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13ZN Chronographs Inquiries and Information.

dodo44
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Thanks @minutenrohr and @DirtyDozen12 for weighing in on this watch. I concur with the assessment that these were later re-cased by a French dealer/agent. I think Wittnauer or US dealers did a bit of that too. Given that, would you consider that it is a legitimate Longines; would the re-casing history affect the value? I would say that it does but given that there is a whole bunch of them and that it reflects the commercial practices of the days, these are still highly collectable in my opinion (although $7500 seems to be a bit steep).
 
DirtyDozen12
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I find these particular French-cased examples less desirable due to the stylistic dissonance between dial and case. However, it seems that Longines buyers are not yet as fussy as Rolex collectors since the prices achieved are comparable to similar Swiss examples.
 
Seiji
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DirtyDozen12 DirtyDozen12
I also do not recall encountering a 13ZN with radial numerals such as this however the dial and hands appear to be correct. The "Fab. Suisse" and odd design suggest that the case is French. I believe that this could explain the more contemporary style. What is surprising is the condition of the movement. Here is an even earlier 13ZN with a similar style case and incorrect (30CH or service?) dial. I am curious if this watch also went to France.
112.JPG
http://www.lorologiese.com/us/brand...ourglass-dial-chronoservice-ch-guarantee.html
That is a 30ch dial found on 5966-6
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DirtyDozen12
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Seiji Seiji
That is a 30ch dial found on 5966-6
In terms of design, it is indeed 30CH. However, the presence of three dial feet suggests that it was made for 13ZN. Based on the design and execution, the dial appears original and is therefore most likely a transitional dial for very late 13ZNs.
 
Seiji
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I believe you are mistaken, this dial is transitional, but near 1950 between 5966 and 6234. Not late 13zn which would be near Antimagnetic , blue techometre track, and waterproof style dials. Someone altered the feet.
 
minutenrohr
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13ZN%20-%2030CH%20zifferblattruumlckseite%202%20copy_zps97g2qqe3.jpg
 
Seiji
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Yes you have both convinced me the dial is not altered from 30ch for 13zn.
I still have questions about how a dial from 1950s is on a 1942 movement.
Perhaps old inventory movement put into newer case and dial...special order?
Mid case is wider than case back and bezel like newer 30ch case designs.
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Seiji
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Generally speaking, we are led to believe only copper foot 13zn dials are genuine. What do the experts believe, are silver foot, gold foot, and copper foot all possible depending on the type of dial design? I personally don't believe only copper foot is genuine.
 
minutenrohr
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...nobody here stated that only copper is ok. but, if the feet are coppered, it is a fine advice (90% correct imo), that the dial is legit. Until Mr. Franken will decide to fetch his paintbox...
 
Seiji
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minutenrohr minutenrohr
...nobody here stated that only copper is ok. but, if the feet are coppered, it is a fine advice (90% correct imo), that the dial is legit. Until Mr. Franken will decide to fetch his paintbox...
Glad to hear that, been a frustration point for me that I think HODINKEE has reinforced.
 
DirtyDozen12
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Longines dials of the 1930s and 1940s were primarily composed of brass. Brass is an alloy of copper and zinc. An original dial should therefore have a "brass-toned" foot. This "brass-tone" can range from red (more copper?) to gold (more zinc?) to a murky mixture of red, blue, and silver in the event of excessive oxidation. A silver or white dial foot is very often the sign of a redial but it is important to judge the entirety of the dial, within the context of the entire watch and history.
 
minutenrohr
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Nice watch, but: it seems to be a "sandwich-dial" - usually the hour markers + numbers are brass/gold-colored. one should ask before bidding...
the rest of the dial is fine for its age. Hour hand + 30-minute-counter-hand are not as they should.
movement number + case number should be the same.

rgds - h.u.
 
DirtyDozen12
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Great original sandwich dial. The only original hands are the minute hand and chronograph seconds hand. The lugs appear to have been polished as they should have more pronounced facets. The crown is not original. Despite the problems that I have stated, the dial alone makes this piece worth considering.

Edit: The style of the seconds hand is correct but the length puzzles me. I am now leaning towards original.
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DirtyDozen12
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cchen cchen
Guys, any issues with the dial on this one?
One of the worst redials that I have ever seen.
 
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