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Anyone have a historical watch?

Lépine
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MAJETEK VOJENSKÉ SPRÁVY

About 150 Majetek 3582 have been logged.
There are a few that have duplicate issue numbers and are most likely results of fake copy engravings.
Interesting to see how many serial number cases, about 32 logged, most likely only invoiced 1935-1937
You can decide if an issue number on a watch invoiced after 1938 makes any sense.
Occupation of Czechoslovakia (1938–1945)
Longines can authenticate if the watch should have MAJETEK VOJENSKÉ SPRÁVY on the back

See next post. (reposted bigger)

https://forum.chronomag.cz/topic/56625-švýcarské-hodinky-v-československé-armádě/


IMG_8118.jpeg
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Lépine
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Hopefully this is a bit more legible posting of this MAJETEK VOJENSKÉ SPRÁVY tracking table from 2015.

upload_2024-4-9_11-21-50.png upload_2024-4-9_11-17-51.png upload_2024-4-9_11-20-6.png
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Lépine
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Military Historical Institute at Prague
This watch was donated straight from the family and is untouched.
Given to the VHU Praha.

https://www.vhu.cz/exhibit/letecke-hodinky-longines/

upload_2024-4-9_12-13-59.png



Note the MAJETEK VOJENSKÉ SPRÁVY is milled into the case and not engraved or stamped like fakes.
The issue number is then milled in later and is often in the early confirmed examples in a smaller thinner font.

upload_2024-4-9_12-15-32.png



More examples of how the markings are milled in.

GzCXxxd.png
upload_2024-4-9_12-32-44.png

HAl2OeV.png
LrfTSgW.png

Also note the number "4" is open on proper MAJETEK VOJENSKÉ SPRÁVY wrist watches from Longines, Lemania, and Eterna.

upload_2024-4-9_12-24-45.png upload_2024-4-9_12-25-28.png upload_2024-4-9_12-26-31.png upload_2024-4-9_12-27-15.png upload_2024-4-9_12-28-9.png



Magnified what the milling should look like. You can note how quickly the drill is moving by seeing how close together the circles are to eachother as it moves. This is another way to tell genuine from fake.
cTGOn4B.jpg
VuV1PDi.jpg
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Lépine
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These are all aligned and sized exactly the same.
These appear to be Longines factory produced markings.
Longines authenticated 2124. Also note, all have open "4"

x1768154-1d63da69569026f642bd98e21997b443.jpg.pagespeed.ic.ck-DhejhIA.webp


This is a second style that has been confirmed as being delivered to the Czechoslovakia Army.
The extracts for 2550 and 2126 watches show delivery to the Army. 1179 is in the VHU museum donated directly from the pilots family.

upload_2024-4-9_18-35-37.png


Below are the two types done by Longines.


upload_2024-4-9_18-15-21.png


(There could be more, but after these two it is unlikely based on invoice dates.)
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Lépine
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Glimps into 15.68z delivery to Weinstabl. Seems to be for December 17, 1949 (person's notes).

post-1906-0-72566500-1415641163.jpg

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Original below.

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upload_2024-4-11_11-48-57.png upload_2024-4-11_11-49-46.png
noelekal
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Thank you Seiji!

This is a wealth of information. You create the thread that keeps on giving.
 
Lépine
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I'm just getting even older, my collection will need new curators. I won't remember how I found the watch or all the historical context. I am sure the Internet will be different. Pages will disappear. Much will improve and much will be lost. Some people may have similar watches. It usually takes me weeks and years to pull information together to have an idea of what I have found. @noelekal your like are very encouraging always and also @Waltesefalcon
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Lépine
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Some people know I got my 3582 serial numbered 15.94 screw cased mineral glass type 1 engraved watch in 2003. Only in the last 5 years did information about these really become available from Longines.
 
