1675 previously owned by President of Mexico.

Locked
Posts
107
Likes
265
Isn't the one claiming something is true the one that is suppose to show evidence? Same with the blueberries, if there is no proof its real, then it isn't real until proven real.
You can't see the dial is wrong in the pictures but you can see its the same? Sounds weird

I see Mr wind is answering here for some reason. I asked a question on instagram about the dial and that got removed and I got blocked. Not very transparent to me. But I guess it's more viewers there.

Were you the one that commented on my post "It's a different dial"? I had a few people post opinions as facts on my post and I am quite tired of it. In fact, I had one person saying outlandish things as facts and when I looked at his Instagram profile, his collection was three watches the best of which was a Seiko Orange Monster. I would have bet good money that the person never even held a GMT-Master in his hand, maybe never even had seen one through a window. I was just a bit fed up and blocked a few of these posters. They stated their comments as a fact, when I believe it is an opinion. I am sorry for blocking you, I have since unblocked at least on (17.77cm on Instagram), but I suggest people separate fact and opinion. I also wouldn’t come into these people's workplaces and defecate on their desks, and I would ask for a similar courtesy

To @Chris75 and the guy 17.77cm on Instagram, I believe that there is a clear photo of him wearing a Mark 3 radial dial GMT and I posted it here, but I will post it again. Can you honestly look at this with an eye of analysis and not say that the plots are small and where they fall in relation to the date window - close and center, versus a Mark 4 where they are farther away and to the right side of the date window - makes it a Mark 3 radial dial? I admit that I can't say whether President Jose Lopez Portillo had another GMT-Master, it is possible. The guy did seem to be like a watch guy, Cam and I also found photos of him wearing a Speedmaster 125 and a Nautilus reference 3700!

And here is the photo again, please review carefully and without bias:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/9i6oi6ho78c1t84/AADXrEKn7H4XvFfwwh8abhGAa?dl=0
 
Posts
24,239
Likes
53,976
I think that the lume plots are aligned with the center of the date window ... and that the guy behind him is checking out his ass. Does that help?
 
Posts
59
Likes
65
I think that the lume plots are aligned with the center of the date window ... and that the guy behind him is checking out his ass. Does that help?
947198-34aeb9234f97069c59b37e5cb98df7c4.jpg

I was really following along and even did some getty image diving myself but believe the argument shot itself in the foot with photos 1 & 2 here (reposted from Chris75). Not high resolution or conclusive but the line as drawn appears to split the date window to me, even with an angle of the photo where the vector he is drawing would drift right towards to bezel due to the plane the watch is on.

With a Mk 4 this line would be firmly in the second digit of that date window and I do not see it that way. Only adding to the Mk 3 evidence here is that the line is drawn slightly off-center on the 4 o'clock lume plot which, when corrected, would move the line ever so slightly more towards the center of that date window.
Edited:
 
Posts
86
Likes
107
Got bored, so back to the watch analysis...I looked at the enlarged original from the link Eric provided, rotated it and drew a line between the 2 and 4 plots. I drew a
similar line on a known Mk4 example. Between the two, I see slightly less of the “white” date aperture sitting to the left of the line on the López dial compared to the Mk4 pic. I suppose that would suggest the plots are further from the bezel on the López example and therefore more consistent with a Mk3 dial appearance. This is very difficult to ascertain, given the pixelation of the original, but it’s at least compared to a Mk4 example.
Edited:
 
Posts
2
Likes
6
Were you the one that commented on my post "It's a different dial"? I had a few people post opinions as facts on my post and I am quite tired of it. In fact, I had one person saying outlandish things as facts and when I looked at his Instagram profile, his collection was three watches the best of which was a Seiko Orange Monster. I would have bet good money that the person never even held a GMT-Master in his hand, maybe never even had seen one through a window. I was just a bit fed up and blocked a few of these posters. They stated their comments as a fact, when I believe it is an opinion. I am sorry for blocking you, I have since unblocked at least on (17.77cm on Instagram), but I suggest people separate fact and opinion. I also wouldn’t come into these people's workplaces and defecate on their desks, and I would ask for a similar courtesy

To @Chris75 and the guy 17.77cm on Instagram, I believe that there is a clear photo of him wearing a Mark 3 radial dial GMT and I posted it here, but I will post it again. Can you honestly look at this with an eye of analysis and not say that the plots are small and where they fall in relation to the date window - close and center, versus a Mark 4 where they are farther away and to the right side of the date window - makes it a Mark 3 radial dial? I admit that I can't say whether President Jose Lopez Portillo had another GMT-Master, it is possible. The guy did seem to be like a watch guy, Cam and I also found photos of him wearing a Speedmaster 125 and a Nautilus reference 3700!

