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Something that has been bugging me for a few years now

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P PatrickJ
I would just like to make an apology to the group. I know you guys have already given me your opinions on my Geneve and Seamaster, much appreciated with your efforts.

The reason I paniced and sent put the question again was that the Geneve was about to go in for a service. It was not with Mr Archer or if I may call you Al. It was with another experienced watch maker on the forum. I refered him to the post, re the redial issue (any ideas?) He came back and said the Geneve was a redial. I am not sure if he read the whole thread. Sent him another email back mentioning that many members thought it was a redial at first but after finding pics on the net of them dials looking just like mine there had been doubt. Even one member suggested I should not worry about it.

Servicing these watches can be costly, and did not want to service a re dialed watch.

Regarding the Seamaster you guys gave me your opinion on it already regarding the hands and the dial. I panicked when I could see mine had the hook S instead of smooth S. Mine is from 1962. But when you put ref 14759 it brought up 1960 on Omega vintage site and the S being smooth and not hook S.

It is just the cost of the service I think and the possibility the watches were not good. I need to stop thinking to much maybe, suppose these watches are very old variations and questions on dials being 100% right will happen. Perhaps none of us know for sure 100% and perhaps only 99%, these things were made so long ago

Thanks

Why wouldn't you service a redial? what will you do, throw it away? if so let me PM you my address ...馃榿
 
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A redial is not as good as an original, would of probably sold it on ebay. Many people on there are happy to buy a redial.
 
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P PatrickJ
A redial is not as good as an original, would of probably sold it on ebay. Many people on there are happy to buy a redial.
Of course it's not as good, but if you have it already and you like it then you should enjoy it.

I guess it depends on what you paid not knowing it's a redial ( if it is) and what you can get for it knowing it is a redial ( if it is and assuming you would disclose that on the sale.)

So the loss, of there is loss, may not be worth the flip. Yiu van still wear it in good health and enjoy it. Obviously it was desirable enough or pretty enough for you to buy it to start with.
 
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Why wouldn't you service a redial? what will you do, throw it away? if so let me PM you my address ...馃榿

It had always been my impression from the forum and other sites redial is like a dirty word. I could be wrong of course.

I should keep the watch just read thread again, any ideas. It is very likely it is original. Should take the members advice and who posted the comment: ' I wouldn't worry about it. Just because one person gave me their feedback on it is a redial, even though it is a watchmaker does not mean they are correct.

These are old watches, no one knows for sure.
 
Archer
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By the way, based on this thread I stopped by Seiko in midtown today to take a look at their lines with a little more sense of respect...馃槈

Keep in mind that in-house (again whatever that really means) does not equal quality. People can make crappy screws in their own factories too...and in my experience Seiko screws are in fact very soft and crappy...

I will take a not in-house Omega with a Cal. 1120 over a Seiko with a 7S26 any day of the week. 馃榾
 
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Archer Archer
Keep in mind that in-house (again whatever that really means) does not equal quality,. People can make crappy screws in their owns factories too...and in my experience Seiko screws are in fact very soft and crappy...

I will take a not in-house Omega with a Cal. 1120 over a Seiko with a 7S26 any da

I quest this in house stuff is an attempt by companies to sell more watches.
 
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@ Patrick : One man's trash is another man's treasure. Consider your sources.

Collectors of course will always want a watch in as Original condition as possible, but they are collectors, they are specialists and as such, by definition almost, become a little too elite to give advice that applies to all.

That does not mean a redial is a dirty piece of worthless metal, it just means it doesn't have the same value as an original, to them. Hell, often a brand new watch will have less value than a 40 year old Rusty old watch that most non collectors would not even look at.

Theres a lot of ground to cover between that, and a complete neophyte that just needs to tell time.

It also depends on what you paid but that's irrelevant right now because you already paid it and have the watch.

So you bought something you liked, at a price hopefully that was fair and now it's not good for someone else's standard so you discard it? I would enjoy it and perhaps one day look for the next buy and if one day I found someone that may appreciate it more than me flip it or give it to a nephew, or son or whatever. But a "less valuable" piece cab be very dear to many.

I have a 5512 none of my friends like specially and many collectors would love to have, I have a Daytona that few collectors would look at because it is a modern, non Zenith, non Paul Newman, non special 10000 watch that to them is generic within the line.... Should I toss both those watches because they don't meet someone else's criteria.

You like the watch, enjoy it man.
Edited:
 
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Archer Archer
Keep in mind that in-house (again whatever that really means) does not equal quality. People can make crappy screws in their own factories too...and in my experience Seiko screws are in fact very soft and crappy...

I will take a not in-house Omega with a Cal. 1120 over a Seiko with a 7S26 any day of the week. 馃榾

I hear you and share your view. Just thought I could spare a few minutes looking around. Didn't see much I wanted though. Happily all the bug watch houses are around three so it's a good walk anyway, I had to drop my Iwc's for service across the street anyway
 
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One man's trash is another man's treasure. Consider your sources.

Collectors of course will always want a watch in as Original condition as possible, but they are collectors, they are specialists and as such, by definition almost, become a little too elite to give advice that applies to all.

That does not mean a redial is a dirty piece of worthless metal, it just means it doesn't have the same value as an original, to them. Hell, often a brand new watch will have less value than a 40 year old Rusty old watch that most non collectors would not even look at.

Theres a lot of ground to cover between that, and a complete neophyte that just needs to tell time.

