What has happened to the Country (Western Civilization)

250scr · Feb 29, 2016

I just can't wait until no more Obamacare. My wife has worked at a leading hospital for over 20 years, and the insurance she carried for our family was excellent. Since Obamacare, I know longer can be on her insurance, because my job gives me the opportunity to buy insurance, even though the insurance at my job sucks, I still have to pay for the sucky insurance. WTH.

CanberraOmega · Mar 1, 2016

250scr
I just can't wait until no more Obamacare. My wife has worked at a leading hospital for over 20 years, and the insurance she carried for our family was excellent. Since Obamacare, I know longer can be on her insurance, because my job gives me the opportunity to buy insurance, even though the insurance at my job sucks, I still have to pay for the sucky insurance. WTH.

What about all those people for whom Obamacare gave health insurance to for the first time, so they could actually get some degree of health care at all? Isn't that more important?

Jonatan · Mar 1, 2016

Let me reassure you that it's not only the USA. I presently live in Switzerland where surprisingly being a doctor means nothing anymore. The profession is not respected and with the age of internet you even have folks contradicting you about your diagnostic.

Tony C. · Mar 1, 2016

Here's a good synopsis of what a buffoon Trump is, and how dangerous it might be were he to be elected:

250scr · Mar 1, 2016

CanberraOmega
What about all those people for whom Obamacare gave health insurance to for the first time, so they could actually get some degree of health care at all? Isn't that more important?

So, why punish the middle class by helping those who could care less about free Healthcare.

mozartman · Mar 1, 2016

250scr
So, why punish the middle class by helping those who could care less about free Healthcare.

"Could care less"? You are an expert on how those less fortunate than you feel about it? And if you want to see how the middle class has been punished, look at the income, capital gains and estate tax cuts in recent years. Huge benefits for the wealthy, and poor folk pay very little in income taxes. Where I live, property taxes have skyrocketed to compensate. And that burden falls on ... ?

ulackfocus · Mar 1, 2016

Do you know how much Obamacare would cost me? 😲 Since I'm an employed middle class middle aged man, I end up paying to subsidize the rest of the....... well, let me stop right there before I insult a whole group of freeloaders. 🤬 🫨

ps - it's "could not care less".... think about it.

Garv · Mar 1, 2016

tyrantlizardrex
You have a lot of lakes... there must be a strange woman with a sword in one of them.

I live in Lake County, I better keep an eye out for strange women

250scr · Mar 1, 2016

mozartman
"Could care less"? You are an expert on how those less fortunate than you feel about it? And if you want to see how the middle class has been punished, look at the income, capital gains and estate tax cuts in recent years. Huge benefits for the wealthy, and poor folk pay very little in income taxes. Where I live, property taxes have skyrocketed to compensate. And that burden falls on ... ?

I think you missed the point

arkstfan · Mar 1, 2016

Actually the middle class does OK under the ACA unless you are in certain circumstances (ie. can no longer get spousal coverage).

The only thing dumber than ACA is what we had before.

It makes absolutely no sense and there is no business logic to the idea that healthcare decisions should be made by your employer nor that a company that let's say makes cardboard boxes has to hire someone or several someone's to manage getting your paperwork for health insurance and take time negotiating with insurance providers and then make decisions on coverage vs employer expense or work out what is the right percentage of the premium cost for the employee to pay.

It is in essence a tax on employers to fund something that is only somewhat related to the purpose of the business and before mandates many employers said screw it, we've got shareholders to deal with and we aren't taking money away from them for something we cannot demonstrate improves profitability by a defined dollar amount.

The lack of market power for insurance companies to set rates in most markets has given us a system where the US covers a small part of the citizenry via Medicare and Medicaid when that same outlay would practically cover every American if the per person costs were on par with Canada, UK, Finland, Denmark etc.

It is ridiculous overhead to impose on business and even if a business didn't provide healthcare, they still ended up paying too much for worker's compensation coverage because worker's comp in the US has to cover health care costs related to the work place injury. If health care is taken care of in other ways, there is no need for worker's compensation insurance to have a health care benefit. Then it becomes wage replacement insurance only.

mozartman · Mar 1, 2016

250scr
I think you missed the point

I don't think so. 😀

Texas_Tom · Mar 1, 2016

GG 😀

gatorcpa · Mar 1, 2016

U ulackfocus
Do you know how much Obamacare would cost me? 😲 Since I'm an employed middle class middle aged man, I end up paying to subsidize the rest of the....... well, let me stop right there before I insult a whole group of freeloaders. 🤬 🫨

ps - it's "could not care less".... think about it.

Guess what? You're doing it anyway.

