Omega Speedmaster 145.012-67 a possible Ultraman? on an auction!

Forum Friends!

This time I thought that I would do a post on an upcoming auction!

And I do hope that i won't get any Flak here?
Some of you (and I think we all know who) don't like this kind of posts…...

But the auction house is one of the bigger players, so I do think that a few of us already have seen it?

Anyway…

It is a 145.012-67, with the famous orange chrono.
The serial nr 26077603 places the watch in the range of an Ultraman.
But with no extract - who knows what is correct?
I have seen a couple of extracts with serial nr 26076426, 2607705x & 26077795,
and the remarks on the extracts are: Special model fitted with an orange chronograph hand.

But that makes the spread of the range quite large based on the serial numbers?
And also with the bad taste from the latest scandal that made the service close down,
what do we know about how they managed to do the extracts for the Ultramans?

This could be a hard one to decide?

But the quality of the watch?
Had it not been the orange hand, I would have not looked further…because the condition it not very exiting!
So here goes an assessment based on the pictures from the auction house!

The dial:
Black/Jet black, and as usual, its hard to see if there are some scratches or oilmarks…
but assuming that there are not any.
The subdials do seem to have marks on the edges.

Good

The lume:
Really tired and messy, lots of algae, and also missing lume.
I have handled an Ultraman before, and it had the same boring lume also.

Fair

The hands:
If I am correct, the chrono should be a little longer than the standard chrono, and it looks like it is.
A bit weird that the color is still on the center of the chrono,
since it has been serviced at least 3 times…maybe a little paint job?

Lumeloss on minutehand, and discoloration to the subhand for the second counter,
the other subhands have a lot of marks also.

This is the hard part - since we are talking about a possible Ultraman.

Good

The bezel:

It is a DoN, and has lived a very hard life.
Scratches and marks all over, and a Megading on the 75-85 side.

Poor

Case and case back:

There are marks and and scratches all over, with a couple of deeper marks.
The case back has a strange engraving and a few opening marks.

Fair

The movement:
Since it has had at least 3 different services, it has some marks and scratches from the watchmakers.
But nothing strange or weird.

Good

The pushers could be original since there is lots of dirt on the necks.
The crown is a service crown.
The crystal is very scratched, but has the old Omega logo, which is nice.

My Do You Like The Watchometer is very low on this one, not much appealing.
My verdict would set this watch as a FAIR watch.

And since it is very very hard to know IF this is an Ultraman - how can I/we set a correct value?
The starting bid is 20000 € / 21300 $ plus 33.6% premium
I have asked the auction house for more info regarding ownership, services and history, but no answer for now.
IF it would be an Ultraman, then the startingprice would be attractive...

And now it is time for you GUYS and GALS to help me and the Forum with what a real Ultraman is or should be!
So please help out and educate us??

Looking forward to a nice and healthy discussion!

I think that is an enthusiastic estimate, especially as we cannot get extracts.

Lots of condition issues.

What it has going for it is that it appears original

Those who can't find the auction - send me a DM, and I will answer!
😀

I agree it’s ‘fair’. My issue with Ultraman’s in general and also this specific watch is that I just don’t get it. An orange hand is meant to make such a huge difference to the value as it’s uncommon?! I think now the speculators are leaving the speedy market the delta that collectors are willing to pay for an Ultraman over a standard 145.012-67 will reduce.

My biggest issue, though, I just don’t like them. They look clumsy and unattractive. This example especially so. Whereas an exotic dial Camaro or Racing dial Speedmaster is genuinely different and an attractive, uncommon alternative to a standard dial, these literally look like someone haphazardly threw an orange hand on and thought “that will do”.
There’s no thought or design to them and as a result they look jarring and less attractive than a normal version. Not for me. This one especially so.

Condition is fantastic. It was used as intended.

I see your point, but is this hand really any different then where the dot on a bezel is located, or if there’s some red lettering on the dial that is white on other dials, and any of the other small differences that are valued?

The only real difference is that this one is easier to fake. But from an overall practical significance standpoint, it’s not much different than these other small changes.

I guess it just depends on what you personally value.

Precisely. I don’t personally value it or find it attractive, and it’s a relatively simply bolt on that’s easier to fake than a DoN bezel or a red line sub dial.
The whole EoA’s debacle also casts a shadow over these as it’s easy to distinguish which references/serials should have a DoN, much less with an Ultraman as there’s a known (approximate) serial range, but obviously it contains non Ultraman watches as well.

Here is the Ultraman that I handled a few years ago.
The lume was really messed up, but somebody liked it, and the biding was furious...!
This one with an extract, and a Swedish watch, so maybe an honest Ultraman?

I have read somewhere how many there could be, but I can't remember...any one knows??

I understand your point, and these orange ”fake” chrono hands are quit easy to find…
But i think that the latest (Swedish) watch that i posted could be a true Ultraman.
I dont think that the elder gentleman who consigned the watch had any connections or thoughts to pimp the watch?
And the auction house and the curator there would never do this…

But who knows…?
😗

Was there ever a definitive answer to the question of whether the 'special equipment' enigmatically mentioned on the extracts for the UM is just the orange hand, or was there actually a more inky black dial also? Some verified watches do seem very black, others like those on this thread much less so. It seems odd they describe it this way if it's just the hand colour but I have long suspected that Omega have no reliable record of these and have been more or less guessing based on serial range and/or a wink and a nudge for years so perhaps they are being vague because they just don't know.

Id love to know what (if anything) it actually says in the archives about these Ultraman speedmasters.

As soon as pictures were required, the extract process ceased to be meaningful imo

The color/texture of the dial can be a pretty good piece of evidence for legitimacy. But as Achim noted, a crap watch is still a crap watch. I looked at one locally a few years ago, and I was 99% sure it was legit, but it was just an ugly watch, and my only interest would have been to flip it.

Do elaborate Dan. Are you saying that you do think the dial is different on the Ultraman to the std watch? I've always wondered at this, I mean why would they bother to fit a dial that is so similar to the std 145.012-67 but ever so slightly different. If there truly is a verifiable dial difference, how come there is any uncertainty at all?

I don't know if every Ultraman had the satin black dial, or if that dial was only used with the Ultraman. But the dials aren't common and they are often seen on the Ultraman models. So when an Ultraman has that dial, it adds to the likelihood of authenticity IMO. The example I saw was a one owner watch that had been serviced by my watchmaker several times over the decades, so it was pretty credible anyway.

All they should need is a serial number. If they ask for anything else, it becomes sketchy to me...

Some info from the auction house:
We do have some information regarding provenance.
According to the vendor of the watch, he is the one and only owner. It was a gift from his parents for his 20th birthday in 1968 !
When we showed the watch to Omega, they just confirmed that it was all original, nothing more.