And here is the photo again, please review carefully and without bias:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/9i6oi6ho78c1t84/AADXrEKn7H4XvFfwwh8abhGAa?dl=0
Were you the one that commented on my post "It's a different dial"? I had a few people post opinions as facts on my post and I am quite tired of it. In fact, I had one person saying outlandish things as facts and when I looked at his Instagram profile, his collection was three watches the best of which was a Seiko Orange Monster. I would have bet good money that the person never even held a GMT-Master in his hand, maybe never even had seen one through a window. I was just a bit fed up and blocked a few of these posters. They stated their comments as a fact, when I believe it is an opinion. I am sorry for blocking you, I have since unblocked at least on (17.77cm on Instagram), but I suggest people separate fact and opinion. I also wouldn’t come into these people's workplaces and defecate on their desks, and I would ask for a similar courtesy

To @Chris75 and the guy 17.77cm on Instagram, I believe that there is a clear photo of him wearing a Mark 3 radial dial GMT and I posted it here, but I will post it again. Can you honestly look at this with an eye of analysis and not say that the plots are small and where they fall in relation to the date window - close and center, versus a Mark 4 where they are farther away and to the right side of the date window - makes it a Mark 3 radial dial? I admit that I can't say whether President Jose Lopez Portillo had another GMT-Master, it is possible. The guy did seem to be like a watch guy, Cam and I also found photos of him wearing a Speedmaster 125 and a Nautilus reference 3700!

And here is the photo again, please review carefully and without bias:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/9i6oi6ho78c1t84/AADXrEKn7H4XvFfwwh8abhGAa?dl=0
I haven't thought of it that way. I wouldn't do that in someones shop irl. I agree and thanks for explaining.

I won't state an opinion as fact again. There should be a discussion in that case, and I am very happy to finally see one of the high-end dealers actually discuss. That's a good guy to me!
 
Posts
181
Likes
357
Eric is a well known, knowledgeable and established member of the vintage watch community. I have never seen him to be anything other than open and honest, and indeed helpful to anyone that asks.

Orchi has been banned on numerous fora, contributed some true assertions to the community, but also a lot of erroneous ones (He tried to spout off about 2915 bezels, something I know that he knew nothing about). All of his assertions are served in a hot bowl of vitriol and venom. His command of English is so bad that it is sometimes hard to work out which way his argument is going, or what he is saying. (And I spend my life working with people who don't speak English very well - I am good at interpreting non native English speakers.)

I heard Eric speak eloquently on the pros and cons of Auction selling by a private. Unless the item is spectacularly rare and you have two testosterone filled buyers, then selling at a big auction with its 25% fees will net the buyer less than a brokered sale. In addition the brokered sale will result in faster payment, and also removes the risk of a high profile no sale if the auction flops. A brokered sale controls the timing.

Dont get me wrong, I think the world needs Orchi's (Blue bezel exposure) but lets not forget what he is. Angry, quick to judge, misinformed, biased and a poor communicator.

There are those in this debate who seem to be giving Orchi's opinion and skills the same weight as Eric Wind et al.

That would be a mistake

This is the only post you need to read in this thread.
 
Posts
4,593
Likes
10,810

thanks as I was having difficulty recalling that particular thread but knew this current and unwarranted suspiciousness toward the same reputable dealer was familiar.

At least these discussions underline this particular dealer's legitimate high quality offerings and will serve as a good reference point in defense of those like Orchi and his manson clan-like uninformed followers. The notion of Orchi et al serving the better interests of the collecting community is laughable.
 
Posts
2,212
Likes
6,890
Man, that is one NICE looking GMT!! love the insert....there will always be haters, sad to say.
 
Posts
203
Likes
107
To [USER=55034 said:
@Chris75[/USER] and the guy 17.77cm on Instagram, I believe that there is a clear photo of him wearing a Mark 3 radial dial GMT and I posted it here, but I will post it again. Can you honestly look at this with an eye of analysis and not say that the plots are small and where they fall in relation to the date window - close and center, versus a Mark 4 where they are farther away and to the right side of the date window - makes it a Mark 3 radial dial? I admit that I can't say whether President Jose Lopez Portillo had another GMT-Master, it is possible. The guy did seem to be like a watch guy, Cam and I also found photos of him wearing a Speedmaster 125 and a Nautilus reference 3700!

And here is the photo again, please review carefully and without bias:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/9i6oi6ho78c1t84/AADXrEKn7H4XvFfwwh8abhGAa?dl=0

Thank you for the pictures.

I appreciated the effort and the affability, but to me it still looks like a Mk4.

We'll agree to disagree, and until any other evidence comes out I am afraid that this discussion won't proceed productively.

I don't have any bias, I owned some 1675 (Mk3 and Mk4), and honestly this one looks like a Mk4.

I have to admit that in any case the price is given from the provenance and not from the Mk, so, if it won't be possible to find any definitive evidence, the dial issue won't be a problem for the buyer.
 
Posts
2,577
Likes
7,118
I hate to see this thread going Orchi vs dealers.