Waltesefalcon
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Seiji, your watches (at least the ones you've shown here) speak to a very niche group. A group which values the history of each of these watches. I thoroughly enjoy seeing your work come together, and I know that anyone lucky enough to wind up with one of your watches in the future will be grateful for not only the watch but also the history you've compiled.
 
Lépine
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Waltesefalcon Waltesefalcon
Seiji, your watches (at least the ones you've shown here) speak to a very niche group. A group which values the history of each of these watches. I thoroughly enjoy seeing your work come together, and I know that anyone lucky enough to wind up with one of your watches in the future will be grateful for not only the watch but also the history you've compiled.
Thank you it means a lot. And hopefully better information will be come available too.
 
noelekal
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Lépine Seiji
I'm just getting even older, my collection will need new curators. I won't remember how I found the watch or all the historical context. I am sure the Internet will be different. Pages will disappear. Much will improve and much will be lost. Some people may have similar watches. It usually takes me weeks and years to pull information together to have an idea of what I have found. @noelekal your like are very encouraging always and also @Waltesefalcon

Thank you Seiji, but you're the encouraging one here. You're offering us an interesting and entertaining look at history (which I love with a passion) with a focus on watches, which makes your thread twice as nice.

Oh, and I've seen you in photos here. You are not old yet! Just wait until you're 67 as I am going to be in a few weeks. Then you may begin to tell us about getting old, heh!
 
Waltesefalcon
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@Seiji the research you conduct is good, and you are a natural story teller. What's more the 29 pages of this thread, which is your baby, is incredibly informative.
 
Lépine
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A bit of work in progress.

The main RAF Squadrons that had the Czechoslovakian pilots were 68,310,311,312, and 313. However, there were many more that reportatedly had former Czechoslovakia Army Pilots. Below is a work in progress. And of course, they were part of the famous RAF 303 Polish Squadron.
upload_2024-4-25_9-1-17.png upload_2024-4-25_10-24-17.png



The Longines 3582 FIRST GENERATION would have most likely been in these squadrons. The Pre-1938 are the famed RAF Czechoslovak Pilots. They were undoubtly among the most important pilots that turned the loosing battle into victory with their experience and tactical skills that helped retrain British fighter tactics.

Second generation would likely have been in German squadrons
Third generation in post war Communist USSR aligned Czechoslovakia air force.

upload_2024-4-25_8-19-15.png upload_2024-4-25_8-19-42.png upload_2024-4-25_8-20-12.png
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Lépine
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Waltesefalcon Waltesefalcon
@Seiji the research you conduct is good, and you are a natural story teller. What's more the 29 pages of this thread, which is your baby, is incredibly informative.

Thank you, I really appreciate the acknowledgement. I am naturally a curious person. It's hard to keep me away from the rabbit hole.
 
Lépine
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noelekal noelekal
Thank you Seiji, but you're the encouraging one here. You're offering us an interesting and entertaining look at history (which I love with a passion) with a focus on watches, which makes your thread twice as nice.

Oh, and I've seen you in photos here. You are not old yet! Just wait until you're 67 as I am going to be in a few weeks. Then you may begin to tell us about getting old, heh!

Well, old enough that after a year, the information is becoming less and less clear. Maybe too much in a small skull?
 
Lépine
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This is quite interesting. David found Longines 3582 parts in Israel. Here is why.
upload_2024-4-25_9-17-58.png IMG_8410.jpeg
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Lépine
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gatorcpa gatorcpa
The Czechs started by selling German Messerschmitt aircraft to Israel. Those had some very serious issues. The Spitfires came later.

More info here:

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/air-space-magazine/czech-knife-180972958/

gatorcpa

I completely enjoyed reading this article. I think none of us who have not flown a prop aircraft can appreciate how difficult it was to fly WW2 fighter craft that basically had too much torque or gyroscopic procession for over sized engines needed for the aircrafts to be faster than the enemy.
 
noelekal
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Difficult, but I imagine that it was glorious.
 
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