What do you think happens when someone has no insurance, shows up at a hospital, gets treated and then defaults on the bill?

We all pay, one way or another.

Ever notice that for every drug or medical procedure, there are two prices? One for people with insurance (or Medicare) and a much higher price for those without.

If everyone has some form of health insurance, we'll all still be paying, but it will be spread over the entire population. There will always be some that will never be able to afford to pay, the way we treat them will be more or less the same. We will continue to pay through local taxes and the Medicare tax on wages. However, most people would at least be protected against medical catastrophes and they will pay something into the medical care system, based on what they can afford. Those who can afford more and their employers, will get better coverage. But at least everyone has some protection.

The idea that there is a "free" market for healthcare cost is ludicrous. The costs are set by the government through Medicare reimbursements. The private insurers usually use this as a guide for what they will pay. Either the providers can perform the service for what the government will pay, or they find a way to hike the price on something else (i.e. $5 per tablet aspirin) that Medicare and the insurers will pay for to make up the difference. Of course, that all comes back to us in the form of higher medical bills and/or higher insurance premiums.

Remember, that the house always wins!

I'm as Libertarian as the next guy, but the idea that we are all islands that don't affect each other is ridiculous.
gatorcpa

tyrantlizardrex · Mar 1, 2016

As someone from the UK, brought up with the NHS, the lack of free public health care in the USA, and the idea, that you could die from something easily curable if you don't have insurance saddens me greatly.

Then when I hear people say things like "why should I pay, what's in it for me?" it saddens me even more... I'm not religious, but the story of the good samaritan rings bells... you look after other people because you can and you should... because that's the right thing to do.

Mouse_at_Large · Mar 1, 2016

tyrantlizardrex
As someone from the UK, brought up with the NHS, the lack of free public health care in the USA, and the idea, that you could die from something easily curable if you don't have insurance saddens me greatly.

Then when I hear people say things like "why should I pay, what's in it for me?" it saddens me even more... I'm not religious, but the story of the good samaritan rings bells... you look after other people because you can and you should... because that's the right thing to do.

I live in the UK. The idea of "free" in the context of the NHS means "free at the point of delivery". Nothing is actually free - it's paid for out of general taxation. And long may it continue to be funded that way.

gatorcpa · Mar 1, 2016

tyrantlizardrex
As someone from the UK, brought up with the NHS, the lack of free public health care in the USA, and the idea, that you could die from something easily curable if you don't have insurance saddens me greatly.

That's not really true either. We don't have people dying in the street in the US, unless that is their choice.

The law here is that a hospital can't refuse to treat someone who requires treatment because they don't have health insurance. If they are a totally private hospital (which very few are), they have a duty to stabilize a patient in the ER, then transport them to the closest public hospital. The public hospitals are funded through taxpayer dollars to be able to take care of these people.

Hence my statement above that we all are paying, one way or another.
gatorcpa

tyrantlizardrex · Mar 1, 2016

Mouse_at_Large
I live in the UK. The idea of "free" in the context of the NHS means "free at the point of delivery". Nothing is actually free - it's paid for out of general taxation. And long may it continue to be funded that way.

Agreed. I just don't see it as paid for in the same way. And even if you don't pay taxes, because your unemployed, or sick - you still don't get turned away.

tyrantlizardrex · Mar 1, 2016

gatorcpa
That's not really true either. We don't have people dying in the street in the US.

The law here is that a hospital can't refuse to treat someone who is sick and shows up at their door because they don't have health insurance. If they are a totally private hospital (which very few are), they have a duty to stabilize a patient in the ER, then transport them to the closest public hospital. The public hospitals are funded through taxpayer dollars to be able to take care of these people.

Hence my statement above that we all are paying, one way or another.
gatorcpa

Apologies for my misunderstanding.

LouS · Mar 1, 2016

tyrantlizardrex
As someone from the UK, brought up with the NHS, the lack of free public health care in the USA, and the idea, that you could die from something easily curable if you don't have insurance saddens me greatly..

this is the big fiction. people from abroad think people are dying in the streets in the US. It's not so, and never was. The Emergency Department may not turn any ill person away by law. Sick people get care, insured or not.

Hijak · Mar 1, 2016

Tony C.
Here's a good synopsis of what a buffoon Trump is, and how dangerous it might be were he to be elected:

F🤬KING FANTASTIC!!!

What has happened to the Country (Western Civilization)

250scr

CanberraOmega

Jonatan

Tony C.

250scr

mozartman

ulackfocus

Garv

250scr

arkstfan

mozartman

Texas_Tom

gatorcpa

tyrantlizardrex

Mouse_at_Large

gatorcpa

tyrantlizardrex

tyrantlizardrex

LouS

Hijak

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