Lets focus on the watch and legitimate question about it.
Even or especially well known dealers are not beyond questions (paper clip incident), are open to questions and are willing to share their opinion and insight. Fortunately that is happening here, so lets pick Eric's brain for more information.
🍿
Best
 
Posts
203
Likes
107

If I were you I wouldn't quote this thread: it was basically closed after that the seller said "it's unpolished because I said that it was unpolished."

And not before some of the seller's friends intervened defending him and not the specific object in question.

Also please remember that the watch in question, that to my eyes and to some other forum member was polished, was stated as sold as unpolished by Mr.Wind only after some comments about it being polished was made.
 
Posts
86
Likes
107
I will say the “lume plot gate” has opened an interesting topic of discussion around variances for the Mk1-Mk5 variants. I hadn’t really thought about that topic before, outside of the obvious difference they have from the unique Mk3’s plot size and closer proximity toward the dial center.

Late last night I posted an example of a known Mk4 compared to the Jose Lopez Portillo example shared in the link by Eric. For collective learning and tangentially related to the subject at hand, here’s a pic I just took of my Mk2. Does anyone see a difference in lume plot size/relation to the Mk4 example I posted?
 
Posts
908
Likes
2,491
For collective learning and tangentially related to the subject at hand, here’s a pic I just took of my Mk2. Does anyone see a difference in lume plot size/relation to the Mk4 example I posted?
In short yes, i can see a difference.
 
Posts
466
Likes
1,388
If I were you I wouldn't quote this thread: it was basically closed after that the seller said "it's unpolished because I said that it was unpolished."

And not before some of the seller's friends intervened defending him and not the specific object in question.

Also please remember that the watch in question, that to my eyes and to some other forum member was polished, was stated as sold as unpolished by Mr.Wind only after some comments about it being polished was made.

I called my watch exceptional and you took issue with that description, stating that a watch with a polished case was far from exceptional, even though I never solicited your opinion. It’s within your right to express your opinion, but it was done in a confrontational manner, and the confrontation felt as though it was directed at Mr. Wind. Perhaps you feel emboldened by your shroud of anonymity.

Mr. Wind conducted himself in the most professional manner regarding my 1675 and even offered to take the watch back and fully refund it as well as pay for all of its service fees, as I had it professionally serviced shortly after receiving it. I decided to keep the watch, because still, to my eye, it is quite exceptional.

The way that Mr. Wind conducted himself with me would make me recommend him to anyone who is looking for another exceptional watch.

I’m not sure why there is such animosity directed at vintage watch dealers by certain members of the collecting community. Mr. Wind obviously has a passion for vintage watches and has been able to cultivate a living out of his passion. Perhaps you envy him? That’s understandable, as a part of me does, too!

That 1675 that I bought from him is a piece that I would never have been able to find on the secondary market on my own. I don’t have the network that Mr. Wind has, nor do I have the time to find a watch like that. I do have another profession, though and I am willing to pay for Mr. Wind’s networks and for his time and expertise.
 
Posts
2,037
Likes
7,169
I called my watch exceptional and you took issue with that description, stating that a watch with a polished case was far from exceptional, even though I never solicited your opinion. It’s within your right to express your opinion, but it was done in a confrontational manner, and the confrontation felt as though it was directed at Mr. Wind. Perhaps you feel emboldened by your shroud of anonymity.

Mr. Wind conducted himself in the most professional manner regarding my 1675 and even offered to take the watch back and fully refund it as well as pay for all of its service fees, as I had it professionally serviced shortly after receiving it. I decided to keep the watch, because still, to my eye, it is quite exceptional.

The way that Mr. Wind conducted himself with me would make me recommend him to anyone who is looking for another exceptional watch.

I’m not sure why there is such animosity directed at vintage watch dealers by certain members of the collecting community. Mr. Wind obviously has a passion for vintage watches and has been able to cultivate a living out of his passion. Perhaps you envy him? That’s understandable, as a part of me does, too!

That 1675 that I bought from him is a piece that I would never have been able to find on the secondary market on my own. I don’t have the network that Mr. Wind has, nor do I have the time to find a watch like that. I do have another profession, though and I am willing to pay for Mr. Wind’s networks and for his time and expertise.
Amen!!
Haters will be haters!
Congrats to you for that gorgeous 1675... and good luck to Eric with the sale of that other Mexican 1675!! 👍
 
Posts
2,212
Likes
6,890
I have collected Rolex for a long time, you have a top notch MK2 with KILLER insert, dial and case. Don’t let anyone tell you otherwise. Lots of idiots out there.

I’ll share my MK2 with you...

 
Posts
5,316
Likes
24,321
I like Eric
I like Orchi
I am not going to buy this watch
I suspect whoever does buy this watch is a grown up.
I thoroughly enjoy watching healthy debates
I think there are a lot of people who only own Seikos who know more about Rolex’s than me.