Thoughts on this 'Universal Geneve' watch?

Posts

22

Likes

9

vintageuhr

·Apr 8, 2021

Unfortunately, I bid on this watch thinking I was getting a bargain, even though the dial seemed weird to me and I am a total noob:
https://catalog.antiquorum.swiss/en/lots/universal-ref-1-4246-so-called-jumbo-lot-337-142

I wish I had asked here before, but hindsight is a wonderful thing. Anyway, I have already emailed them that this is essentially false advertising and I should not have to pay for the watch. Any suggestions or help would be greatly appreciated, thanks!

Edited: Apr 8, 2021

 

Posts

2,476

Likes

5,132

Fallout Boy

·Apr 8, 2021

Regrets.... Probably study the termes of trade first and their proposals for a return. Any "offer" should be done by antiquorum first.
Difficult.
good luck.

 

Posts

22

Likes

9

vintageuhr

·Apr 8, 2021

'The sold as is' should not be an umbrella term to mislead people freely, if members here can immediately spot a repainted dial which is not declared, how did their 'expert' not notice anything?

Edited: Apr 10, 2021

 

Posts

5,900

Likes

9,164

Mark020

·Apr 8, 2021·not the sharpest pencil in the ΩF drawer

Well it was pretty much declared isn't it?

 

Posts

9,596

Likes

27,675

ConElPueblo

·Apr 8, 2021

Mark020

Well it was pretty much declared isn't it?

I only see that the hands are declared as being later replacements. That they make a point of declaring that the dial is 'signed' seems to me that they infer that it is genuine. Otherwise that line is of no value.

 

Posts

2,070

Likes

14,602

Traveler

·Apr 8, 2021

Pics for posterity:

Let’s not get carried away here - it’s a ratty looking watch, but it’s CHF 350 - not sure that’s worth thinking about suing over...

I would have a long hard think about why you thought it was worth buying, and consider that a very small noob tax.

 

Posts

278

Likes

355

NotAClue

·Apr 8, 2021

Traveler

...and consider that a very small noob tax.

It depends greatly on each other's wallets, I'm afraid... I must confess that my noob tax was a bit higher... 🤦

Despite thinking you're right I can't help sympathising with the OP. To him, remember that one can only loose from a situation like this when nothing is learned (and I think the OP already learned something)...

 

Posts

22

Likes

9

vintageuhr

·Apr 8, 2021

Basically they stand by their description and insist that the dial is original, but nevertheless they cancelled the sale!

Edited: Apr 8, 2021

 

Posts

22

Likes

9

vintageuhr

·Apr 8, 2021

That is their reply concerning the watch:

I have taken over this Universal wristwatch dating from the period of the Second World War or made just after and have consulted my two expert colleagues about it.

It appears from our discussions that this watch is good and made at a time when Universal, like many other Swiss watch brands, in these difficult times, subcontracted some parts of their watches, notably buying cases from Cyma.

As clearly mentioned in our description, this case is made of chromed metal and steel and is signed by this manufacture. The 12’’’ (lines) movement is a calibre 262, without Incabloc (18,000 vibrations per hour), manufactured between 1942 and 1949. A very interesting thing to note is that as Universal movements usually aren’t numbered; the number indicates that this movement was at least intended for a chronometer certification. The dial is not in great condition but original. The hands are later.

 

Posts

278

Likes

355

NotAClue

·Apr 8, 2021

They said the dial is original??? Those hour marks look like they were maid by a 5 year old... If it was a rolex I would have said that they are probably right (no offence intended against the brand - I have a vintage rolex, myself) but in this case It's hard to believe...

 

Posts

21,916

Likes

49,707

Dan S

·Apr 8, 2021

Most likely they are parsing their words carefully to imply that the dial is "original", which may be true, even though it is obviously repainted.

I'm not sure that one can conclude that the watch is a "Frankenstein". The dial is repainted, the hands are wrong, but these things are incredibly common. We don't usually say that these issues make a watch into a franken. And let's face it, these things are incredibly obvious for this particular watch. Importantly, the case is in terrible condition. There would be no reason to pay more than $100 for the watch just based on casual observation. I can't imagine how the bidding reached 350 CHF.

To the OP, welcome to OF. Consider this your noob tax and don't let it dampen your interest in vintage watches. You will find better watches in the future.

Edited: Apr 8, 2021

 

Posts

22

Likes

9

vintageuhr

·Apr 8, 2021

Dan S

Most likely they are parsing their words carefully to imply that the dial is "original", which may be true, even though it is obviously repainted.

To the OP, welcome to OF. Consider this your noob tax and don't let it dampen your interest in vintage watches. You will find better watches in the future.

Thanks for the kind words, but fortunately they cancelled the sale! It was a very valuable lesson.

 

Posts

22

Likes

9

vintageuhr

·Apr 8, 2021

Double post

Edited: Apr 8, 2021

 

Posts

21,916

Likes

49,707

Dan S

·Apr 8, 2021

vintageuhr

Thanks for the kind words, but fortunately they cancelled the sale! It was a very valuable lesson.

Sorry, I missed that part. That's good news.

 

Posts

7,624

Likes

21,861

Syrte

·Apr 10, 2021

The fact they would even include this in their selection is astounding. Are they on the verge of bankruptcy or what? 😵‍💫I thought auction houses were doing well these days.

Welcome to the forum @vintageuhr, I notice you posted a query about this watch on the forum but bid on it nonetheless before someone told you to avoid it.
As other suggested, study and patience are important if you want to avoid expensive mistakes.
In the world of vintage watches this would have been considered a cheap one— but for most peopke 350 CHF is real money.

Edited: Apr 10, 2021