Last Resort..Redial, Who is the Best?

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So in that case, having a dial made from scratch is probably safer? If the re-dialer doesn't so a good job, you can try again with another one. Obviously money is an issue so doing this is not practical at all. Theoretically speaking, it's the only non-destructive way?

For very simple dials, say those that are just a flat piece of metal, this might make some sense financially. But for complex dials that are curved, pie pan shaped, or other complex shapes like chronographs with sunken sub-dials, this would be very cost prohibitive, even if you could find someone to do it.

I have some experience with this, but not in the same way you are suggesting. I sent a dial from a vintage Rolex to be refinished at a place in Dallas that "specialized" in Rolex dials - it had already been refinished once sometime in the past and it was done very poorly. The dial was fully printed (no applied markers) had a slight curve to it, and my customer wanted it made into a dial with applied markers. The company said this was not a problem for them to do, but when they were drilling holes to affix the markers, something happened and the dial was ruined in the process - they didn't go into details.

They offered to make a new dial from scratch, and to do so I had to send the movement and case to them so they could make sure it all fit. Even with sending all that the dial they made was a flat dial, so no curve, and the dial feet were rotated a few degrees out of position, so the 12 o'clock marker on the dial was at 11:45 on the movement. It was a mess and the dial was unusable - this place told me they could do it no problems as they made dials from scratch all the time.

I've said this before but in the watchmaker community there is almost constant chatter about who is the best at refinishing dials, so the question comes up once every couple of weeks it seems. Various refinishing companies are heroes one day and zeros the next - consistency tends to be a big problem with these places. As the disclaimer on your investment fund says, past performance is not an indicator of future outcomes when it comes to these places. This is why I hesitate to recommend a specific place, because results can be so variable.

Cheers, Al
 
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For very simple dials, say those that are just a flat piece of metal, this might make some sense financially. But for complex dials that are curved, pie pan shaped, or other complex shapes like chronographs with sunken sub-dials, this would be very cost prohibitive, even if you could find someone to do it.

I have some experience with this, but not in the same way you are suggesting. I sent a dial from a vintage Rolex to be refinished at a place in Dallas that "specialized" in Rolex dials - it had already been refinished once sometime in the past and it was done very poorly. The dial was fully printed (no applied markers) had a slight curve to it, and my customer wanted it made into a dial with applied markers. The company said this was not a problem for them to do, but when they were drilling holes to affix the markers, something happened and the dial was ruined in the process - they didn't go into details.

They offered to make a new dial from scratch, and to do so I had to send the movement and case to them so they could make sure it all fit. Even with sending all that the dial they made was a flat dial, so no curve, and the dial feet were rotated a few degrees out of position, so the 12 o'clock marker on the dial was at 11:45 on the movement. It was a mess and the dial was unusable - this place told me they could do it no problems as they made dials from scratch all the time.

I've said this before but in the watchmaker community there is almost constant chatter about who is the best at refinishing dials, so the question comes up once every couple of weeks it seems. Various refinishing companies are heroes one day and zeros the next - consistency tends to be a big problem with these places. As the disclaimer on your investment fund says, past performance is not an indicator of future outcomes when it comes to these places. This is why I hesitate to recommend a specific place, because results can be so variable.

Cheers, Al

In all honestly, there's a lot of what you said here that I hadn't thought of. Really great example.

This leads me to a next question:

Do most of these shops have comparable tools and equipment to what an OEM could have today? Or at least the equipment the OEMs might have had back in the 1950s, 60s, 70s, etc?

Do modern equipment even matter or is it more of an art form?

I would imagine a shop today has considerable better equipment than when the vintage watch was made: Moores' law should be in favor of independent modern redialers when it comes to what they should be able to acquire.
 
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If you mean the printing part, then pad or tampon printing is the normal method.


It's used for all sorts of products and this is how the redial places reproduce a dial. The key is how accurate the plates are made, and to make an accurate version of the dial you would need a good example to start with.

Often some refinishers will offer 2 services. One is what I call the "close enough" service where they look at the dial you want, go through their inventory of plates, and pick what is "close enough" and reprint your dial using that. Then there is a premium service where they will custom make plates specifically for your dial, in order to get is as close as possible. If you have multiple colours of a dial, a plate is needed for each and there is a tooling charge to have each plate created. I can get expensive for a one off dial, and often even the premium service results in lines that are thicker than the original, and test being slightly different.

Cheers, Al
 
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If you mean the printing part, then pad or tampon printing is the normal method.


It's used for all sorts of products and this is how the redial places reproduce a dial. The key is how accurate the plates are made, and to make an accurate version of the dial you would need a good example to start with.

Often some refinishers will offer 2 services. One is what I call the "close enough" service where they look at the dial you want, go through their inventory of plates, and pick what is "close enough" and reprint your dial using that. Then there is a premium service where they will custom make plates specifically for your dial, in order to get is as close as possible. If you have multiple colours of a dial, a plate is needed for each and there is a tooling charge to have each plate created. I can get expensive for a one off dial, and often even the premium service results in lines that are thicker than the original, and test being slightly different.

Cheers, Al
I am really surprised this is that complicated. Funny thing is, this makes things even more interesting to me imo.

A lot of the recent dials like the new Aquaterras or the JLC Polaris must use very specialized equipment to get the mutile textures, etc.

In 50 years collectors are going to have a hard time reproducing or redialing these types of dials 😉

Image source
 
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The refinished dial is back from Dial Craft. Overall, I’m pleasantly surprised with how it turned out. This was somewhat of a custom job as I don’t believe this dial variation existed (black dial with Roman numerals and crosshairs). The crosshairs are a bit thick and there are some minor alignment issues that are visible when looking at macro photos but the watch looks quite nice on the wrist.
 
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Sorry, cross hairs are a mess.
They look fuzzy, but we're looking at them at nearly 10x magnification. Maybe a wrist shot would bring us peace of mind, @Vanallard ?
 
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I'll post a wrist shot in a few hours. I would agree with you, macro photos tend to highlight even the slightest imperfection. This could have turned out so much worse.

They look fuzzy, but we're looking at them at nearly 10x magnification. Maybe a wrist shot would bring us peace of mind, @Vanallard ?
 
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It's good... the question is not whether it's better than an original dial on a watch that's been living in a safe deposit box for 50 years, the question is whether it's better than what was there before and looks good on the wrist.
 
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next time , you use them, tell them to print in white. not silver. and center the swiss made. kind regards. achim
 
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next time , you use them, tell them to print in white. not silver. and center the swiss made. kind regards. achim
Swiss Made is positioned correctly. The centered version is one of the classic redial giveaways 😉

Edited:
 
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Wrist shot
Nice. I wouldn't mind that watch on my wrist.
 
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Nice. I wouldn't mind that watch on my wrist.

Same! I bought the watch with the intention of giving it to my sister after having the dial refinished but I’m tempted to keep it for myself 😁
 
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Same! I bought the watch with the intention of giving it to my sister after having the dial refinished but I’m tempted to keep it for myself 😁

Who ended up wearing it - you or your sister? 😀
 
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Who ended up wearing it - you or your sister? 😀

Sister - she coincidentally asked me recently if she should change the battery 🤦
 
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What is with all the thread Necromancy?

Sill it was an interesting thread. A subject I am most interested in.