Second hand market

[Steve1haggart]

Just putting this out there has the bottom falling out the second hand vintage market

 

[Mark020]

Any examples?

 

[Davidt]

Feels quiet and demand appears lower but I think that’s a continuation of the general trend for the last year or two. It’s also holiday season so many people have other things to be spending (their ever decreasing?) disposable income on at the minute.

 

[Steve1haggart]

Just an observation from looking on chrono 24 not that I purchase anything from the site or look to promote it .
For example submariner non date Ref.14060 in 2022 were selling in the region off £8600 today there selling for around £6800 big drop in price .
Speedmaster 145.012 selling for £11800 in 2023 today you can pick one up for around £8400 significantly drop in price .
Seamaster 165-024 again are down by around 10-12% over last year’s prices .
Again just an observation that prices are on the decrease .

 

[mac_omega]

A price reduction on the severely overpriced Rolex sports models was overdue.
but try to buy an orphaned Omega movement for a decent price - even rusty junk sells for insane money...
parts hunting has become expensive

 

[pdxleaf]

Steve1haggart

Just an observation from looking on chrono 24 not that I purchase anything from the site or look to promote it .
For example submariner non date Ref.14060 in 2022 were selling in the region off £8600 today there selling for around £6800 big drop in price .
Speedmaster 145.012 selling for £11800 in 2023 today you can pick one up for around £8400 significantly drop in price .
Seamaster 165-024 again are down by around 10-12% over last year’s prices .
Again just an observation that prices are on the decrease .

What you describe doesn't equate to the bottom falling out of the secondary market. Your examples are good examples of an adjustment from a high, but are not necessarily predictive of a collapsing market. Lots of watch folks have said this is a good time to buy a vintage sub for those who want one. Good condition watches still seem to be sought after, while poor ones are not being snatched up for ridiculous prices.

The economy and global political environment are strange right now, which certainly could impact the watch market, but watches will be our least concern in the event of a recession or worse.

 

[sheepdoll]

mac_omega

A price reduction on the severely overpriced Rolex sports models was overdue.
but try to buy an orphaned Omega movement for a decent price - even rusty junk sells for insane money...
parts hunting has become expensive

Actually I am finding it a bit of a buyers market. I have been stocking up on rusty 33x bumpers and 500/55x. The high end stuff like 321 and 861 still seems to remain insane. Even for the rusty ones.

The defunct chrono brands do seem a bit flat. Landerons have best parts availability. Valjoux is all over the board. Job lots can be cheap and go quickly. Single parts still demand a premium, but they remain listed and unsold for long lengths of time. Sellers like to point out that Valjoux parts can be swapped with rolex.

Lemania and Venus have the least amount of parts available in the US. Especially Lemania, but they are still technically in production.

Not sure why Venus is so weak in availability. Especially the V-170. At one time these were the cheapest column wheels, although with the rocking pinion.

Cases are the trickiest part, most of the gold one have long since been melted down. The plated ones are pretty molted.

I think it really comes down to what people think they can clean up and flip for a quick profit.

 

[Evitzee]

Depends on what segment of the market you are looking at. At the higher end (AP, PP, VC and the like) prices are still strong for quality pieces, there is a decrease in prices for Rolex, Omega and other brands in that segment. Quality is always in demand.

 

[watchyouwant]

What goes up, has to come down ... Covid had unexpected consequences . Very rare watches are not affected. There is still a lot of Money around for certain Collectables. But buying now to sell for a profit later : Too early. The risk of going down more , is very real.

 

[Fish70]

I wish.

 

[Davidt]

I also think many sellers are still listing at 2020/21 prices and can’t understand why their watch hasn’t sold.
Watches that are properly priced are moving, it just depends whether sellers have realistic expectations

 

[padders]

Rolex buyer pays £6k in 2021, sees the model offered on C24 in 2022 for £9k, then £11k in 2023. Goes to sell in 2024, ignores that prices are clearly lower, wonders why he gets no interest at £10K which he thinks is competitive. Won’t take the £6k it owes him (and would sell at) because he won’t ’give it away’. Prices go down as well as up.

 

[Dug]

Reading between the lines here, does anyone really know?
As a beginner in this world, attempting to buy a first Rolex as a keeper and to pass on to family, it is difficult to assess what is a 'fair' price.
As @padders points out, it seems that there are sellers who are just not prepared to break even on a watch they've been offering for a long, long, while. I'm an antique pottery enthusiast and see pieces at fairs which have been put out at the same price, literally, for years. This on a market which, with few exceptions, has been in constant decline.
Back to the Rolex....same conundrum as wih the stock market, to buy now or wait a while.!

 

[gbesq]

Quality vintage examples priced fairly always sell. I'm not finding that to be any different than it was before or during the pandemic. What isn't selling are examples that are in less than good condition, especially if they are overpriced.

 

[Dan S]

Old news, and not timely. Prices dropped for some high-demand models in 2022-23, and have been pretty stable since then. Actually, I am starting to see an uptick, so if you want a Sub or Speedmaster, I wouldn't wait much longer.

 

[drose224]

I agree with Greg. A watch priced fairly will sell.

 

[Clelow]

drose224

I agree with Greg. A watch priced fairly will sell.

Totally agree, but a huge factor is setting the fair price is the actual amount paid. Sellers are typically flexible upward as to making a profit but rigid downward when it comes to absorbing a loss.

Edited: Jul 20, 2024

 

[fizz]

Read this, it explains the current dynamics very well.

https://www.screwdowncrown.com/p/morgan-stanley-q2-2024

Also, look at the recent Antiquorum auction selling prices from this past weekend. Nearly 80% of lots sold below the lower estimate.

I'm taking a wait and watch approach, with the exception of any rare watches from my "To Buy" list that might show up.

 

[chichi]

Steve1haggart

Just an observation from looking on chrono 24 not that I purchase anything from the site or look to promote it .
For example submariner non date Ref.14060 in 2022 were selling in the region off £8600 today there selling for around £6800 big drop in price .
Speedmaster 145.012 selling for £11800 in 2023 today you can pick one up for around £8400 significantly drop in price .
Seamaster 165-024 again are down by around 10-12% over last year’s prices .
Again just an observation that prices are on the decrease .

What do you think of the Watchco SM300s

back in the day 1200 USD then 2000 USD then...well I kind of lost track.

 

[bernardcoghlan]

The second-hand market for watches can be a bit tricky to navigate, but it’s definitely worth exploring. One great way to find quality items is to check out dedicated marketplaces and flea markets. For example, sites like https://sacfleamarkets.com/ offer a variety of options that can help you find some interesting pieces. It’s often about keeping an eye out for those hidden gems and having a bit of patience. Another tip is to join watch enthusiast communities where you can get recommendations and tips from fellow collectors.

Edited: Aug 2, 2024