If your a serious buyer then an extract is not needed.
For me it demonstrated there is no confidence in these being worth more than £20k or it would have hit that number, and been bought by a dealer
I thought the pictures were good enough to make a judgement on the condition.
An orange hand and hype only go so far. As the ST2 fades from people’s consciousness so does the ‘original’
Sorry
@simonsays my little semi rant below is not directed at you
👍
I wasn't a buyer, but if I was.....
For me I couldn't see the condition or texture of the dial, the movement condition was a mystery too, the movement looked in poor shape and the movement ring looked like it had many marks or was this just bad photography? The question why the seller didn't get an extract is also worth thinking about, I have seen these watches in the correct serial range without orange hand and have also seen a orange hand for sale not too long ago too, so is it worth the risk? I think buyers would have been more comfortable with an extract and better photos, that I am certain. The buyer confidence wasn't there in my eyes and buyer confidence would have made some difference surely?.
That being said though I think the price was pretty good considering the above, I think 20k is about right for one of these in good shape from a private/non dealer isn't it? even with archive, so wasn't this a good price even at 16k£ considering the listing and its photographs?
Unfortunately because of the money involved these days there is a lot knocked up crap around we all know that, you cannot be too careful if you are spending your hard earned money, pretty sad really but these are the times we live in, so it is madness not to buckle up, do your research and be very careful.
Like many others here I love taking a punt on a watch with bad photography, I have bought some great watches in the past that way but with the UM and many other watches like this you have to be very cautious or you could lose out in a big way.
I am also very careful with what I buy these days from International locations anyway, with PayPal refunds you can get hit for many £100s on a refund due to their Currency conversion process and it is a pain getting import costs back too, so that blunts my risk taking these days on the more expensive stuff.
I would like to come back in five years time to see how many of these UM watches we have then, I think it will be interesting when the dust settles.
Is the Ultraman worth more than a standard 145.012?. Are any of the prices achieved by some of the rare or not watches these days really worth it? For me its a no only because I can't really afford to buy them any longer as a collector but there are many people out there with a higher income who will buy these watches like the average guy (like me) buying a pack of chewing gum. (lucky buggers)
Buying anything these days with people quoting C24 prices is very hard I think for many people, as soon as I hear "these are on C24 for X£ " I just turn off and know I won't be a buyer has a collector or dealer.
To be fair to the UM I think anyone could ask the same value question of many other watches. I have seen this with many other watches from other brands too, is it because of the hype and then value increase of these things? Are any of the hyped or not watches whether rare or interesting really worth the asking prices these days? If you want them and can comfortably afford them I think it is much easier to swallow but when you can remember them being cheaper it is harder to come to terms with.
Price rises have always been an issue with some collectors when it comes to watches, it didn't feel too long ago when people complained about prices of certain watches, now years on, these watches can now be worth much, much more, so they are now classed as a great investment and people are kicking themselves, me included.
The problem is that most people taking a new genuine interest in vintage watches these days can only just gaze longingly at some of these watches which is a real shame and this has took much of the enjoyment away from it all I think, watches have become a pretty solid investment that is for sure and where money comes into it so do people who are interested in investment and money.
The hype of course comes from manufacturers, auction houses and dealers this won't stop as long as money is involved and who can blame them? gone are the days when watch collectors could easily search out and buy a certain watch they really liked at a reasonable price just because they liked it, that is unless you are prepared to spend many, many happy hours searching or just drop lucky which is always a great bonus.
If you do your homework, search, search, search, buy what you like and are comfortable with what you have paid and can afford you have cracked it IMO, no other rules need to apply for me. I have known people over stretch and get themselves into debt with watches which is not good. I have never seen the point in buying something you cannot afford, it is only kidding yourself and if people like you because they think you are wealthy, this type of person is never worth knowing anyway.
The good news I think>
Although it is harder to find them at affordable prices these days, many good, desirable watches are still out there at bargain prices, it is harder to find them but the fun factor is still there for me and many other people too I should imagine. The searching for me is very enjoyable and the knowledge gained along the way is great too but being a dealer as well as a collector it doesn't pay the bills so a bit of pressure is always in the back of my mind personally.
Things have changed over the last 15 years and it is a bit frustrating if you love watches but don't have the kind of funds to buy the ones you like best.
Just my 2p worth and not meant to be condescending in any way shape or form.
Cheers, Michael
