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ac106
·Are you Starsky, Hutch or TJ Hooker?
A beloved watchmaker is being scammed
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UncleBuck
··understands the decision making hierarchyBless you for caring.
He's not the one selling fakes, he has his life and his memories. If there is no wealth for his family to protect (and where are they?), you may cause harm by casting a cloud over his ride into the sunset.
Perhaps, talk to the bastards, take a few pix of the offending pieces, build a case, let them know, maybe.
But honor your friend.
I want to leave on my terms, in my own time and in my own world.
I care less about the bottom-feeders groveling on my discharge, the crumbs from my bountiful table.
Who cares about the final hammer at my "estate sale".
I would honor him for what he is and not worry about the scum feeding on his crumbs.
Buy him lunch, spend a few minutes, let him know what he means to you and to others.
That is where the value lies.
It is folly to get involved in family matters.
He's not the one selling fakes, he has his life and his memories. If there is no wealth for his family to protect (and where are they?), you may cause harm by casting a cloud over his ride into the sunset.
Perhaps, talk to the bastards, take a few pix of the offending pieces, build a case, let them know, maybe.
But honor your friend.
I want to leave on my terms, in my own time and in my own world.
I care less about the bottom-feeders groveling on my discharge, the crumbs from my bountiful table.
Who cares about the final hammer at my "estate sale".
I would honor him for what he is and not worry about the scum feeding on his crumbs.
Buy him lunch, spend a few minutes, let him know what he means to you and to others.
That is where the value lies.
It is folly to get involved in family matters.
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nonuffinkbloke
·... If the police are anything like in the UK they’ll do nothing (or fakall in nonuffinkbloke speak) and you have no evidence, just a hunch...
Sorry @Dash1.😟 (I appreciate the quote but a slight grammar correction, to add extra emphasis, is required in order to indicate absolute inactivity of the police.) In this situation we really require the full "Four fiths of fakk all." Sorry to be pedantic, but as you can see it implies "fakk all" minus %20. A significant reduction.👍
It's origins are a rather splendid old limerick about a mathematician:
A mathematician named Hall Had a hexhedronical ball,
And the square of its weight Times his pecker's, plus eight,
Was four-fifths of five-eighths of fakk-all.😀
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Rasputin
·Have you thought that maybe your old watchmaker won't be coming back to his business? Perhaps his wife and "friends" realize this and are attempting to maintain a respectful outward demeanor to his former customers while simultaneously planning for the potential likelihood he isn't coming back to work.
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Starman71
·I hope we get to hear the end of this story.
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ulackfocus
·I hope we get to hear the end of this story.
Russian thugs are now wearing authentic vintage watches at their court appearances. A Russian watchmaker in Brighton Beach now has a plethora of parts and tools. The old watchmaker and his wife are in the witness protection program, presumed to be living somewhere warm in newfound anonymity.
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FreelanceWriter
·The police won't do anything if the wife identifies herself as the owner's wife and vouches for the new guys. The instant she does that, they'll tell her to have a nice day. There's no liability for the police if they just ID the woman and she tells them there's no problem; in fact, there's way more "liability" for them for doing any more than that without at least reasonable suspicion (meaning theirs, based on objective circumstances, not yours) of a crime in progress. I'd definitely ask the wife to talk to you privately for a minute and explain your concerns. After that, it's her call; but I wouldn't just ignore the situation as some people here have advised. Explain to her that if they're ripping her off the way you suspect, she'd be better off to close up shop for the time being and let the family decide what to do in the longer term.
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dialstatic
·People who keep suggesting “go to the police” really do not have an understanding of how the system works. There is little to nothing they can/will do as a crime has not occurred. Maybe if it’s a small town you might get some traction.
I readily admit that I don’t know how the system works in the USA. I guess I sort of assumed it would be similar to The Netherlands, where in such cases they would at least (1) make an official report stating your concerns (which might be used in any subsequent legal proceedings and might ‘add up’ to probable cause if there are other reasons to suspect criminal goings-on) and (2) are obliged to make a welfare check (which means simply stopping by the the guy and asking privately if he’s OK). Perhaps things are different over there, and the police are not concerned with such matters.
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nonuffinkbloke
·in fact, there's way more "liability" for them for doing any more than that without at least reasonable suspicion (meaning theirs, based on objective circumstances, not yours) of a crime in progress.
Very true @FreelanceWriter... but then that never stopped Columbo when he was on to them. Dismissive, criminals of a higher financial or social status, were always trying that old malarky, but he wasn't intimidated. In fact, he even borrowed their pencils!👍
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Screwbacks
·any help to your frequent acquaintance maybe necessary and appropriate only if he and his wife confided and complained to you that they were screwed up. imo, you are doing alright for feeling suspicious but it needs positive confirmation from the old couple.
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Wryfox
·Thanks to all, I really appreciate it...and I can see both sides, which was why I asked for your kind advice.
I asked the wife if things were ok, and she said the guys were friends and were "helping out" til he got better. I think nothing more to gain there talking to her. I asked on her husband and she said he was ill "but he'll be back". I don't know how to contact him without asking the wife, who says everything is ok.
