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Upgrade 1861 to 3861 - yes or no?

D
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avidmark avidmark
This is exactly what Omega wants. An existing Speedy owner wanting to buy the new model because Omega is telling us it's better. Just like anything else. Is it really better though?

The new movement is probably better in most cases.
But the question remains. Is the upgrade really necessary?
If I were in the market for a brand new Moonwatch and didn't care that much about the heritage or lineage aspects the 3861 looks most appealing.
The 1861 can be set up to run within the 3861 accuracy tolerance with some patients, but it will never be as resistant to magnetism as the 3861.
There are fors and against but with the bugs yet to be ironed out with the new one and it being more expensive I'm going to sit on the sidelines for now.
But I like the new step dial👎
 
F
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I have a 2007 3570.50 with an 1861 movement. I like the greater accuracy and hacking function of the 3861, but I can't imagine selling this and losing 15 years of memories with it and "starting over".
 
w@tcher
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I would never replace my 1861 for the 3861.
I would never replace the 861 (if i was an owner) for the 1861 as well. The 321 for the 861....
The legend and the history of the moonwatch is combined with the Nasa certified calibers and missions. The history never goes back.

The 1861 is more reliable, it has low cost maintenance and more tradition and i couldn't think of replacing with the new co-axial.

If you can afford to buy the new 3861 next to the 1861, then it is another scenario.
 
Alex_TA
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Whatchuseek, here… Please open one more thread in Omega forum of Rolex forums: two is not enough!
Edited:
 
M
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Alex_TA Alex_TA
Whatchuseek, here… Please open one more thread in Omega forum of Rolex forums: two is not enough!

Haha, afraid I don’t have an account on the Rolex forums for thread number 3 - but you’ve all pretty much said the same thing so I’ve decided I’m sticking with my 1861.

Went into the Omega Boutique to have a half link put into my Seamaster (I don’t trust my tools) and the same salesperson tried to sell me the Speedmaster. I did try it on and it felt great, but is that just due to the bracelet? Anyway, she said about the size being slightly smaller and how much better the movement is etc etc and suggested I have both my 1861 and the new one - I mean that’s a no, but she said to have a think.

I went to Goldsmiths afterwards, and the salesperson actually did the opposite - told me to stick with my 1861, said I’d be best keeping mine as they’re so similar and you can’t buy it anymore. Talked about the 861 heritage etc etc. and he even said if I got another bracelet they’d fit for me for free.

So that’s what I’ll do. Uncle Seiko bracelet and keeping my 1861.

Thanks everyone.
 
norb1967
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What’s the big advantage of the 3861? Is it that much more accurate? The 1861 is a great movement, classic, tried and tested.
 
YY77
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norb1967 norb1967
What’s the big advantage of the 3861? Is it that much more accurate? The 1861 is a great movement, classic, tried and tested.
Hacking, anti magnetic up to 15000 Gauss, max 0 +5s deviation
 
padders
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Listen to Omega, older is always better. Why else would they charge £12k for the Speedy with the 321. If you can’t stretch to one of those the 1861 will do just fine.
 
Evitzee
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YY77 YY77
Hacking, anti magnetic up to 15000 Gauss, max 0 +5s deviation
And at this point subject to premature failure.

On a practical basis the 1861 is eminently suitable for long term use.
 
norb1967
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padders padders
Listen to Omega, older is always better. Why else would they charge £12k for the Speedy with the 321. If you can’t stretch to one of those the 1861 will do just fine.
Do they not just charge this because it’s the original movement and they don’t make it anymore? I wasn’t aware it was particularly ‘better’ than the 1861.
 
YY77
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Evitzee Evitzee
And at this point subject to premature failure.

On a practical basis the 1861 is eminently suitable for long term use.
Mine is still going strong for almost 3 years.
 
Evitzee
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YY77 YY77
Mine is still going strong for almost 3 years.
It's hit or miss, mine was fine for the 2 1/2 years I owned it, yet some brand new ones fail right out of the box. Eventually all will get fixed.
 
norb1967
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Evitzee Evitzee
And at this point subject to premature failure.

On a practical basis the 1861 is eminently suitable for long term use.
What exactly is the point of failure in the movement? I’d be surprised if this is a widespread thing.
 
Evitzee
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norb1967 norb1967
What exactly is the point of failure in the movement? I’d be surprised if this is a widespread thing.
Do your research and prepare to be surprised.
 
norb1967
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Evitzee Evitzee
Do your research and prepare to be surprised.
Okay - I’ve had a look, and yes it does seem bad, but they have issued a retrospective fix and now all the movements coming out should be fine.
 
G
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avidmark avidmark
Maybe the 3861 is technically more superior. But the 1861 has more heritage and pedigree. I heard someone on this forum refer to the 1861 as the last true descendent of the Moonwatch. I'd rather have one with a legitimate connection to the space program than an upgraded one with a co-axial escapement and Master chronometer certification. Just my opinion.

I've seen this argument is a few places. And to be clear, I'm not quibbling with it at all; it's a completely reasonable position. But I'm curious if it would change anyone's mind if the 3861 goes to the Moon on the Artemis missions? Would that make the 1861 (and I guess, the 861) the ugly stepsister in between 2 versions that went to the Moon?
 
norb1967
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G GoBlueJedi
I've seen this argument is a few places. And to be clear, I'm not quibbling with it at all; it's a completely reasonable position. But I'm curious if it would change anyone's mind if the 3861 goes to the Moon on the Artemis missions? Would that make the 1861 (and I guess, the 861) the ugly stepsister in between 2 versions that went to the Moon?
I imagine the Speedy won’t go to the moon again, and if it does it’ll be purely for marketing. When it originally did it was very much for the purpose of being used as a tool.
 
BlackTalon
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Variety is the spice of life. 321s, 861s and 1861s are all solid movements. One day I may add a 3861, but with all of the reported problems I will be in no hurry. Also in no hurry to obtain a modern 321.
 
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