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ExpiredWatchdog
路I know this is apples and oranges but I have two 9300 movements, in an SMPO and a Speedmaster '57. The both say Si14 on the caseback, the SMPO rather loudly.
Calibre 8500: Do they all have a silicon balance spring?
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imranbecks
路Well thanks to this thread I just bought the 38.5mm non master co-axial Skyfall Aqua Terra with the date cage. 馃槈
I'll sell my master co-axial AT.
At the end of the day, I prefer the screen accurate version even with the Skyfall premium added to the price. And it will go nicely with my 2541.80 Goldeneye SMP (quartz) and my 2220.80 Casino Royale SMP. All the better that Skyfall and Casino Royale are two of my favorite Bond movies.
Bond novelty/limited edition watches don't do anything for me but I love the screen accurate productions.
Likewise. Even though I'm a big Bond fan, I too am not a fan of their in your face 007 limited models unless they're the ones worn on screen. Mine is the bigger brother 41.5mm AT with the Master Co-Axial and no frame around the date window that was worn in Spectre and in No Time To Die. Definitely appreciate the 2220.80 as being one Craig wore in his best Bond movie.
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路Likewise. Even though I'm a big Bond fan, I too am not a fan of their in your face 007 limited models unless they're the ones worn on screen. Mine is the bigger brother 41.5mm AT with the Master Co-Axial and no frame around the date window that was worn in Spectre and in No Time To Die. Definitely appreciate the 2220.80 as being one Craig wore in his best Bond movie.
Thanks for the pics. When Daniel Craig's Omega Bond watches are covered in articles or videos they oftentimes skip the AT's from Spectre and NTTD. Which is too bad because it's a beautiful watch.
I actually think the AT is the perfect Bond watch. He's more often than not wearing a suit or a tuxedo so the AT fits more naturally than a dive watch. And the AT has plenty of ruggedness for the beating Bond's watches take.
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imranbecks
路Thanks for the pics. When Daniel Craig's Omega Bond watches are covered in articles or videos they oftentimes skip the AT's from Spectre and NTTD. Which is too bad because it's a beautiful watch.
I actually think the AT is the perfect Bond watch. He's more often than not wearing a suit or a tuxedo so the AT fits more naturally than a dive watch. And the AT has plenty of ruggedness for the beating Bond's watches take.
Probably because those guys doing those videos or articles often overlook the AT and thinking only of the main watch Bond wears in Spectre or No Time To Die.
The Spectre AT does get a few mentions such as this one from an issue of the Omega Lifetime magazine.
It also gets a mention on the Omega website. It's still there today.
Seen on display as part of the Spectre exhibit alongside the Spectre SM300MC at the Omega museum.
And most recently the one worn during filming of No Time To Die was auctioned off at Christies.
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EuroDriver
路Here's some additional reading on the differences that I found: https://watchcharts.com/articles/p/...500a-8500b-8500g-8800-8900-co-axial-movements
The Cliffs Notes are that the Skyfall version is denoted as having a calibre 8500B movement while the NTTD version has the 8500G movement. The predecessor to these was the 8500A which did not have a Si14 balance spring.
As notes in earlier posts, this contradicts some other literature that suggests the 8500B resists magnetic fields up to 15,000 gauss while the 8500G has resistance of at least 15,000 gauss. Either way, they both have a Si14 balance spring, but the 8500G or NTTD version has some additional amagnetic parts.
The Cliffs Notes are that the Skyfall version is denoted as having a calibre 8500B movement while the NTTD version has the 8500G movement. The predecessor to these was the 8500A which did not have a Si14 balance spring.
As notes in earlier posts, this contradicts some other literature that suggests the 8500B resists magnetic fields up to 15,000 gauss while the 8500G has resistance of at least 15,000 gauss. Either way, they both have a Si14 balance spring, but the 8500G or NTTD version has some additional amagnetic parts.
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EuroDriver
路Thought I'd share this article as well which I found interesting because it claims that "Since 2011 the 8500/8501 have been equipped with the more stable silicon Si14 balance springs. The older versions will be gradually upgraded to Si14 balance springs at service."
