Phillips auction in Geneva.......

eugeneandresson

Surely a money launderer would still want to get the most bang for his laundered-buck? I don’t understand why he would want to waste it this way by over-paying at auction (as is obvious the only laundry I do is stinky clothes)...

jhross98

you'd have to be nuts laundering 25,000 by paying a 30% premium for a watch where there is another 10% bid-ask to re-sell it. . .

kov

Because too much cash can indeed be a real problem. And the « wasted » part that exceeds the market value is the cost of the laundering service ;-)

Watch Narcos on Netflix, it has nothing to do with watches but allows you to see the (too much) cash problem from a different perspective 😀

dsacks30

If money laundering was one of the primary drivers of these prices, then wouldn't you see it to the same extent at all of the major auction houses? Why Phillips over their competitors? What I don't understand is how Aurel gets prices that Christie's and Sotheby's couldn't dream of. Is this really a result of the magnetism of his personality and his perceived expertise above all of his peers?

queriver

Re money laundering, would Phillips even be able to accept large quantities of cash and if so, surely the Swiss authorities would be asking questions? And how does the cash get to Geneva, especially these days?

tyrantlizardrex

There's laundering and there's laundering right?

You might have cash "stuck" somewhere and need it to be somewhere else... so you could pay in one Phillips office (Hong Kong for example), and collect the watch from another (Switzerland perhaps?), and then take it to another country (the USA) on your wrist.

It's a really good way to move money across borders when legitimate means aren't available.

Mark020

Don't follow this either.

K killer67

FAP 2998-5 sold for 50K which was not a good watch

queriver

Understand about settling in another country but Phillips' offices are mostly in jurisdictions where suitcases of cash raise questions. I'm not saying it's not happening but it's probably more the exception than the rule and therefore unlikely to be materially moving the market.

tyrantlizardrex

Not necessarily suitcases of cash - think of businesses/people who have huge amounts of cash in one jurisdiction and want to move it somewhere else without paying tax.

At that point we're into tax evasion/avoidance... but then depending on how the money was acquired in the first place.

jhross98

if this is the case then why is a lange time zone in platinum only going for 40k CHF ?

Ree

Might sound like a stupid question, but: wouldn't money launderers/asset border-transporters be better off buying from dealers at better prices? Why risk getting the spotlight from a major event?

ndgal

If one wanted to launder money, buying watches in a public auction from an auction house will not be the place to do so...😵‍💫