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Scarily Nice Fake Or The Real Thing?
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MSNWatch
路路Vintage Omega AficionadoI vote nicely done redial. The letters and crosshairs are just a tad too thick to my eyes and the 12-6 crosshair should be thinner and have real separation to the right of the spine of the E in OMEGA. Also for this dial, the crosshairs should not be touching the tip of the arrowhead markers and in this case it looks like it does.
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mondodec
路The pictures are just not good enough to tell if it's a real pie pan or is a domed dial with a pie pan overprint.
Lettering should definitely be silver or show a silver fleck in it and it appears to be all white, but, again, that could be the pics. As far as I know dial printing on cal 504 and 505 pieces took the colour of the markers and this has always been one way in which to determine authenticity.
I vote hesitantly a redial by a small margin. There is a break in the crosshair and in my opinion the crosshair is too thick. But even then it probably is close but maybe not close enough to pass muster. The silvered lettering looks almost flat by comparison with some later Omega dials (as it this 504 dial)
Technology these days in making dial dies has improved immeasurably. Scary. This could have been a pic of a white dial with black lettering reversed during the refinishing process. The printed markers at the applied arrowheads is correct, Swiss Made looks pretty right to me, and generally the chapter ring looks right.
Better pics methinks that either show or dont show the true colouring of the lettering.
Cheers
Desmond
Lettering should definitely be silver or show a silver fleck in it and it appears to be all white, but, again, that could be the pics. As far as I know dial printing on cal 504 and 505 pieces took the colour of the markers and this has always been one way in which to determine authenticity.
I vote hesitantly a redial by a small margin. There is a break in the crosshair and in my opinion the crosshair is too thick. But even then it probably is close but maybe not close enough to pass muster. The silvered lettering looks almost flat by comparison with some later Omega dials (as it this 504 dial)
Technology these days in making dial dies has improved immeasurably. Scary. This could have been a pic of a white dial with black lettering reversed during the refinishing process. The printed markers at the applied arrowheads is correct, Swiss Made looks pretty right to me, and generally the chapter ring looks right.
Better pics methinks that either show or dont show the true colouring of the lettering.
Cheers
Desmond
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cicindela
路路Steve @ 惟FAs Desmond stated, silver gilt can be extremely difficult to photograph at normal distances and invariably turns out whiter and flat. Best results can be obtained photographing at high magnification, where the texture and color are more discernible. Here is an example from a 168.0010.
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gatorcpa
路路惟F InvestiGatorNow that we have a definite "unsure" on the dial being refinished, what do the assembled intelligencia think about the rest of the watch?
Kyle knows someone who might own a pie-pan Ref. 2887, but is questioning the case not having pierced lugs. I'm confused about the rarity of white gold (or are they really rhodium plated steel) arrowhead markers. Almost all of the steel 1st gen Constellations I've seen have yellow markers.
The box is of the correct type, but clearly not the original and is missing the insert. Is the bracelet of the correct style for this watch?
Does seem to have correct crystal, crown and movement, which are usually the first things replaced. I guess that's why everyone's alarm bells went off.
The price on this one is starting to rise quickly,
gatorcpa
Kyle knows someone who might own a pie-pan Ref. 2887, but is questioning the case not having pierced lugs. I'm confused about the rarity of white gold (or are they really rhodium plated steel) arrowhead markers. Almost all of the steel 1st gen Constellations I've seen have yellow markers.
The box is of the correct type, but clearly not the original and is missing the insert. Is the bracelet of the correct style for this watch?
Does seem to have correct crystal, crown and movement, which are usually the first things replaced. I guess that's why everyone's alarm bells went off.
The price on this one is starting to rise quickly,
gatorcpa
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mondodec
路Good points Evan.
The first cal 501 watch head to be accessorised with a BOR was the Seamaster Special 2975. It was Genta, working on contract with Omega, who put the two together in 1959, so the BOR in this 2887 is within the realms of possibility.
The markers are rhodium plated as far as I know. I've seen a few SS 2852s with rhodium dial furniture and so I believe rhodium on this 2887 is correct.
Has anyone asked for extra pics of dial?
Cheers
Desmond
The first cal 501 watch head to be accessorised with a BOR was the Seamaster Special 2975. It was Genta, working on contract with Omega, who put the two together in 1959, so the BOR in this 2887 is within the realms of possibility.