The article mostly talks about the 8500 movement within the De Ville Hour Vision Chronometer but I wonder if the above is true for all watches with 8500 movement. That would be interesting.
https://www.bernardwatch.com/blog/omega-2500-8500-movements/
This article claims the same, specifically in reference to the Seamaster collection: "caliber 8500s manufactured after 2011 come equipped with the silicon Si14 balance springs. This silicon provides more stability to the movement. Owners of a caliber 8500 pre-2011 can have the balance springs easily upgraded."
https://millenarywatches.com/omega-calibre-8500/
The article mostly talks about the 8500 movement within the De Ville Hour Vision Chronometer but I wonder if the above is true for all watches with 8500 movement. That would be interesting.
https://www.bernardwatch.com/blog/omega-2500-8500-movements/
This article claims the same, specifically in reference to the Seamaster collection: "caliber 8500s manufactured after 2011 come equipped with the silicon Si14 balance springs. This silicon provides more stability to the movement. Owners of a caliber 8500 pre-2011 can have the balance springs easily upgraded."
https://millenarywatches.com/omega-calibre-8500/
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路The Skyfall 38.5mm Aqua Terra I recently bought was made in 2013 or 2014. I'm near 100% certain now it will have the Si14 hairspring. Which is pretty cool.
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EuroDriver
路It should. I've spent a significant amount of time (too much time) researching this. Apparently all "Skyfall" (blue dial) variants of the AT 8500 came with the Si14 balance spring - both 38.5 and 41.5mm. The AT 8500 variants produced before the Skyfall (grey dial and perhaps other color(s)) did not get it.
Post a pic of your when you get your hands on it!
Post a pic of your when you get your hands on it!
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路It should. I've spent a significant amount of time (too much time) researching this. Apparently all "Skyfall" (blue dial) variants of the AT 8500 came with the Si14 balance spring - both 38.5 and 41.5mm. The AT 8500 variants produced before the Skyfall (grey dial and perhaps other color(s)) did not get it.
Post a pic of your when you get your hands on it!
We should know by the end of the day as it is out for delivery. 馃榾
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Scooterino36
路Well thanks to this thread I just bought the 38.5mm non master co-axial Skyfall Aqua Terra with the date cage. 馃槈
I'll sell my master co-axial AT.
At the end of the day, I prefer the screen accurate version even with the Skyfall premium added to the price. And it will go nicely with my 2541.80 Goldeneye SMP (quartz) and my 2220.80 Casino Royale SMP. All the better that Skyfall and Casino Royale are two of my favorite Bond movies.
Bond novelty/limited edition watches don't do anything for me but I love the screen accurate productions.
It's interesting to me that the Bond enthusiasts never seem to mention the standard issue Planet Ocean worn in Skyfall. Simply a matter of taste?
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路It's interesting to me that the Bond enthusiasts never seem to mention the standard issue Planet Ocean worn in Skyfall. Simply a matter of taste?
I don't think the PO from Skyfall is ignored. There's a close up of the watch when Bond is on the train that appears in a lot articles/videos regarding the Omega Bond watches.
If that particular PO doesn't get all the love it deserves I'd guess it's because it is so similar to the PO from Quantum of Solace. Both 42mm black dial Planet Oceans.
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路It should. I've spent a significant amount of time (too much time) researching this. Apparently all "Skyfall" (blue dial) variants of the AT 8500 came with the Si14 balance spring - both 38.5 and 41.5mm. The AT 8500 variants produced before the Skyfall (grey dial and perhaps other color(s)) did not get it.
Post a pic of your when you get your hands on it!
It's here. Hairspring is confirmed Si14. Both by checking the spokes on the balance wheel (it is etched with Si14) and the Pictogram card.
And now I'm off to Shanghai to take care of Patrice...
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EuroDriver
路Beautiful! Wear it in good health. I'm glad my research motivated you to finally get it. A couple of questions for you:
Are the hands shorter than the ones on your 231.10.39.03.002?
Do you mind sharing how much you picked it up for?
Are the hands shorter than the ones on your 231.10.39.03.002?
Do you mind sharing how much you picked it up for?
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路Beautiful! Wear it in good health. I'm glad my research motivated you to finally get it. A couple of questions for you:
Are the hands shorter than the ones on your 231.10.39.03.002?
Hands on both appear the same.
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EuroDriver
路Hands on both appear the same.
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Gruesome
路Just FYI, since the english names are quite close: silicon and silicone are substances with very different properties.
Silicon is an element (Si), forms crystals, and is most commonly encountered in semiconductors, and recently also hairsprings (and other micromechanical objects).
