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  1. PlainVanilla Jun 10, 2021

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    Hello everyone,

    My brother-in-law is interested in a vintage IWC watch but as he doesn't know much about vintage watches and as I'm not very knowledgeable about IWC watches myself, I'm posting some pictures here and calling for your help in identifying any red flags with this watch.

    To me, this is not a perfect example in any way. The case seems OK, hands are correct to me and the dial seems original (but I can't be sure about that, I'd be way more confident with an Omega). Can you spot any red flags/tell me if this watch seems authentic? Thanks to anyone who can help!

    Here are some pictures:


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    Again, thanks to anyone who can help me with this one.
     
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  2. Tony C. Ωf Jury member Jun 10, 2021

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    Appears to be genuine – no big red flags. The crown is likely to be a later replacement, though. Do you have a photo of the inside of the case back? That would be important, in order to verify originality.

    It is a fairly early ('50s) cal. 85x automatic, which is one of the finest automatic movement calibers of the period. The case is not very big, though, so a bit small by today's standards.
     
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  3. PlainVanilla Jun 10, 2021

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    Thank you. :)

    I requested a picture of the inner caseback to the seller and hoping to get it soon.
     
  4. Tony C. Ωf Jury member Jun 10, 2021

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    You're welcome!

    Note that there are a fair number of IWC automatics from the '50s and '60s on the market at any given time. So even if this one is genuine, I would suggest that your brother-in-law should take his time, and search around a bit before deciding to pull the trigger.
     
  5. PlainVanilla Jun 10, 2021

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    Thanks! Any good references to look for around 1000€-1300€?
     
  6. queriver Jun 11, 2021

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    The photos aren't very clear but I'm not sure whether this might be a redial. The top of the capital I in International, the way the front of the W extends far forward over the top of the L in International, and the thickness of the W print make this dial look suspect IMHO.
     
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  7. PlainVanilla Jun 11, 2021

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    Edited Jun 11, 2021
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  8. Tony C. Ωf Jury member Jun 11, 2021

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    The case markings appear to be genuine. As suggested earlier, if I were your brother-in-law, I would wait patiently for a better example. There are scratches on the rotor, and other minor condition issues, that make the asking price too high.

    Find a better example, pay a fair price, and the watch will not only look better, but will be much easier to re-sell if desired, and retain its value.
     
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  9. Dan S Jun 11, 2021

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    As Tony mentioned, it looks legit except for the crown, and a fairly mediocre example. It's really a matter of personal appeal and price.
     
  10. la_lusigne Jun 11, 2021

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    I concur, the dial looks original. You can refer to this document : D054891E-F65B-426B-9857-407005597F33.jpeg
     
  11. Shabbaz Jun 11, 2021

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    There are nicer iwc's out there with better case designs. For eur 1300 you can find something better with patience
     
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  12. queriver Jun 11, 2021

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    This is actually the table from Vintage Caliber I referenced (and posted here on OF a few years ago) before posting the above comment and I can't see any match to the OPs dial writing. Which one from the table do you think matches?
     
  13. la_lusigne Jun 11, 2021

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    I would say among the 4 of 1947 to 1953. Also, this document isn’t exhaustive so the variation of the op might not look exactly like the ones of the document
     
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  14. Tony C. Ωf Jury member Jun 11, 2021

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    Not only that, but I am not certain that the list posted contains only original examples.
     
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  15. Skrotis Jun 11, 2021

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    1947-1953 Whit T Swiss T dial
     
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  16. CLA05 Jun 11, 2021

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    Oh wow fantastic thanks for this :)
     
  17. queriver Jun 12, 2021

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    @la_lusigne , @Tony C. , @Skrotis Thank you for your comments. IWCs from that era seem to be a minefield and I appreciate your information about the dial and the inaccuracy of the Vintage Caliber dial document. Having said this, now I'm even more confused about the OPs watch after he linked us to the Lot-Art listing with its 1613468 movement number which makes it 1962 according to Date-Your-IWC. The caseback serial indicates a very similar age. However, this doesn't correspond with a 1947-53 date range based on dial design -- circa 10-15 year gap between dial design and movement. ::confused2::
     
  18. Tony C. Ωf Jury member Jun 12, 2021

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    I'm not clear on what you base the date range for the dial design, but whatever the source, it is not correct. Broadly speaking, these conservative style dials were not only employed by IWC into the '60s, but even the '70s! Here's are examples from a 1966 catalogue:

    [​IMG]
     
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  19. queriver Jun 12, 2021

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    See below...
    Edit: forget this person :) -->
     
    Edited Jun 12, 2021
  20. Tony C. Ωf Jury member Jun 12, 2021

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    My response was not based at all on the dial design. I thought, apparently incorrectly, that it was an earlier iteration of the cal. 85x.
     
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