It also depends on what you paid but that's irrelevant right now because you already paid it and have the watch.

So you bought something you liked, at a price hopefully that was fair and now it's not good for someone else's standard so you discard it? I would enjoy it and perhaps one day look for the next buy and if one day I found someone that may appreciate it more than me flip it or give it to a nephew, or son or whatever. But a "less valuable" piece cab be very dear to many.

I have a 5512 nine of my friends like specially and many collectors would love to have, I have a Daytona that few collectors would look at because it is a modern, non Zenith, non Paul Newman, non special 10000 watch that to them is generic within the line.... Should I toss both those watches because they don't meet someone else's criteria.

You like the watch, enjoy it man.

I will enjoy it, and not discard the fact it could be original in the first place.
 
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P PatrickJ
It had always been my impression from the forum and other sites redial is like a dirty word. I could be wrong of course.

A bad redial is certainly not acceptable...... to a collector who values originality over all else.

However, I own two redials done at JLC's factory in LeSentier. They were beat-up watches when I bought them cheap, and I wanted to wear them often. They look like new now!

In short, you have to make up your own mind about what is and isn't to your tastes. There's nothing wrong with a watch that wouldn't pass muster for a collector if you just want something as a daily wearer. Hell, I've seen - and even bought - some damn attractive frankenwatches.
 
dsio
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The dial originality is less important on watches that aren't rare or particularly collectable but are very much daily wear pieces instead which I think that Geneve really qualifies as. Its a solid movement and looks good on the wrist, nothing wrong with wearing it. As you buy more expensive pieces you'll find you'll still wear that one when you want to keep your clean piepan or 321 Speedmaster out of potential harm.
 
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U ulackfocus
A bad redial is certainly not acceptable...... to a collector who values originality over all else.

However, I own two redials done at JLC's factory in LeSentier. They were beat-up watches when I bought them cheap, and I wanted to wear them often. They look like new now!

In short, you have to make up your own mind about what is and isn't to your tastes. There's nothing wrong with a watch that wouldn't pass muster for a collector if you just want something as a daily wearer. Hell, I've seen - and even bought - some damn attractive frankenwatches.

Thank you, you hit the nail on the head with your reply.

I will not waste members time or mine on this issue regarding my two watches any longer. Just want to say one last thing and better leave it after that.

I need to decide if I can live with the uncertainty. I tried my level best to buy these watches thinking they had been original in every way, they may well be. I will try to enjoy them, if not will sell them on Ebay taking big losses as most people are more interested in price than a 100% genuine article. Looking on austin kaye site and many pics on the net, they are exact examples to my Geneve dial. The M points down at the bottom and the top of the M points up a bit, the G straight line in the middle on mine and other Geneve pics on the net is short and stubby. However, with other pics on the net and austin kaye site Geneve from the same year and one year later has the normal Omega lettering. This has a more straight line M that does point down to much and the middle part of the G is a bit longer and not so stubby. The Seamaster I have seen examples on the net from 1963 with the curved S in Seamaster , the pic on the Omega site for my model has a curved S. However my 1962 Seamaster has different hands and a hook S, that was I think from an earlier period.

All water under the bridge now. Will let Let the dust settle for a week weeks. If I can live with them will keep them if not sell and in 18 months or so go and buy a new Seamaster pro. Love the old look to vintage but also love the new also. To hell with in house. It will be original everything.

I will now contribute to other Omega issues, leave this one alone.

Thank you all for your help.
 
proximal
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Archer Archer
in my experience Seiko screws are in fact very soft and crappy...

I will take a not in-house Omega with a Cal. 1120 over a Seiko with a 7S26 any day of the week. 馃榾
Nobody is having their 7S26-based watch serviced, are they? A new watch is like $50. When mine breaks (I hope it doesn't, it's a good beater watch) I'll just get another.

Too bad we weren't discussing this two weeks ago on 4/1; would've sent you a PM to inquire about some work. 馃榿
 
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proximal proximal
Nobody is having their 7S26-based watch serviced, are they? A new watch is like $50. When mine breaks (I hope it doesn't, it's a good beater watch) I'll just get another.

Too bad we weren't discussing this two weeks ago on 4/1; would've sent you a PM to inquire about some work. 馃榿

People do ask...here is a typical conversation:

Email to me - Can you service my Seiko with a XXXX movement?

My answer: - Yes, price for labour is $XXX, and parts needed are extra.

Sound of crickets...馃槈

The bad screws are found on just more then the 7S26 though, so a 6105, 6119, 6217, etc. and some of these can be quite collectible and expensive (think 62MAS for example that can be big bucks) so it's not completely out of the realm that I service a Seiko here and there, but it doesn't happen often. Even some screws on the vintage Grand and King Seiko watches I've serviced have been very soft and if you tighten them like I would a screw in a typical Swiss movement, they would snap...

Cheers, Al
 
ikeo1
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Good read... From collector to owner to hobbyist.
 
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Archer Archer
......if you tighten them like I would a screw in a typical Swiss movement, they would snap...l

That's a Japanese Rube Goldberg torque wrench. 馃槣
 
Df13
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It's amazing how the Swiss watch industry has created this lore about vertical integration. Delco Remy, who made things like alternators for GM, was in the town where I grew up, and they were owned by GM. I never thought to brag about the in-house alternator in my crappy Chevy Cavalier when I was 16 years old. It was actually one of the first things that I had to replace in the car. 馃憤
 
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