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1949 Longines redial for 6800 EUR

DirtyDozen12
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Immediately below is a Longines that is presently for sale and being described as "near mint, flawless condition" and an "investment grade timepiece." As the thread's title suggests, the asking price for this example is 6800 EUR.

Right off the bat, the dial has been refinished. Note the very poorly executed sub-dial and silver dial foot, for a start. Even for someone without much knowledge of Longines dials from the 1940s, it should be patently obvious that the condition of the movement does not match that of the dial. The wear on the barrel bridge can only be described as severe.

If the watch was truly "mint," the price would still be many times the market value, in my opinion. Further below is an original example for reference (dial not price). Hopefully, this was eye-opening for some.

Source: https://www.shucktheoyster.com/longines-calatrava-heritage-wristwatch-5030/
upload_2020-12-15_18-19-56.png upload_2020-12-15_18-21-55.png upload_2020-12-15_18-19-33.png upload_2020-12-15_18-18-48.png upload_2020-12-15_18-18-17.png


Source: https://www.instagram.com/p/CGuikbbgoYw/
upload_2020-12-15_18-24-44.png
 
Dan S
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Unfortunately it's not the first time we have seen this dealer selling a watch like this one ... incorrect and poorly described. Of course, he also has many very nice watches (also at astronomical prices), but it just shows once again that there's no substitute for doing one's own research.
 
K
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The salmon dial is mine. I was offered quite a lot more than the asking price of the other (by several people) for context on value.
 
DirtyDozen12
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K Kbjohn
The salmon dial is mine. I was offered quite a lot more than the asking price of the other (by several people) for context on value.
I stand corrected!
 
Tony C.
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By way of analogy, just because a couple of people with far too much money think that a painting is worth $100m, it doesn't mean that it is somehow an accurate valuation.

I have sold watches for much more than I thought that they were worth, but it never occurred to me that those were anything like correct "market" values.
 
aleksejeremeev
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Price is a subjective side and this value is not constant and depends on the state and demand for the product. I have not been able to sell Jaeger leCoultre for a long time and have already lowered the price. But nobody was interested.
 
divetime
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DRjre086 DRjre086
Just to follow up, when politely pointed out that the subdial was likely redone (not even mentioning the movement condition) this was the response

59319544-1B16-4CB5-9769-DE8EE6181191.jpeg
I m personally not a big fan of this company: Shuck the Oyster.
Nevertheless it is one thing to post pictures of foreign watches (without any intention to buy it) in a public forum and reveal misrepresentations. Instead of playing "watch police " I would prefer if the author would show his own watches here and have them discussed in public with pro and contra.
Finally I m not sure if it is correct, to post the full sellers name, mail address and private phone number here in a public forum together with this critical context....
Just my personal opinion
 
ConElPueblo
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divetime divetime
I m personally not a big fan of this company: Shuck the Oyster.
Nevertheless it is one thing to post pictures of foreign watches (without any intention to buy it) in a public forum and reveal misrepresentations. Instead of playing "watch police " I would prefer if the author would show his own watches here and have them discussed in public with pro and contra.
Finally I m not sure if it is correct, to post the full sellers name, mail address and private phone number here in a public forum together with this critical context....
Just my personal opinion

Their contact information is readily available on their site, so I don't see that as a problem... Also, outing blatantly misrepresented watches and seriously arrogant behaviour from what is supposed to be a trusted source of expensive wares is hardly controversial - I see it as something that is good for the community to know of.
 
DRjre086
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You’re right, in hindsight that probably wasn’t the best move but it was a direct response from their site which anyone could get. It doesn’t reveal any private information as I made sure of that before posting.
 
BlueHands
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This forum is open to learn about Longines watches and I am thankful to have these experts here to show up such doubtful watches have to be selled for lots of money. Blameless and exposing for the dealer, beside this apparently arrogant behaviour.
 
