches. Fully understand that for many a vintage 'Ed White' is a grail watch, something to aspire to own, or for some to nurture and look after as they already have the watch. But I don't want a 50 year old watch, I have investigated owning a vintage watch and although I thought it would be great in reality it just doesn't appeal. So Omega, thank you for this new watch now I can aspire to owning a modern Speedmaster with a version of the 321 movement that pays it's respect to the original Ed White.

I own 5 old straight lug Speedmasters but owning a new straight lug watch that I can wear every day is a god send.

Owlsu · Jan 8, 2020

Anyone who's losing their mind over the price on this just wait another 4 months until the 1861 .005 is pulled from the site overnight and replaced with a 3861 costing £5450.

Breaking News: The New Steel Speedmaster With Caliber 321 “Ed White”

Evitzee

mancio

Screwbacks

GadgetGuy88

rominvicta

eugeneandresson

105012

Junta

LeonDeBayonne

Comtaygious

jw0n

padders

Strangedream

tyrantlizardrex

Strangedream

tyrantlizardrex

Martin_J_N

padders

Om3ga321

Owlsu

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