in addition to the dubious dial (in this thread) there are two more issues that do not belong to a ("mint+"-) 13ZN12: 1. the little spring at the backside of the hour counter 2. the spacer between screwback and movement both are missing.
Now the auction has ended without a result. Conclusion: one of the better-known watch dealers offers a 13ZN12 with some issues as "phenomenal" - not mentioning the issues, especially that the dial is reprinted (see above, described by dirty dozen AND see the ebay pics with a remarkable dial foot)... http://www.ebay.de/itm/151950580368?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649Purchases made through these links may earn this site a commission from the eBay Partner Network regards - h.u.
The last piece of evidence anyone would need to be certain. A seller who has had his share of scandal.
Great writing about the history of the Longines chronographs 13.33, 13zn and 30ch today at Hodinkee from PH Zou!! Good to see that Hodinkee sometimes find his way back to the roots... I´m only missing the 12.68zn stop second/minute chrono in the article, even if it has no real flyback function.
...I read it (fast). I think it´s ok as a conclusion of all the facts (correct and uncorrect) you can find out using google. F.e. it is NOT correct to describe the 13zn12 as a flyback-movement. Sometimes the (frequently mentioned in Zous article) "tooth" of the lever near the column wheel is filed away (to get the flyback), but all well preserved examples I ever saw have it. rgds - h.u.
After discussing sandwich dials in another thread (https://omegaforums.net/threads/longines-13-zn-18k-chrono-with-poorly-refinished-dial.32293/), I wanted to share this example for reference. Based on the poor photograph, it appears to be original. The dial design is of note as it lacks the usual "12" and "6" hour markers. The chronograph seconds hand looks incorrect. https://www.instagram.com/p/5m_lGAu6dN/?taken-by=my_way_1911
I also think it´s correct. Minute and hour hand are uncommon. Nevertheless it looks a bit strange because of the distance between hour markers and minute track. rgds - h.u.
I agree that the minute and hour hands are uncommon (and possibly incorrect). I had not noticed the distance between the hour markers and the minute track. When I compare with similar dials, the distance is certainly reduced. Do you think that such an elaborate redial (even the cutouts for the sandwich dial) is likely? From a distance, the text appears correct. http://www.longinespassion.it/Longines_Passion/13ZN_parte_2.html http://www.longinespassion.it/Longines_Passion/13_ZN.html
I don´t want to call it a redial. All details are looking correct but nevertheless it looks strange to me; too much empty space on that dial. I can´t tell, what it is exactly, but I wouldn´t buy it. rgds - h.u.
I must apologize as I read your statement incorrectly thinking that you said that the dial was incorrect. I agree, the dial does look correct but slightly unbalanced.
I realize that I am way behind (about a month ) with this response but I felt compelled to shed some light on a crucial feature of the caliber 13.33 that was not mentioned in the Hodinkee piece. It seems that the 13.33 is often viewed as a more primitive 13ZN. However, it is certainly more advanced in one respect. While the 13ZN makes do with a simple "jumper" for the minute counter, the 13.33 has a complex instantaneous minute recording mechanism. Rare in any chronograph, the 13.33 was quite possibly the only wristwatch of its day to possess the delicate complication. Conveniently, a fantastic video of the mechanism exists. I hope you enjoy!
...some people think that the 13ZN is the cut-down version of the 13.33, as the 30CH is the same regarding the 13ZN. My watchmaker(s) are sharing this opinion. Perhaps the Hodinkee fans are not so interested in movements or the question if a 30-minute-counter jumps instantaneously or sneaky? rgds - h.u.