Ted1858
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divetime divetime
I m personally not a big fan of this company: Shuck the Oyster.
Nevertheless it is one thing to post pictures of foreign watches (without any intention to buy it) in a public forum and reveal misrepresentations. Instead of playing "watch police " I would prefer if the author would show his own watches here and have them discussed in public with pro and contra.
Finally I m not sure if it is correct, to post the full sellers name, mail address and private phone number here in a public forum together with this critical context....
Just my personal opinion

I respectfully disagree with this sentiment. These high-end dealers absolutely know what they are selling and the willingness to misrepresent a watch is downright shameful.

I appreciate folks pointing out stuff like this. It is good warning to any potential buyer that you always have to do your homework, no matter how “reputable” a seller appears to be.
 
JwRosenthal
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Very recently, in another thread on this forum, a member posted an “overpolished POS” and we all had a good chuckle at the sold price (which was insane for the condition of what was left of the watch). The OP went further to post the grading system the dealer uses and how misleading their wording was (original but not verifiable etc).
The dealer then posted being a fairly new member to our group and was clearly miffed. If you are selling watches out in the open and do not expect our sewing circles to get all-chatty about your watches, then you seem to not understand how this hobby- or the internet works. The second someone posts a watch for sale- everyone sees it, you have put that info out there, and we can all interpret it however we want. If you don’t like the comments, then stay off of the forums- period.
If you want to be a part of the community, then spend some time learning about what collectors value, what they feel is worthy of buying and change your business model to suit that. Getting defensive because a collector pointed out publicly the flaws in your listing is indeed bad for business- but you knew that though when you sold the watch- you ran the risk that nobody would see it- surprise!
 
Tony C.
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Dealers who misrepresent vintage watches are, by definition, typically targeting the most vulnerable, which is why I am strongly in favor of calling them out publicly. Seasoned collectors are rarely fooled by redials, etc., so misrepresentations are not a significant threat. But less experienced collectors are, of course, much more vulnerable.

By way of analogy, I certainly don't approve of the actions of white collar criminals, but those who target the poor, and/or elderly, deserve even greater scorn. If you knowingly attempt to mug someone who holds a fifth degree black belt in any martial art, I'll give you some credit for accepting the risk. But if you jump out of the bushes to grab an old lady's purse, I'll hope that you will receive the maximum sentence.
Edited:
 
divetime
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At first, I was happy to have initiated a discussion. I knew that this would trigger different reactions. Everyone who has read my post has also noticed that I am not protecting the seller. On the other hand, it is a question of whether you would like to publish other people's watches (in whom you have no personal interest in buying) critically with your own post.
In the past, this has not only been the case with watches that have been offered for sale. Instagram pictures of foreign watches have been copied, posted and critically discussed in public. Perhaps this is also a question of mentality and personal style.
Personally, I have a clear opinion on this.
We can also teach and learn by researching and presenting your own pieces. Like the DirtyDozen12 just did with his early pocket watch in a separate thread on December 12th.
If everyone considers for themselves in the future how they would personally like to deal with posts, then the discussion here has achieved what I wanted to inspire.
 
STANDY
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divetime divetime
At first, I was happy to have initiated a discussion. I knew that this would trigger different reactions. Everyone who has read my post has also noticed that I am not protecting the seller. On the other hand, it is a question of whether you would like to publish other people's watches (in whom you have no personal interest in buying) critically with your own post.
In the past, this has not only been the case with watches that have been offered for sale. Instagram pictures of foreign watches have been copied, posted and critically discussed in public. Perhaps this is also a question of mentality and personal style.
Personally, I have a clear opinion on this.
We can also teach and learn by researching and presenting your own pieces. Like the DirtyDozen12 just did with his early pocket watch in a separate thread on December 12th.
If everyone considers for themselves in the future how they would personally like to deal with posts, then the discussion here has achieved what I wanted to inspire.

So how would you reply to the poor novice that posted the watch in question here just bought for a insane amount for a redial. What do you say to someone who has just been defrauded of thousands of dollars by a unscrupulous dealer. (Be it watch dealer or any company)

I myself would rather see what this thread is doing and stopping people being ripped off. This thread is like a community protection.

Same seller lying and
146B3EC8-EACB-46B8-A787-8908CC435830.gif
here

https://omegaforums.net/threads/flawless.124168/

Sell a nice honest watch with a true description and you will get nice accolades.
Edited:
 
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