Respectable Member Privateday7
As per your request and maybe also some others, here is the case with eBay. now.
It is hoped forum members will find it educational and be wary, when buying and selling, whether through eBay or elsewhere.
1) July 2, 2013:
My complaint to eBay:
eBay Customer Support has opened a case for you.The seller has until Jul 09, 2013 to respond. Jul 02, 2013 at 5:53 AM
The details you provided:
The item doesn't match the seller's description.
Your phone number: 612 XXXXXXXX.
We will not share your phone number with the seller.
The item is fake
Additional information:
"item is counterfeit. "
You've requested:
A refund. The refund amount includes the purchase price plus original shipping.
eBay Customer Support comments:
"This item is not covered by the eBay Buyer Protection."
2) July 2, 2013:
Seller responded:
"Buyer has systematically lied since he bid on this item. He Bid $3000, then won item. He then tried to avoid buying item by telling seller that he was acting as a representative for another buyer. His "buyer" no longer wanted the item and he asked to cancel purchase. Buyer is sophisticated watch buyer. He has atetmpted to resell it at above-the-market price for over 50 days. He claims to have sold it for $3500 to a "cousin" who looked at a Rolex Forum website (I am a Rolex forums website member) who noted that there are a number of fakes in Australia. However - this item is genuine as it was purchased thru a "trusted seller" Rolex dealer and paid for thru Paypal and my purchase transaction is documented in Paypal. In previous Rolex forums postings by Orotek (ebuyer), he indicated he wanted item for HIMSELF, and appears to now have buyers remorse over price paid (50 days later). (continued)"
"Buyer has now concocted in elaborate scheme on Rolex forums website by posting pics of the Rolex Daytona Clasp and getting other reg. members to scream "FAKE" in an attempt to "unwind" this transaction due to buyer's remorse. Note that this ebay item was posted by me for sale at $4,000 with several pics of this item on this same Rolex Forums website and then viewed by 343 Rolex Forum website members, NOT one of whom made any such allegations. The item is genuine, purchased by me from a trusted seller Rolex dealer and such purchase by me is documented with the "trusted seller" thru my paypal account in Feb 2013. The Ebay buyer has misrepresented every single circumstance he has said in communication since the day he won the bid. I can document the items purchase and authenticity, and all of buyers misrepresentations to me via email and on Rolex Forums website. In addition to perfect ebay record, I also hold 2 professional licenses with highest quality reviews - both CPA & CVA."
3) July 6, 2013:
My response: "Sir I am unhappy with your response. When my son is available to help me out, since I am not computer-savvy, I shall respond to you. Thank-you."
4) July 9, 2013:
My response:
"In response to my complaint lodged with eBay, you have made several unfounded allegations which I refute in the strongest terms as follows:
A) You allege that I
'tried to avoid buying item' and
'asked to cancel purchase'.
I refer to my email sent to you on May 6, after your listing ended on May 4. On May 7, I paid you $3 067.00 (including shipping) via PayPal.
Email from me to you, on May 6.
"Sir
Kindly send me a revised bill,
so that I can make the payment.
My buyer-friend has decided not to buy it, since he has just discovered, he has to buy an insurance-cover (cost A$6 000.00) for his home-loan to buy a unit.
If you think you want to cancel the deal amicably, I am willing to accept it. However, if you want to proceed,
I shall pay for the Rolex buckle and will try to re-sell it, later on."(Please note: There is
no indication I
'tried to avoid buying' or
'cancel purchase'.)
B) You allege
'he wanted item for HIMSELF'
On May 4, I bought your bucklefor my buyer-friend. On May 6 (
pls see email above), my buyer-friend informed me that he could not buy the buckle. I did not have to inform you of my private arrangement with him that I would keep the buckle for a week or two in case he should be able to borrow some money from another source. If this should not be the case, I would re-sell it. I immediately emailed you (
pls see email above) to inform you that my buyer-friend did not want the buckle. At the same time, I informed you that I would
honor the transaction - isn't that good enough?On May 7, (this is after my buyer-friend did not want the buckle, which I bought on his behalf) I did indeed start a thread on Rolex forums looking for a buckle for myself - in this context, it is not compulsory for me to tell forum members that the watch actually belongs to my son. In the same thread, on May 8, I said I would rather get a vintage Rolex deployant buckle. However, I have abandoned the idea of getting a modern buckle because it is too expensive, even though my friend told me that he did not manage to obtain a private loan.
Surely you, as a CPA man, can accept that circumstances might change, sometimes even overnight. Yet you claim I am lying in just such a situation.
C) You allege
'appears to now have buyers remorse over price paid (50 days later)'
For obvious reasons, buyer's remorse would come after receiving the item, perhaps a week or two after, or at the very latest within 45 days after payment (after 45 days, not covered by eBay's buyer protection scheme) and not 50 days later.Of course, the basis for any opinion changed and buyer's remorse apparent after The Rolex Forums members, without my asking, whether the Rolex Daytona deployant buckle is genuine or otherwise, screamed your buckle is a counterfeit
http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=302740
and subsequently, Rolex Service Center Sydney confirmed your buckle is a counterfeit. The Rolex deployant buckle was physically attested by
RSC Sydney (Tel number 02-92518988) technicians (Michel and Michael).
When Rolex forums members pointed out that it is a counterfeit, you maintained that it is not easy to discern the authenticity of the buckle from pictures. To give you the benefit of doubt, I took the buckle to RSC for it to be attested, physically. Your allegations: forum members have lied, Rolex Service Center have lied and I have lied. Your views are certainly rather strange.
D) You allege that I '
concocted in elaborate scheme on Rolex forums website by posting pics of the Rolex Daytona Clasp and getting other reg. members to scream "FAKE" in an attempt to "unwind" this transaction due to buyer's remorse'
This is a very serious and unfounded allegation directed at the respectable TRF's moderators and members.
E) You allege when you advertised the buckle for sale at TRF,'
for sale at $4,000 with several pics of this item on this same Rolex Forums website and then viewed by 343 Rolex Forum website members, NOT one of whom made any such allegations'
Your advertisement in TRF is accompanied by non-high definition pictures and none of them show markings of stamps clearly. How on earth are forum members able to discern whether the deployant buckle is a counterfeit or a fake or something genuine?
Please see this link
http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=293947 Co-incidentally all the pictures accompanying your eBay listing do not show the markings or stamps on the buckle clearly either.
Please see link or item number: 130895728972
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rolex-Daytona-18K-Gold-Deployant-Clasp-Buckle-Genuine-/130895728972?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEWNX%3AIT&nma=true&si=bHmFn0Y32RJlwNwEHn4n62qbwxk%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc
F) In your email of July 2 to me, amongst others, you said,
'The reason I know this is because it is genuine, was removed from a Rolex Daytona watch by a rolex dealer.'
Clearly, the fact it was 'removed from a Rolex Daytona by a Rolex dealer' does not turn a counterfeit or a fake into the genuine article. Your assumption is wishful. It can be confirmed, RSC do not sell the buckle, separate from the Daytona watch, while a Rolex AD is not allowed to do so, too.
It is stressed, I only come to know, it is a counterfeit when, without asking, TRF members alerted me. Its counterfeit status is upheld by RSC, after inspecting it, physically.
Legend:
TRF = The Rolex Forums and
RSC = Rolex Service Center"
5) July 9, 2013:
Seller responded:
"You have NO Facts."
This is the situation, as up to now.
Kindly advise, what you think about the whole issue.
Thank-you.
