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Can a watch be art? Should art be a watch?

  1. Wivac

    Wivac Terribly special Dec 2, 2019

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    A group of 'provocateur ' artists are planning on choppping up a Danish artists piece they bought , to create '200-300' watches for their Letho brand of watches. Artist is a bit miffed.

    In October, they revealed plans to use the canvas as raw material to manufacture between 200 and 300 watches for Letho, their new brand, which they aim to sell for 10,000 Danish kroner (£1,150) each.
    "We needed an artist that was esteemed by experts because we also needed to get a reaction,” Thorleifsson said. “If we just took a $100 canvas, no one would really care. It needed to be a true masterpiece.”
    The duo, who also together run a Copenhagen design studio, have purchased paintings by three other recognised Danish artists, John Kørner, David Birkemose and Jens Birkemose, helped by funding from an unnamed patron.
    Courtesy of:
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/dec/02/danish-artist-tal-r-paris-chic-watches

    I think this is what they're going for, on the link below
    birk-still-01_4472x.jpg
    https://lethoart.myshopify.com/collections/all
    Its under the Kunst link. Stop giggling at the back.
    Actually quite interested to know if a high end watch was created out of this whether there would be more interest, rather than if its just a cheap movement and case with a bit of canvas slapped into it.
    Cue argument about the doing what you will with a thing you bought.
     
  2. M'Bob

    M'Bob Dec 2, 2019

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    I certainly like the idea of different, interesting, and novel materials being used as watch dials. But this, I'm afraid, holds no interest for me personally.
     
    DaveK, Mac5, Om3ga321 and 1 other person like this.
  3. madjestikmoose

    madjestikmoose Dec 2, 2019

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  4. time flies

    time flies Dec 2, 2019

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    Artist is a bit miffed? Art for art or art for money? One begets the other. Which is which? That's the hard part. Were we talking about a watch, forum members might say: the buyer owns the watch he is free to do as he pleases with it. Is a painting any different? I don't know. I do like the colours.

    have fun
    kfw
    20180924_193043.jpg
     
  5. Larry S

    Larry S Color Commentator for the Hyperbole. Dec 2, 2019

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    Interesting idea. While they have the right to chop up the painting, they were then going to trade on the artists name without his written permission. Nope. Not surprised at all that the judge slammed the door shut.
     
    noelekal, kkt and connieseamaster like this.
  6. Wivac

    Wivac Terribly special Dec 2, 2019

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    Interesting idea though as they've probably done quite well out if it - raised this Letho brand and kept the art.
     
  7. Evitzee

    Evitzee Dec 2, 2019

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    Thought provoking case. It seems an owner really doesn't have full control of his property. There is a cottage industry of changing new Rolex watches by special coatings and dials, could Rolex legally prevent this?
     
  8. Larry S

    Larry S Color Commentator for the Hyperbole. Dec 2, 2019

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    The issue that killed this was trading on the artists name without his permission. Copyright infringement. Same as if you decided to market watches with dials made from Coke cans you purchased.
     
  9. rcs914

    rcs914 Dec 2, 2019

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    I realize art is in the eye of the beholder and the artist themselves, but TBH I think this would have improved the original piece.
     
    Larry S likes this.
  10. S.H.

    S.H. Dec 2, 2019

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    So you can't sell a Campbell's tomato soup painting for example?

    It's hard to have a clear cut answer when art, copyright, fame, etc... are intertwined.

    Anyway, it was a nice move. For some small legal fees, they got a good buzz.
     
  11. time flies

    time flies Dec 2, 2019

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    I'm not sure. I can't defend it. I don't think its that cut and dry/ black and white. I've had quite a few images of my stuff used with little if any recourse. And you know?...sometimes I just don't care. It's so very little from my rice bowl.( apologies to The Sand Pebbles) It's my art. I know it . You know it. Who cares. I don't. I get paid. Art for art...art for money.

    Have fun. I do.
    kfw
     
    S.H. likes this.
  12. Larry S

    Larry S Color Commentator for the Hyperbole. Dec 2, 2019

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    Their mistake was not executing a licensing agreement from the artist. Yes if you tried to mass produce/commercialize something with Campbell’s image, you would hear from their attorneys. The artist is a brand and probably copyrighted since his stuff sells for big bucks.
     
    madjestikmoose likes this.
  13. madjestikmoose

    madjestikmoose Dec 2, 2019

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    Another analogy: if you’re a musician and you release a record, if someone else came along and sampled bits of your music to then sell on as their own music, the copyright infringement would be very serious.
     
  14. S.H.

    S.H. Dec 2, 2019

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    Not sure every rapper really paid lots of licensing fees...

    My point was, did Warhol paid anything to Campbell's?
     
  15. Archer

    Archer Omega Qualified Watchmaker Dec 2, 2019

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    Not so sure this holds up. Technically if I own that painting, and sell it on while advertising the artists name, that would also be trading on the artists name, right?

    I think this is more complicated than what is being suggested...
     
  16. time flies

    time flies Dec 2, 2019

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    Did Campbell's ever come asking? Or, were they happy for the acknowledgement? Art for art...art for money. You can't have it both ways. Or can you?

    have fun
    kfw
     
  17. time flies

    time flies Dec 2, 2019

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    It is more complicated. Much more complicated.

    have fun
    kfw
     
    Foo2rama likes this.
  18. Larry S

    Larry S Color Commentator for the Hyperbole. Dec 2, 2019

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    No
    30 years in marketing procurement. I think the ruling was spot on. I’d have killed a project like this. I have in fact shut down poorly conceived projects over IP.
     
    Dsloan likes this.
  19. time flies

    time flies Dec 2, 2019

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    Are you still in marketing procurement?

    have fun
    kfw
     
  20. Larry S

    Larry S Color Commentator for the Hyperbole. Dec 2, 2019

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    Retired from a global role in a big FMCG this year. Doing some consulting and conference speaking.