Beat error at 12 o'clock up on 1861...

GrouchoM · Oct 24, 2014

I just had my Speedy movement "adjusted" in a minor service by an independent. Fully wound on my Timegrapher, the values (I tried 5 postions instead of the spec of 3) all look good except when in the 12 up/crown left position. In this position, the beat error is more the 6ms (not 0.6 but 6.0). Should I worry about this? I know this isn't a standard testing position for the 1861. What might cause this?

ulackfocus · Oct 24, 2014

Allow me to paraphrase a little Groucho:

Client: "Watchmaker, my watch runs bad when I hold my arm straight up in the air like *this*."

Watchmaker: "Well, then don't do that."

Seriously, unless you're a student, how often is your arm straight up in the air - which is what it would have to be to have the crown at 12 high. I'll answer that: hardly ever, and not for any prolonged period when it is.... which is why it's not a testing position.

GrouchoM · Oct 24, 2014

In the position I'm referring to, I'm reading my watch...12 up and crown left....make that right! (I had a tough Friday)

dsio · Oct 24, 2014

Is this one of those Chinese made Timegrapher machines from eBay? or one of the really expensive ones watchmakers use?

GrouchoM · Oct 24, 2014

While it's the former, I've been using it for several years and it's never given a wacky value. I've compared my watches that my boutique analyzed (with a high end Wichi) and it agreed, too.

dsio · Oct 24, 2014

GrouchoM
While it's the former, I've been using it for several years and it's never given a wacky value. I've compared my watches that my boutique analyzed (with a high end Wichi) and it agreed, too.

Honestly if the Speedmaster is keeping good time I'd ignore it, is it doing well worn on the wrist?

GrouchoM · Oct 24, 2014

I was just trying to make sure that there's nothing seriously wrong with the watch before relaxing and enjoying it. I haven't heard of such crazy large number before for one of the beat errors.

dsio · Oct 24, 2014

I wouldn't worry man, if it goes wrong then get it fixed but if its keeping good time, they're sturdy watches with long lifespans and worrying about it ruins the enjoyment (and eventually your watchmaker might start screening your calls) 😀

What model Speedy is it? any pics?

Archer · Oct 25, 2014

Please list the rate, amplitude, and beat error for all 6 positions. A beat error of 6 is very large...

GrouchoM · Oct 25, 2014

Thanks, Al, for taking the time to reply. I'm VERY glad you're recuperating well.
I think my watch is OK but, as dsio guessed, it's the machine. In general, the machine seems to work fine. However, I think that the pressure for keeping contact with the watch was insufficient and, as such, causing erroneous measurements. I applied a bit of added pressure and the readings in all six positions were quite good. Is it normal for the 1861 to appear erratic during the 30 second settling time or even a bit longer?

Archer · Oct 25, 2014

These cheap machines do have some problems...first they do not normally use a higher quality pre-aged crystal, so the accuracy of the crystal will drift more than on a professional machine. Note that my machine is sent for regular calibration as well, as the brands require.

These cheap machines are very sensitive to ambient noises, so the room has to be quiet to get a good reading. And as you have found the microphone stands are not the best...good contact is important on these machines.

With regards to the settling time, when you turn the microphone stand with the watch on it, this disturbs the balance wheel. The time needed for the balance to resume it's normal rate depends on a few things. The beat rate will make a difference so generally speaking the higher the beat rate the quicker the recovery. Not much you can do about that but there is one thing I will mention you can control...the speed that you flip the stand around can have an effect, so being more gentle and slow when you flip the stand will mean less time for the rate resumption.

Cheers, Al

GrouchoM · Oct 25, 2014

Thanks for the great info, Al. Twice.😀

GrouchoM · Oct 25, 2014

Here's a photo for ya, dsao

ChrisN · Oct 26, 2014

GrouchoM
Thanks, Al, for taking the time to reply. I'm VERY glad you're recuperating well.
I think my watch is OK but, as dsio guessed, it's the machine. In general, the machine seems to work fine. However, I think that the pressure for keeping contact with the watch was insufficient and, as such, causing erroneous measurements. I applied a bit of added pressure and the readings in all six positions were quite good. Is it normal for the 1861 to appear erratic during the 30 second settling time or even a bit longer?

Be very careful reading these as Al says and you have found out. Here is a Connie with a very nice 1120 movement that needs a service anyway as it has been many years. I popped it back in its case as have already removed the hands.

Looks not too bad.

And now two minutes later, slightly skewed and with additional protection for the case.

I don't know what it is picking up but, clearly it has problems. Seat it properly again and it goes back to the first picture. I have given myself a few worrying moments with this machine😲

Cheers, Chris.

Stewart H · Oct 26, 2014

These are very good points about the Chinese machines. I use a fluorescent lamp on my workbench (alright, the dining room table) and that has three 14W daylight balanced tubes in it. I found that even the hum of this lamp can affect the readings so I make a point of turning it off when I use the Timegrapher.

Beat error at 12 o'clock up on 1861...

GrouchoM

ulackfocus

GrouchoM

dsio

GrouchoM

dsio

GrouchoM

dsio

Archer

GrouchoM

Archer

GrouchoM

GrouchoM

ChrisN

Stewart H

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