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cicindela
··Steve @ ΩFI have emailed Desmond for a response on the issue.
Speedmaster Caseback "sp" Reference
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mondodec
·I have emailed Desmond for a response on the issue.
Hi Steve et al, Evan, I love your new moniker 😀
I wrote that piece a long time ago, and at the time had discussions with both Steve and Chuck on their respective efforts at explaining Omega coding systems. As I recall it, SP was sometimes used to distinguish between pieces that left the factory without metal bracelets: in other words simply accessorised with the standard strap.
One thing to consider is that at the time the Speedmaster was produced, Omega had a rather haphazard system to identify watches that actually left the factory with bracelets. Leather strap was still the preferred option to send watch-heads from the factory and the integrated line was yet another couple of years away. They were still experimenting with factory assembled bracelets on the C-Shape line. Mostly at that time, Omega commissioned bracelet manufacturers in Italy and Switzerland to make their bracelets and they were usually shipped as separate lots to national distributors. Case in point for US-bound watches was that Norman Morris also commissioned some but not all Omega designed bracelets and had them manufactured locally.
I know at the time there was considerable discussion and consultation with Marco Richon and others at Omega before Chuck eventually posted his chart. I would point out that the logic in the construction of the chart was Chuck's and it was his decision to add SP where he did. There was considerable discussion on Zowie and pre-crash Watchuseek about this and other case markings, some of which, like "- 3", "-61" etc, etc, the museum claimed were case makers marks and nothing to do with OMega. Maybe there is something in some archives somewhere.
Cheers
Dersmond
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cicindela
··Steve @ ΩFThank you for your input here Desmond. It certainly fills some gaps and helps keeps this type of information from being lost in time.
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richardew
·Thanks for the input. Great stuff.
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SpikiSpikester
··@ ΩFAt last, I think we have the answer to this question. The SP stands for Special.
It was a designation used for a short time around 1967 to indicate a 145.012 watch that was a 105.012 case which had been enhanced for water protection. So it looks like this was another transitional watch of limited numbers. [Edit - actually the table makes it look like the 145.012 SP was the standard watch & those with just ref 145.012 are the uncommon ones]
If your wondering where I got this from, it's the tables in the back of A Journey Through Time:
It was a designation used for a short time around 1967 to indicate a 145.012 watch that was a 105.012 case which had been enhanced for water protection. So it looks like this was another transitional watch of limited numbers. [Edit - actually the table makes it look like the 145.012 SP was the standard watch & those with just ref 145.012 are the uncommon ones]
If your wondering where I got this from, it's the tables in the back of A Journey Through Time:
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dsio
··Ash @ ΩFAt last, I think we have the answer to this question. The SP stands for Special.
It was a designation used for a short time around 1967 to indicate a 145.012 watch that was a 105.012 case which had been enhanced for water protection. So it looks like this was another transitional watch of limited numbers.
If your wondering where I got this from, it's the tables in the back of A Journey Through Time:
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Dash1
·At last, I think we have the answer to this question. The SP stands for Special.
It was a designation used for a short time around 1967 to indicate a 145.012 watch that was a 105.012 case which had been enhanced for water protection. So it looks like this was another transitional watch of limited numbers. [Edit - actually the table makes it look like the 145.012 SP was the standard watch & those with just ref 145.012 are the uncommon ones]
If your wondering where I got this from, it's the tables in the back of A Journey Through Time:
Genius find! There' a whole lot of information new to me on that small section of page. I must get that book.
Anyone ever seen a 143.003? I'm certain I haven't.
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NiklasARvid
·Genius find! There' a whole lot of information new to me on that small section of page. I must get that book.
Anyone ever seen a 143.003? I'm certain I haven't.
my first thought as well "143.003"??? ???
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BASE1000
·143.003 is probably a misspelling. What is discussed from time to time is the existence of an 145.003. But there is only one picture in an italian forum that shows adouble imprint of 105.003 and 145.003 in the case back as well as paperwork form 1969.
Look here:
http://orologi.forumfree.it/?t=12373597
I suppose this is a very very short transitional reference like the 105.002 or the so-called "first moon" from 1969.
Look here:
http://orologi.forumfree.it/?t=12373597
I suppose this is a very very short transitional reference like the 105.002 or the so-called "first moon" from 1969.
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BASE1000
·I have seen pictures of that Italian watch before, it can't be the only one out there but it ruins my plan to collect all of the c.321 Speedmaster references!
hm, if this is the only watch that makes you headach you are pretty fare ahead already.
If you plan to sell an 1975 Apollo-Soyuz please let me know 😁
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tomvox1
·At last, I think we have the answer to this question. The SP stands for Special.
It was a designation used for a short time around 1967 to indicate a 145.012 watch that was a 105.012 case which had been enhanced for water protection. So it looks like this was another transitional watch of limited numbers. [Edit - actually the table makes it look like the 145.012 SP was the standard watch & those with just ref 145.012 are the uncommon ones]
If your wondering where I got this from, it's the tables in the back of A Journey Through Time:
Brilliant and I must get that (expensive) book someday!
My old 105.012-64 had an "S" prefix...
I wonder if that also signified the same beefed up WR or something else in this case? Thoughts or other examples?
Thanks again for the great research & best,
Tom
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SpikiSpikester
··@ ΩFThe list in the good book doesn't mention an "S" reference. Looks like we have a new mystery to solve 😉
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Elroy
·This was news to me. I had always been told the SP was used for watches delivered with straps rather than bracelets. Great investigating.
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cicindela
··Steve @ ΩFThis was news to me. I had always been told the SP was used for watches delivered with straps rather than bracelets. Great investigating.
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SpikiSpikester
··@ ΩFActually, there is an earlier version of this AJTT table on Chuck Maddox's website. It is described as a draft that Marco Richon was working on during 2005 as part of a new book project for Omega.
http://chronomaddox.com/omega/tables/mr/speedy_history_cm.html
But that version doesn't include the 1967 information appearing in A Journey Through Time, which was obviously added during later drafts, and which Richon possibly may not have sent to Chuck.
AJTT by Marco Richon was first published in 2007, a year before Chuck died.
http://chronomaddox.com/omega/tables/mr/speedy_history_cm.html
But that version doesn't include the 1967 information appearing in A Journey Through Time, which was obviously added during later drafts, and which Richon possibly may not have sent to Chuck.
AJTT by Marco Richon was first published in 2007, a year before Chuck died.
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browncow
·Reviving an old thread....
So we know about 145.012-67 SP, but what about 145.012-68 SP?
Is this caseback kosher?
ben
Singapore
So we know about 145.012-67 SP, but what about 145.012-68 SP?
Is this caseback kosher?
ben
Singapore
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Spacefruit
··Prolific Speedmaster HoarderSP = speciale poussoirs
"Special pushers"
Upgraded for better water resistance
"Special pushers"
Upgraded for better water resistance
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marturx
·Looks like SF nailed it
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