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Universal Geneve Square Compur 22102

  1. Florent

    Florent Jul 16, 2018

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    Hi guys, just come across this one, everything seems correct to me, any thoughts ?

    I can’t find another steel example of this reference, or even another square steel UG chrono. Have you seen some before ? :)

    0402A0D9-5FEF-446B-90FA-7F3AE7331CB6.jpeg 5F2B2CFE-C646-4BAC-ADD7-C89D2BE240E6.jpeg CBE94F32-8D76-418B-AD14-1650371C517E.jpeg C0E0F6DC-E5EF-4052-A9E3-DB5A60CB21C0.jpeg D7C4CA1A-6EA9-4C89-8D8E-BA484E635F7A.jpeg 8CF3DD2B-90F1-4EBF-9660-CA7E8C0C6CA9.jpeg
     
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  2. Radiumpassion

    Radiumpassion Jul 16, 2018

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    All I can say is it looks awesome:thumbsup:
     
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  3. aap

    aap Jul 16, 2018

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    martinc and Florent like this.
  4. Larry S

    Larry S Color Commentator for the Hyperbole. Jul 16, 2018

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    Seen em, love em, not sure I’d wear one but this looks right.
     
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  5. Mazoue

    Mazoue Jul 16, 2018

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    Pretty sure it's correct.

    I think the hour hand may be a replacement as it is a leaf shaped hand and does not seem to match the minute hand. All early Compurs in Sala seem to have either straight or leaf shaped hands but not a mix.

    A similar square compur sold on eBay in January although it had regular lugs and not hooded lugs like this one and condition was not as good. You can see it @livingstonsatnight on Instagram. Note that both hands are straight and not leaf shaped.
     
  6. bgrisso

    bgrisso Jul 16, 2018

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    I guess either the hour OR the minute hand is wrong, but I'm not sure how to tell which one?
     
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  7. Oku

    Oku Jul 16, 2018

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  8. gatorcpa

    gatorcpa ΩF InvestiGator Staff Member Jul 16, 2018

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    Here is picture of square Compur with similar dial:

    Capture.JPG

    The fonts on the one above seem to be a little sharper than the OP watch. I don''t see "Swiss" at the bottom of OP watch either. I think it is a very old and well done redial.
    gatorcpa
     
  9. LouS

    LouS Mrs Nataf's Other Son Staff Member Jul 16, 2018

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    Agree, it has that over-inked look to it
     
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  10. Radiumpassion

    Radiumpassion Jul 16, 2018

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    I think it`s hard to see if OP watch is a redial not seeing it IRL. But maybe «compur» is a little off centre?
     
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  11. bgrisso

    bgrisso Jul 16, 2018

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    When are the strong "serifs" introduced on the UG font? Because some of the early ones dont seem to have them (like the compur I posted in the other thread), so I didn't think it was an issue on this watch here, but in that gold case example posted above they are very obvious.
     
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  12. CaptainWinsor

    CaptainWinsor Jul 16, 2018

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    Some of the numbers don’t match one another. Could be partial redial? Really nice piece though
     
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  13. Reborn

    Reborn Jul 16, 2018

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    Florent likes this.
  14. ELV web

    ELV web Jul 16, 2018

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    Looks like very old redial to me. Only railroad subdial are the ones that seem to legitimately not have telehphony markers.
     
    Edited Jul 16, 2018
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  15. Florent

    Florent Jul 16, 2018

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    Thanks guys for your help!
     
  16. martinc

    martinc Jul 25, 2018

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    Hello,

    I bougth that OP watch.
    I can 99% confirm that the dial is all original (IMHO), not a redial, so is the case. Lugs will need some carefull work though.
    The hour hand is not original, it should (and will again :) ) be a baton hand.
    The crown, though shape and size are pretty much ok, is most probably not original either.

    It´s a very nice watch, though the 27mm case, despite the hooded lugs, looks a bit funny on a hairy wrist. ;-)
    (sorry, no wrist shot, I have to find an appropriate open-ended strap first)


    Here are some photos of the watch taken yesterday + photo of the reference from Sala + photo of another ladies´ watch ref. from Sala which has the very same dial (with closed 6 and no "Swiss") - Sala, pages 232 + 233.


    Regarding the font - there was a discussion here at the forum some time ago: https://omegaforums.net/threads/universal-geneve-chronograph-verga.49504/page-2
     
    IMG_7136.jpg IMG_7138.jpg IMG_7139.jpg IMG_7140.jpg IMG_7143.jpg IMG_7145.jpg IMG_7150.JPG IMG_7153.JPG
  17. martinc

    martinc Jul 25, 2018

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    Btw. the dial is the same as the one on IG profile of @livingstonsatnight that Mazoue mentioned above.
     
    Edited Jul 25, 2018
  18. martinc

    martinc Jul 30, 2018

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    @LouS and @ELV web mentioned some issues on the dial that made them think it might be a redial.
    Unfortunately I don´t have a macro lens and the iPhone photos are simply not a good proof of anything, but I´ll try to argue the points raised anyway:

    - overinked print - the only thing that seems a bit "thick" looking at the dial IRL are the big (hour) numerals (well... "big"... the dial is so small with diameter of the tachy scale ring being 21mm, that there´s really nothing "big" about them :)) . But compared to other UG´s, mainly older Compurs, it does not seem suspicious. But yes, they are different from the other dials posted that seem to have very thin big numbers.

    - absence of telephony scale while tachy scale is present...
    Well, this was bothering me quite a lot, so I did some research. Below are 2 other small "ladies´" Compurs from the 40´s that have tachy scale and no telephony markers (see attached photos - one is an example from IG profile @livingstonsatnight, the other is from UG archive - Sala, page 233). It´s true though that I have not found a single "full-size" Compur on the archives in Sala that would have the same combination

    - absence of "Swiss" - well, most ladies´ UG dials miss "Swiss". That´s not an issue in my opinion.

    - another issue that bothered me was the fact that number "4" is entire on the dial, while "8" is not... Which is not the case for example on the dial from the mentioned IG profile. But 4 does not bleed into the subdial and I have found plenty other dials that have entire pointed 4´s and cut 8´s.

    - I don´t see any inconsistencies in font styles, both "Universal Geneve" and "Compur" look fine, all "3´s" on subdials and tachy have flat top, the scales and lines are perfectly thin, sharp and even.

    To sum up. In real life the dial looks very nice and sharp with just the right amount of patina and dirt.
    Obviously, wihth UG, no one can ever be 100% sure...
    And with these square watches it´s even more difficult I´m afraid - because, sincerely, how many have you ever seen IRL? :)
    If it´s a redial, someone has done an absolutely fantastic job.


    When I have the watch taken apart by my watchmaker, I´ll try to get some better photos of it (and get myself a proper macro lens).

    2018-07-29 20.25.58.png 2018-07-30 13.29.54.jpg
     
  19. martinc

    martinc Nov 15, 2019

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    Posting a photo of the dial without case and plexi.
    IMHO it is original. The hour numerals are a bit thick, but all the remaining printing is perfect and crisp and centered and period-correct.
    Second photo is a wristshot after service and hour hand replacement.
     
    UG (3).jpg 2019-11-07 12.51.12.jpg
  20. vujen

    vujen Nov 15, 2019

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    super nice. congrats.