The good product was gone and they were rearranging the store as if he was not coming back. He was fastidious about the layout of the store. Knew exactly where everything was. All was replaced with cheap quartz watches, I mean like walmart style. They are going to get zero business on those watches.
The wife knows nothing about the business. I know because if her husband is busy I ask her and she is clueless She only started attending her husband at the store when he started having health problems a few years ago.
The guy absolutely tried to sell me a fake, I believe knowingly...the hippocampus on the back was in that cheesy dot matrix printstyle used years ago on fakes,....today's fakes are far better. The dial was crap and the rest of finish was poor. In the small chance he didn't know, he has NO business selling watches, certainly not on behalf of this fellow. He also said that they were keeping the good stuff aside for special customers...a huge red flag in my opinion, meaning they knowingly took the good stuff away from display to replace with crap? Who does that? Right, nobody.
Around here, the cops have no *obligation* to follow up on anything. This is a tourist area and they have their hands full with real drunks and thieves, so I agree that even if they do follow up and and the wife vouches, it will end there.
To the casual observer, nothing would appear wrong, except I *think* I know him. He is a very dedicated and fastidious man, the very model of a good watchmaker. I respect and understand that. So this is all gut feel only. I have little I could tell the police except it doesn't look or feel right to me, or maybe the fake watch deal...but ugh how would they know (queue cops rolling eyes).
I believe he would never let others in to rearrange the store if he was coming back, so obviously something appears amiss, plus the fact that the friends give me the creeps. You know the old expression "It may be true, but it doesn't have the ring of truth". That applies here.
So I either know just enough to see something's amiss...or I know just too little to make me the problem. The risk is if I'm wrong, he'll be pissed and upset about it...and he's already quite ill...so you see the dilemma.
Leaning toward staying out of it but I may stop back next week and if the wife is still there, I'll try to engage her more seriously.
I asked the wife if things were ok, and she said the guys were friends and were "helping out" til he got better. I think nothing more to gain there talking to her. I asked on her husband and she said he was ill "but he'll be back". I don't know how to contact him without asking the wife, who says everything is ok.
The good product was gone and they were rearranging the store as if he was not coming back. He was fastidious about the layout of the store. Knew exactly where everything was. All was replaced with cheap quartz watches, I mean like walmart style. They are going to get zero business on those watches.
The wife knows nothing about the business. I know because if her husband is busy I ask her and she is clueless She only started attending her husband at the store when he started having health problems a few years ago.
The guy absolutely tried to sell me a fake, I believe knowingly...the hippocampus on the back was in that cheesy dot matrix printstyle used years ago on fakes,....today's fakes are far better. The dial was crap and the rest of finish was poor. In the small chance he didn't know, he has NO business selling watches, certainly not on behalf of this fellow. He also said that they were keeping the good stuff aside for special customers...a huge red flag in my opinion, meaning they knowingly took the good stuff away from display to replace with crap? Who does that? Right, nobody.
Around here, the cops have no *obligation* to follow up on anything. This is a tourist area and they have their hands full with real drunks and thieves, so I agree that even if they do follow up and and the wife vouches, it will end there.
To the casual observer, nothing would appear wrong, except I *think* I know him. He is a very dedicated and fastidious man, the very model of a good watchmaker. I respect and understand that. So this is all gut feel only. I have little I could tell the police except it doesn't look or feel right to me, or maybe the fake watch deal...but ugh how would they know (queue cops rolling eyes).
I believe he would never let others in to rearrange the store if he was coming back, so obviously something appears amiss, plus the fact that the friends give me the creeps. You know the old expression "It may be true, but it doesn't have the ring of truth". That applies here.
So I either know just enough to see something's amiss...or I know just too little to make me the problem. The risk is if I'm wrong, he'll be pissed and upset about it...and he's already quite ill...so you see the dilemma.
Leaning toward staying out of it but I may stop back next week and if the wife is still there, I'll try to engage her more seriously.
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gostang9
·...Leaning toward staying out of it but I may stop back next week and if the wife is still there, I'll try to engage her more seriously.
There are simple ways to ask clever questions that should either reduce or increase your suspicions.
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voere
·If you want to try to help the guy.
My view is see something, say something, do something. Inform your local law enforement and forget about it.
My view is see something, say something, do something. Inform your local law enforement and forget about it.
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ac106
·If you want to try to help the guy.
My view is see something, say something, do something. Inform your local law enforement and forget about it.
Listen, a few years ago, i had my car broken in to and a macbook stolen. I called the police. They practically hung up on me. They barely recorded the incident for statistical purposes. They certainly weren't going to show up to take a report and definitely not doing any labwork to get fingerprints or DNA.
There are several actual crimes committed here: Breaking and Entering into a MV & Larceny over $250. (which is a FELONY where I live)
All persons convicted of a felony have to provide DNA plus the fingerprints would make it pretty simple to catch this guy because sure as the day is long he had a long criminal record.
