WSRUW: What Seiko Are You Wearing Today?

Foo2rama · May 19, 2018

Faz
In Switzerland? I thought Seiko used some other horological body.

I believe not. Seiko started dominating the COSC trials in the late 60's and quickly the contest was stopped. in 1972 COSC started certifying watches. The contest resumed about a decade or so ago with the requirement that all parts must be of European origin, I believe that this does not apply to COSC certs.

This being said, "officially certified chronometer" or even having chronometer on the dial is defined by ISO 3159 first codified in 1976, and the current revision is dated 2009 and was recertifed in 2015 with no changes and is to be reviewed in 2020.

So date of the watch is needed on the piece in question. That being said Seiko in 1976 could have had an inhouse test for ISO3159 and legally labeled the watch that way. Currently afiak there is a German Body that can certify a watch as a Chronometer and the watch would not go through COSC.

Faz · May 19, 2018

Thanks for this. Extremely informative.

efauser · May 19, 2018

Foo2rama
I believe not. Seiko started dominating the COSC trials in the late 60's and quickly the contest was stopped. in 1972 COSC started certifying watches. The contest resumed about a decade or so ago with the requirement that all parts must be of European origin, I believe that this does not apply to COSC certs.

This being said, "officially certified chronometer" or even having chronometer on the dial is defined by ISO 3159 first codified in 1976, and the current revision is dated 2009 and was recertifed in 2015 with no changes and is to be reviewed in 2020.

So date of the watch is needed on the piece in question. That being said Seiko in 1976 could have had an inhouse test for ISO3159 and legally labeled the watch that way. Currently afiak there is a German Body that can certify a watch as a Chronometer and the watch would not go through COSC.

The European Chronometer Official Association believed that a chronometer rated watch had to be independently tested to be awarded that designation. Seiko watches were not independently tested so therefore they could not be chronometers. The ECOA did what irritated watchmakers do, they wrote a stern letter to Seiko requesting that the designation of Chronometer on Grand and King Seiko watches stop. Seiko obliged and ceased using chronometer on their watches. In response, the Japanese Chronometer Authorization Association was started in 1968 as an independent group to test timepieces to chronometer standards. The Association was short-lived: due to the rise of quartz watches, it closed in 1983. https://www.timepiecechronicle.com/features/2017/8/17/in-depth-the-history-of-grand-and-king-seiko

Foo2rama · May 19, 2018

efauser
The European Chronometer Official Association believed that a chronometer rated watch had to be independently tested to be awarded that designation. Seiko watches were not independently tested so therefore they could not be chronometers. The ECOA did what irritated watchmakers do, they wrote a stern letter to Seiko requesting that the designation of Chronometer on Grand and King Seiko watches stop. Seiko obliged and ceased using chronometer on their watches. In response, the Japanese Chronometer Authorization Association was started in 1968 as an independent group to test timepieces to chronometer standards. The Association was short-lived: due to the rise of quartz watches, it closed in 1983. https://www.timepiecechronicle.com/features/2017/8/17/in-depth-the-history-of-grand-and-king-seiko

Makes sense but post 1976 as I read the iso the Japanese can legally do it with thier own in house testing.

efauser · May 19, 2018

Can legally do what? Certify?

kingsrider · May 19, 2018

sarg013 Seiko5

Foo2rama · May 19, 2018

efauser
Can legally do what? Certify?

According to ISO 3159 written in 1976, "Chronometer" is a restricted term bound by international agreements. You cannot have a watch labeled Chronometer and have it not be tested to that certification. I cannot get the actual 5 pages of the standards as they are located behind a paywall on the ISO site. As for the legal definition pre 1976 I am not sure if there was one.

Same with having the word "Dive" or "Divers" on a watch, there is a list of criteria and testing involved due to ISO 6425. These requirments are pretty easy to google.

160 countries adhere to these standard and products in those countries have to adhere to the standards. Oddly the Planet Oceans are not tested to this standard and are not labeled as diver or divers anywhere on the watch. The do in fact exceed the standard but are not tested so they are not labeled. The SKX is tested to these standards and is labeled as a divers.

efauser · May 19, 2018

Maybe I'm dense but I'm not sure of your point in the context of the watches in question.

Foo2rama · May 19, 2018

efauser
Maybe I'm dense but I'm not sure of your point in the context of the watches in question.

I’m saying no way to know but the age of the watch would give clues.

efauser · May 19, 2018

Foo2rama
I’m saying no way to know but the age of the watch would give clues.

Ah. I'm going to say it's from around 1970. Here's one for sale on WUS that dates to June 1970. I'm really debating whether to go for it or not.

Foo2rama · May 19, 2018

efauser
Ah. I'm going to say it's from around 1970. Here's one for sale on WUS that dates to June 1970. I'm really debating whether to go for it or not.

That was my assumption on date also 70-72. Either way gorgeous pieces. Exquisitely Seiko with none of the drawbacks perceived or real. It’s on my list now also.

AveConscientia · May 19, 2018

efauser
Ah. I'm going to say it's from around 1970. Here's one for sale on WUS that dates to June 1970. I'm really debating whether to go for it or not.

Go for it!!! If I had the money I would buy one in a instant

GuiltyBoomerang · May 20, 2018

1969 6100-8000 - ah the good old faded bezel 😀

efauser · May 20, 2018

AveConscientia
Go for it!!! If I had the money I would buy one in a instant

You talked me into it.

AveConscientia · May 20, 2018

efauser
You talked me into it.

Good you won't doubt it though I think it would look better on thin black leather with no padding.

efauser · May 20, 2018

AveConscientia
Good you won't doubt it though I think it would look better on thin black leather with no padding.

No doubt. Fortunately, I didn't buy it for the strap.

AveConscientia · May 20, 2018

efauser
No doubt. Fortunately, I didn't buy it for the strap.

One of the best designed Seikos in my opinion

omegastarter · May 21, 2018

I love the story about Seiko entering the swiss Observatory Trials in Neuchatel and Geneva in the late sixties, getting better every year until seven of the ten best watches were Seikos, and the Swiss stopped the contests alltogether. The winning watches probably were King Seikos.

AveConscientia · May 23, 2018

omegastarter
I love the story about Seiko entering the swiss Observatory Trials in Neuchatel and Geneva in the late sixties, getting better every year until seven of the ten best watches were Seikos, and the Swiss stopped the contests alltogether. The winning watches probably were King Seikos.

I love the Swiss but it is like a Mercedes W123(Seiko) vs a Ford Granada.

jetkins · May 23, 2018

AveConscientia
I love the Swiss but it is like a Mercedes W123(Seiko) vs a Ford Granada.

The resemblance is uncanny.

WSRUW: What Seiko Are You Wearing Today?

Foo2rama

Faz

efauser

Foo2rama

efauser

kingsrider

Foo2rama

efauser

Foo2rama

efauser

Foo2rama

AveConscientia

GuiltyBoomerang

efauser

AveConscientia

efauser

AveConscientia

omegastarter

AveConscientia

jetkins

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