Silicone is a polymer with an -Si-O-Si-O- chain backbone (a polysiloxane), usually a rubber or an oil.
(A third substance with a similar name is silica, silicon oxide, used for quartz glass, deserts and beaches.)
Silicon is an element (Si), forms crystals, and is most commonly encountered in semiconductors, and recently also hairsprings (and other micromechanical objects).
Silicone is a polymer with an -Si-O-Si-O- chain backbone (a polysiloxane), usually a rubber or an oil.
(A third substance with a similar name is silica, silicon oxide, used for quartz glass, deserts and beaches.)
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imranbecks
路Thanks. The reason I asked is because I saw a YouTube review of the AT 8500 which said it had shorter hands than the newer "Master Co-Axial." However they youtuber stated that the blue dial "Skyfall" had the longer hands but he was not able to confirm it.
The hands are identical.
41.5mm Master Co-Axial vs 41.5mm Co-Axial
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EuroDriver
路Just FYI, since the english names are quite close: silicon and silicone are substances with very different properties.
Silicon is an element (Si), forms crystals, and is most commonly encountered in semiconductors, and recently also hairsprings (and other micromechanical objects).
Silicone is a polymer with an -Si-O-Si-O- chain backbone (a polysiloxane), usually a rubber or an oil.
(A third substance with a similar name is silica, silicon oxide, used for quartz glass, deserts and beaches.)
I'm going to blame it on my autocorrect...
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josiahg52
路The first cal. 8500 movements didn't have a silicon spring but were co-axial movements.
Later, they became Master Co-axial movements with the change to a silicon spring.
The silicon spring can be fitted to a cal. 8500 bringing it to the Master Co-axial "spec". There was likely overlap so some Master Co-axial watches may not be labeled as such. This means the lack of the word" Master" doesn't mean a watch doesn't have a silicon spring from the factory and especially as a result of a service.
Then, the cal. 8900 came about which is the METAS Master Chronometer movement with a silicon spring and is still a co-axial movement.
The 8500 and 8900 have a quick-set hour hand. The date is changed by rotating the hour hand through 24 hours, I assume.
The 8900 moved the date to 6 o'Clock.
I'm not challenging what's been posted above. I'm trying to put it in my own words so I understand. Please correct me if necessary.
Later, they became Master Co-axial movements with the change to a silicon spring.
The silicon spring can be fitted to a cal. 8500 bringing it to the Master Co-axial "spec". There was likely overlap so some Master Co-axial watches may not be labeled as such. This means the lack of the word" Master" doesn't mean a watch doesn't have a silicon spring from the factory and especially as a result of a service.
Then, the cal. 8900 came about which is the METAS Master Chronometer movement with a silicon spring and is still a co-axial movement.
The 8500 and 8900 have a quick-set hour hand. The date is changed by rotating the hour hand through 24 hours, I assume.
The 8900 moved the date to 6 o'Clock.
I'm not challenging what's been posted above. I'm trying to put it in my own words so I understand. Please correct me if necessary.
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EuroDriver
路The first cal. 8500 movements didn't have a silicon spring but were co-axial movements.
Later, they became Master Co-axial movements with the change to a silicon spring.
Yes, but no: There was an in-beteeen.
The first cal. 8500 (known as 8500A) did not contain the silicon balance spring. It is designated "Co-Axial."
Shortly after, the 8500B was quietly released; it contained the Si14 balance spring but kept the Co-Axial designation. It seems like it was released along with the blue dial "Skyfall." Specs state it resists magnetic fields up to 15,000 gauss but it is not COSC certified.
Finally, the 8500G was released. It contained the Si14 balance spring and additional Si14 components. It was designated "Master Co-Axial" and is COSC certified to resist magnetic fields to at least 15,000 gauss. Rumor has it that it received the designation of "G" instead of "C" to represent its certified gauss rating.
The silicon spring can be fitted to a cal. 8500 bringing it to the Master Co-axial "spec".
Please correct me if necessary.
I don't think that the silicon balance spring in and of itself will bring an 8500A to "Master Co-Axial" spec. The 8500G had additional parts updated with non-magnetic parts (although I couldn't find out exactly what those additional parts are) and the upgrade would still lack the official Master" certification, just like the 8500B.
I'd still take the silicon balance spring over the older one regardless.
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