The markers are rhodium plated as far as I know. I've seen a few SS 2852s with rhodium dial furniture and so I believe rhodium on this 2887 is correct.
Has anyone asked for extra pics of dial?
Cheers
Desmond
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Gavin
路I have asked the seller for more pics and if the fonts are white or silver. Will post here if he replies.
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watchyouwant
路Good points Evan.
The first cal 501 watch head to be accessorised with a BOR was the Seamaster Special 2975. It was Genta, working on contract with Omega, who put the two together in 1959, so the BOR in this 2887 is within the realms of possibility.
The markers are rhodium plated as far as I know. I've seen a few SS 2852s with rhodium dial furniture and so I believe rhodium on this 2887 is correct.
Has anyone asked for extra pics of dial?
Cheers
Desmond
mine was refurbished in biel and john diethelm told me, that markers and hands are white gold, not rhodium plated . they even have a different shine..... kind regards. achim
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MSNWatch
路路Vintage Omega AficionadoAchim,
Did Bienne repaint your dial or were you fortunate enough to get a NOS one from them?
And what do you think about the dial of the watch being discussed?
Mike
Did Bienne repaint your dial or were you fortunate enough to get a NOS one from them?
And what do you think about the dial of the watch being discussed?
Mike
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MSNWatch
路路Vintage Omega AficionadoNow that we have a definite "unsure" on the dial being refinished, what do the assembled intelligencia think about the rest of the watch?
Kyle knows someone who might own a pie-pan Ref. 2887, but is questioning the case not having pierced lugs. I'm confused about the rarity of white gold (or are they really rhodium plated steel) arrowhead markers. Almost all of the steel 1st gen Constellations I've seen have yellow markers.
The box is of the correct type, but clearly not the original and is missing the insert. Is the bracelet of the correct style for this watch?
Does seem to have correct crystal, crown and movement, which are usually the first things replaced. I guess that's why everyone's alarm bells went off.
The price on this one is starting to rise quickly,
gatorcpa
Early connies with WG arrowhead markers are uncommon especially the true piepans. Goes without saying that black or textured dials with these markers are downright rare.
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watchyouwant
路Achim,
Did Bienne repaint your dial or were you fortunate enough to get a NOS one from them?
And what do you think about the dial of the watch being discussed?
Mike
FORTUNATE to get NOS dial and hands. omegas re-paints are below standard...... kind regards. achim
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watchyouwant
路FORTUNATE to get NOS dial and hands. omegas re-paints are below standard...... kind regards. achim
and the print is in silver, yes.....
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stefan
路I think it is an original factory replacement dial, not refurbished, it looks almost perfect and I think you guys are going to the extreme with this dial, having owned over 50 Constellation watches I would be happy to add this one to my collection.
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MSNWatch
路路Vintage Omega AficionadoI think it is an original factory replacement dial, not refurbished, it looks almost perfect and I think you guys are going to the extreme with this dial, having owned over 50 Constellation watches I would be happy to add this one to my collection.
You always closely scrutinize these very rare dials. And the question is add to the collection at what price? For less than a thousand you will probably find dozens of takers but at $3k, $5k, higher? That is really the question because if the dial is factory original, this watch will fetch a lot of money.
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stefan
路Here are some pictures that might help, watch pictured was new old stock watch and I believe it was exactly the same kind of watch you guys are talking about except this one was in 10 times better condition. Watch was offered for sale for quite a few years ago, seller didn't want to open the back so I can't confirm the reference but it ticks all the boxes and there are no drilled lugs. I have seen this reference with both drilled and none drilled lugs.This watch went for over $4k in the end but can't remember the exact figure, it was too much for me to swallow at that time. Sorry about the quality of the pictures.
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MSNWatch
路路Vintage Omega AficionadoWas this watch sold by a long time dealer of vintage rolex watches from NYC?
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gatorcpa
路路惟F InvestiGatorWell folks, there you have it!
Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread. This needs to be saved in an archive somewhere.
Let the real bidding begin,
gatorcpa
Thanks to everyone who contributed to this thread. This needs to be saved in an archive somewhere.
Let the real bidding begin,
gatorcpa
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