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Problem with Speedy 321
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Evitzee
·Only to maintain the false mystique of the 321, that any competent watchmaker can service...
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Foo2rama
··Nowhere near as grumpy as he used to be...Indeed, Omega has played the 321 like a fine Stradivarius, engendering the idea that this very average column wheel movement can only be properly serviced by experienced, well trained technicians in Bienne at the tippy top of the watchmaking pyramid. Guess it worked, I bought a new EW321 last year. 😁
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M'Bob
·Only to maintain the false mystique of the 321, that any competent watchmaker can service...
Not disagreeing, but I sent three different cal. 321’s to three different, respected service centers/ watchmakers, and they all struggled to get the daily rate in three positions, and delta, within quoted spec.
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OmegaOwner2019
·Only to maintain the false mystique of the 321, that any competent watchmaker can service...
They probably just don't want ANY parts to leave the motherland.
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerNot disagreeing, but I sent three different cal. 321’s to three different, respected service centers/ watchmakers, and they all struggled to get the daily rate in three positions, and delta, within quoted spec.
So the delta at full wind over 3 positions is supposed to be below 20 seconds, and 24 hours after full wind below 30 seconds, and the daily rate between 0 and +16.
Not exactly stellar numbers, but as I've said many times, the performance of a vintage watch is more likely to be determined by its condition, rather than the original specs.
Did they give reasons why these numbers couldn't be achieved?
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerThey probably just don't want ANY parts to leave the motherland.
Some parts are available, but many are not. Many here predicted/insisted that when the new 321 was introduced, it would open up access to all 321 parts for certified watchmakers (like me). They even went so far as to claim that the Omega CEO promised this, but if so, that was an empty promise. I was skeptical of this claim for a reason.
The fact that watchmakers all over the world get these running very well without full access to parts, is in fact proof that this really isn't something particularly special or difficult from a watchmaking point of view. It's a bog standard chronograph movement from the time it was made, that has been hyped up beyond all reality...
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OmegaOwner2019
·Some parts are available, but many are not. Many here predicted/insisted that when the new 321 was introduced, it would open up access to all 321 parts for certified watchmakers (like me). They even went so far as to claim that the Omega CEO promised this, but if so, that was an empty promise. I was skeptical of this claim for a reason.
The fact that watchmakers all over the world get these running very well without full access to parts, is in fact proof that this really isn't something particularly special or difficult from a watchmaking point of view. It's a bog standard chronograph movement from the time it was made, that has been hyped up beyond all reality...
Totally agree.
Just look at the Seagull ST1902. The original Venus movement was a peer of 321. The Chinese are churning them out in the millions per year.
Surely Omega doesn't need god damn arcane alchemy to make the 321.
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MRC
·Totally agree.
Just look at the Seagull ST1902. The original Venus movement was a peer of 321. The Chinese are churning them out in the millions per year.
Surely Omega doesn't need god damn arcane alchemy to make the 321.
Yes, ST1902 is a direct derivative of the Venus 175 (column wheel, introduced ~1950), 7750 is a heavily developed derivative of the Venus 188 (cam-lever, also ~1950) via the Valjoux 7730 and its successors.
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M'Bob
·So the delta at full wind over 3 positions is supposed to be below 20 seconds, and 24 hours after full wind below 30 seconds, and the daily rate between 0 and +16.
Not exactly stellar numbers, but as I've said many times, the performance of a vintage watch is more likely to be determined by its condition, rather than the original specs.
Did they give reasons why these numbers couldn't be achieved?
Without being specific, I was told it was due to “general wear of the parts which is common on vintage watches.” Often, it seemed that the watches would run fast dial up, and slow crown down, so the delta, in particular, was hard to get into spec.
I believe you’ve posted in the past that the 321 daily rate spec was (-)1 to (+)16. Has this changed?
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerWithout being specific, I was told it was due to “general wear of the parts which is common on vintage watches.” Often, it seemed that the watches would run fast dial up, and slow crown down, so the delta, in particular, was hard to get into spec.
I believe you’ve posted in the past that the 321 daily rate spec was (-)1 to (+)16. Has this changed?
Yes.
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sheepdoll
·I'd rather work on a column wheel than cams any day. My speedy though is 861. I have two other Lemania movements (with) cams which I have no qualms about working on myself. But the speemaster. That one is special. Mostly due to the case, dial and hands. I do not have all the fancy holders and tools and such.
Eventually I would like to find someone I can trust to give it a good once over. I sort of wanted to send it to the factory, but after what has been written here...
On the other hand I have spent any extra funds that I would have spent for service on that money pit of a zombie Val-72 Heurer. Which was basically non repairable. Still that is a fun movement to work on.
Eventually I would like to find someone I can trust to give it a good once over. I sort of wanted to send it to the factory, but after what has been written here...
On the other hand I have spent any extra funds that I would have spent for service on that money pit of a zombie Val-72 Heurer. Which was basically non repairable. Still that is a fun movement to work on.
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M'Bob
·Yes.
So, if I read between the lines: they have had this movement in the line for many, many years. The specs for daily rate were (-)1 to (+) 16. They reintroduced the movement recently, and while they say they made a faithful reproduction of the original, they’ve tightened the specs. Interesting…
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Archer
··Omega Qualified WatchmakerSo, if I read between the lines: they have had this movement in the line for many, many years. The specs for daily rate were (-)1 to (+) 16. They reintroduced the movement recently, and while they say they made a faithful reproduction of the original, they’ve tightened the specs. Interesting…
They changed all the spec ranges so that there were no negative numbers a while back, before the new 321 was even listed in the timing documentation. Remember this range is for an average, so reducing it by one second isn't terribly significant when the spread is already so large.
So for example the 1120, a chronometer movement, it was -1 to +6, and now it's 0 to +6. So it's range was also reduced by one second. In fact most movements had their ranges reduced by a second, so this is not related to the 321.
There are some exceptions, so for the 550/560 series used to be -1 to +16 as well, but they changed it to 0 to +18 for some reason. It's not because that range is more difficult to obtain, so in some ways this doesn't make a ton of sense.
I wouldn't read a lot into this...that it's something specific to the 321's mystique...