Here's the thing: The police do not have the resources to follow up with these crimes in anyway. The man hours and lab costs would far exceed the damage to my car (especially as it was covered by insurance)
Even if they found the guy it would have cost the state 10s of thousands of dollars to prosecute. And in the end he would have gotten probation, not jail time
That is all for an actual crime, that actually occurred, with actual proof.
Now walk into a police station and say:
You: Hi, my watchmaker got sick and hired some people to help out with the business but they rearranged the shop and are selling fake watches....
Police: Sir we don't care about fake watches
You: No no no! I mean, i think they are taking advantage of him and;....
Police: How exactly?
You: Well you see, there was a fake hippocampus and and the good stuff is missing
Police: Sir are you related to this gentleman?
You: errr no. But i talked to the wife...
Police: Oh. What did she say?
You: Everything is fine but...
Police: Good day sir, exit is to the left and say hi to the Omegaforums for me....
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Nobel Prize
·I readily admit that I don’t know how the system works in the USA. I guess I sort of assumed it would be similar to The Netherlands, where in such cases they would at least (1) make an official report stating your concerns (which might be used in any subsequent legal proceedings and might ‘add up’ to probable cause if there are other reasons to suspect criminal goings-on) and (2) are obliged to make a welfare check (which means simply stopping by the the guy and asking privately if he’s OK). Perhaps things are different over there, and the police are not concerned with such matters.
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voere
·
Listen, a few years ago, i had my car broken in to and a macbook stolen. I called the police. They practically hung up on me. They barely recorded the incident for statistical purposes. They certainly weren't going to show up to take a report and definitely not doing any labwork to get fingerprints or DNA.
There are several actual crimes committed here: Breaking and Entering into a MV & Larceny over $250. (which is a FELONY where I live)
All persons convicted of a felony have to provide DNA plus the fingerprints would make it pretty simple to catch this guy because sure as the day is long he had a long criminal record.
Here's the thing: The police do not have the resources to follow up with these crimes in anyway. The man hours and lab costs would far exceed the damage to my car (especially as it was covered by insurance)
Even if they found the guy it would have cost the state 10s of thousands of dollars to prosecute. And in the end he would have gotten probation, not jail time
That is all for an actual crime, that actually occurred, with actual proof.
Now walk into a police station and say:
You: Hi, my watchmaker got sick and hired some people to help out with the business but they rearranged the shop and are selling fake watches....
Police: Sir we don't care about fake watches
You: No no no! I mean, i think they are taking advantage of him and;....
Police: How exactly?
You: Well you see, there was a fake hippocampus and and the good stuff is missing
Police: Sir are you related to this gentleman?
You: errr no. But i talked to the wife...
Police: Oh. What did she say?
You: Everything is fine but...
Police: Good day sir, exit is to the left and say hi to the Omegaforums for me....
You are jumping to conclusions. I had my car broken into and all four wheels/tires stolen. When I came home I called the cops they showed up three cop cars arrived at my home took pictures and finger prints.
I have no idea if they ever followed up or caught the crooks. The insurance company I deal with handled all maters getting my car repaired.
Depends on how you tell the cops what happened at the watch makers shop. If you said the watchmaker very old and is missing plus the guys in the shop appear to be crooks. I bet the cops would have no choice but to go check it out. Sometimes it's not what happened it's what you say happened.
Or another alternative would be contact Omega and ask where you can purchase a new Omega watch from a legitimate Omega dealer. Then tell them you went into this shop and they tried to sell you a counterfeit Omega.
Many large companies hire private detectives to check this stuff out. If they would happen to be in your area I bet they would check that shop.
I'm not saying these are the correct things to do. However it may get the desired results.
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kkt
·Around here the police will break up violence in progress, vigorously investigate murders and crimes against children, and collect reports for statistical purposes and to document insurance claims for everything else. There is a state agency that investigates elder abuse. You might get more interest from such an agency.
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Wryfox
·Listen, a few years ago, i had my car broken in to and a macbook stolen. I called the police. They practically hung up on me. They barely recorded the incident for statistical purposes. They certainly weren't going to show up to take a report and definitely not doing any labwork to get fingerprints or DNA.
There are several actual crimes committed here: Breaking and Entering into a MV & Larceny over $250. (which is a FELONY where I live)
I've learned I have to be careful about this....same thing happened to me a few years ago. Police showed up to do nothing more than write it up. Well over $1000. I asked the cop if I needed to leave the car open for him to dust for prints. He makes a call on the radio and a few minutes later his supervisor drives up, looks at everything, and tells him to dust it.
This was A HUGE MISTAKE.
I learned several things:
1) It is NOT like the movies or TV where they use a little brush and carefully inspect for prints.
2) When they dust, they dust EVERYTHING (windows, dash, steering wheel, console, seats,ETC).
3) They use A LOT of dust.
4) Fingerprint dust is incredibly fine and EXTREMELY difficult to clean off.
5) It took me hours to clean up the dust (which they said was not their responsibility)
6) What little I didn't remove stuck to my clothes regularly for months.
7) The only prints they got were on the outside, and led to nothing.
Lesson learned.
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